Help a beginner pick a kit.

Major Sights

Major Sights

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So I was originally drawn to precision rifles by movies like "Enemy @ the Gates", and "Shooter", as I liked it as it differed so greatly than the other aspect to war, which was just blast away at the general area of your foe. This led me to online gaming (which lead to my pun screen name "Major_Sights".... yes I know, lame... :p

But now, that just doesn't cut it. I want the real thing and I wanna reach out and hit my target. I have done lots of reading online and realize that it isn't just point and click. I am not mall ninja that want's a "Sniper rifle" I just want a black (just hate the look of wood is all.) bolt action rifle that is accurate enough for me to start out on.

I am drawn to the Remington 700 series rifles, but more specifically the SPS versions.

I believe I have it narrowed down to either the:
SPS
700SPS-prod.ashx

or
SPS Tactical
700SPS_Tac_silo-prod.ashx


in .223, as I am unable to reload (at this time, gotta study up first), and the ammo in a lot cheaper than the .308. Also, As my current range is only about 200-300y long, I will just be overkilling the paper with a .308 I feel at that range.

Which do you pros feel is the better starter?

I was also leaning towards a Vortex Crossfire 4-16x50 AO Mil Dot Illumintated (MOA) and matching Vortex rings to put on top, and a lower cost bi-pod (NcStar comes to mind, but I don't overly like their products...). Again this is my first precision rifle and its just meant to be an introduction to the discipline. I can always upgrade along the way (or just buy more guns :D )


Also is there any books, websites, iPhone apps and other literature that you could recommend that would help me start off, would be greatly appreciated. I am still hazy on the whole MOA deal and changing your turrets from range to range. I have only ever really sighted in a scope at one range and guessed my hold over/under to make the shot and that was only on a .22.

Thanks to all who have some info for me.

Regards~
Sights
 
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i would go with the 223 sps tactical with a 1 in 9 twist vortex is a good choice of scope but i would go to a higher power 6x20 or 8 to 25.cant hit what you cant see and you can always turn it down.and x2 with what maynard said about an intro day good luck
 
Go and buy your gun, get shooting and have fun. You have approached this from a well thought out and practical perspective. An SPS varmint or tactical is a great platform. It will shoot well as it comes out of the box, and these guns are infinitely upgradable. Remember the action you are using is no different that the one used on the M24 sniper weapons system. It is strong, it is reliable and it is safe.

If there is a gun accessory or after market part available to jape up your rifle, it will be made for a short-actioned Remington.

Load up and get 'er done!
 
Have you thought about a 5r? A bit different, you won't find it on the Remington website. Black, green and stainless, and available in .223....
 
I can't comment on the rifle. I'm a Savage kind of guy.

As for glass. You might want to pick a little higher end scope to start out on. If you want to get into the "sniper" thing then you will need something that will track well. By that I mean when you adjust your turrets to compensate for bullet drop then go back to your "zero" it actually goes back to your original "zero". If it doesn't you will have major headaches.

I would look at a Vortex Viper 6.5-20 x 44 or 50. I have one and it has proven to be very good for the price.

I would look into a Versa-Pod Bipod. You really don’t want to spend money on something that is cheaply made and won’t be solid. If you buy a versa-pod make sure it has the cant friction adjustment.

Next comes hand loading. Its fine to shoot factory ammo for a while. If you find something that your rifle likes then its perfectly fine. Hand loading in my opinion is the way to go. You can make a load work for your rifle. Again with loading equipment, if you think your going to like precision shooting you should invest in quality reloading equipment. I’ve almost replaced all my original loading gear and I’ve only been loading for a year.


Here is my rifle. I sort of got into this for the same reasons as you. Shooter is a good movie.:cool:

Its a Savage Model 12 LRPV chambered in 204 ruger. (picked up from cabelas on sale for $900)
Scope is a Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50 (around $500)
Versa-pod bipod.

Picture4246.jpg
 
So I am planning on doing the intro day with my father in law and my brother. Just gotta find out what day it is. I will most likely be picking up a rifle before hand as I will be using either way. Trying to keep it around a grand so the upgrade on the scope will be later.

Any advice on literature or tips?
 
K0na_stinky said:
Thanks alot.

I picked it up locally. I can't remember what the price was but it wasn't that cheap. Might have been $135.

Most definitely worth it though.
Click to expand...

The look of the Versa-Pod Bipod is much better than the Harris bipod I don't like the springs on the Harris.
 
So I was looking at the scope a bit more and see that the Turrets are a "Tall Capped". Does this mean I have to remove the caps as use a coin or flat-head screwdriver to make adjustments? If so, is there upgrade-able "lids" I can install so I just turn a knob without dismantling or is this just a feature of the next higher up scopes?
 
Major Sights said:
So I was looking at the scope a bit more and see that the Turrets are a "Tall Capped". Does this mean I have to remove the caps as use a coin or flat-head screwdriver to make adjustments? If so, is there upgrade-able "lids" I can install so I just turn a knob without dismantling or is this just a feature of the next higher up scopes?
Click to expand...

You guys just ignoring the newb because he's a he newb? :D

Would still love some more info and advice.
 
Generally yes. You would have to remove the caps and use something flat. There are some scopes that allow aftermarket adjustment caps but I have not seen many. If you want adjustable turrets, get something with them straight off the bat. There are decent scopes out there with these options in the 3-5 hundred dollar range. Worth saving an extra month for.
 
I started out with a .223 SPS with the heavy barrel, hogue stock, i think that it is the one in your picture. GREAT GUN! I picked up a Millet TRS1 mildot scope for it and have found that it is really easy to play with and it has decent glass, as well as target turrets so you don't have to remove (lose) the caps while sighting in. I bought the packedge at wholesale for about $1050 after tax. X2 on not getting a ####ty bi-pod, i have a harris 9-27 so I can sit crosslegged in a field and shoot gophpers comfortably all day. I reload though, and for the amount that I get out and shoot, I would get the 308 as it is maybe $0.20 more (if you start reloading) a shot and that much more fun when you hit gophers targets etc, and then you aren't limited to 5-600 yards with a .223 when you really want to start learning how to shoot long distance. Good luck on your purchase!
 
Major Sights....
My first "sniper rifle" was the Rem700 SPS 20" Tactical in .308 with a Falcon Menance 4-14EMD scope, Harris bi-pod, Badger oversized bolt handle.
IMO the package looked good and performed well. However, I found .308 a little overkill for shooting paper at 100yrds and quickly concluded it could get expensive as I don't reload.
Ended up "selling" it and picked up the same rifle in .223 with a Bushnell Tactical 10x scope. The fixed power scope works great! It's light, reasonably priced and suits my shooting requirements.
You could save some coin by not buying a bi-pod and using a sandbag.
 
Major Sights said:
So I was looking at the scope a bit more and see that the Turrets are a "Tall Capped". Does this mean I have to remove the caps as use a coin or flat-head screwdriver to make adjustments? If so, is there upgrade-able "lids" I can install so I just turn a knob without dismantling or is this just a feature of the next higher up scopes?
Click to expand...

If you look at the pics on vortex's site you can see what the turrets look like.

They are "Target Style" or "tactical style" turrets. You can read them while laying behind the rifle. You turn them with your fingers not with a coin. They do have screw on caps. I think that is a nice feature because you know they will never change in transport or get bumped in the field.

I have a CrossFire 6-24x50. For the $230 I paid for it, it is just fine. The glass is nice and clear to about 20 power and a slight fog appears after 20 power. You can still see what you need to see at 24 power though.
 
1) First get yourself a copy of "The accurate rifle". This will explain some fundamentals to you so you understand why your rifle and ammo is accurate.

2) I'm going to second the Remington 5R.

I'd go with .308 not .223. Yes I know it goes against what a lot have said here. The .308 has a slow push instead of a snap. With a heavier tactical style rifle the recoil isn't an issue. Here's the other reason. Wind. The .223/5.56 gets pushed around a lot with conventional twist barrels and bullet weights. Another factor I've found with .223 is that it's harder to find good target ammo and the prices aren't cheap. Most 223 ammo off the shelf is crap. Most likely you'll have to reload with .223. With .308 you can usually find off the shelf match ammo that will work with the rifle you've chosen. It's not cheap but it's available.

The 5R doesn't really look entirely like a "tactical" rifle. It's bead blasted stainless with a black and green webbed. It has a nice 24" barrel with the 5R rifling and it's a varmint contour (Read the accurate rifle for the advantages of a bull barrel). Theoretically 20" may be better for shorter distance accuracy, however I've found 24" to be excellent with the .308 round. This also gives you enough velocity for 175 grain ammo to shoot further out. More importantly the 1:11.25 twist with the 24" barrel is a perfect mach for 168 Federal Gold ammo. So results with off the shelf ammo. Reload later, but at least you can get shooting now with excellent results.

3) The scope. I have Zeiss Conquest on a number of my rifles, NF on a couple as well. Even a few Leupold on some high end .22LR rifles and Falcon on others. That being said, I'd go with the Sightron SIII 6-24x for this type of rifle. Reviews have been excellent. I need another scope for a tan coloured 5R I have and the SIII will probably be my next scope.

There's a debate right now with one piece bases vs two piece and Remington rifles. I've had good results with both. There are advantages and disadvantages to both. Overall two piece would be my preference if the scope is going to be dedicated and you didn't need extra MOA adjustment.

Now, regardless of which rifle you go with, scope etc. Get yourself an accurate .22LR with scope and match ammo. Shoot during the winter for groups. You'll be able to take what you learn from this to the centerfire rifle and it won't cost anywhere near as much.
 
Epoxy I know what your saying about the .308. but until I do (and given permission by the land owner [AKA, Father...] some range upgrades, such as cutting some bush down to get the 300-600y range I would like I am just stuck to 280 and the .223 will be more economical at this point (before reloading my own). Which means I can get lots more practice with my .223, and when its time to move up to a 308. I can save on ammo as I will be hitting what I desire more often. I have a fairly accurate .22 (Savage Mk II) just need to upgrade the scope on it, however I am currently getting decent groups at 50y
IMG_0430.jpg
IMG_0433.jpg


I am debating to sell off one hobby (or most of one) to fund this project as that hobby is just really collecting and letting it collect dust... not very interactive...


As for a scope I was hoping to keep it under 250, but then I realized that is kinda redundant, so I bumped up my *FIRST* scope purchase limit to about 500.

Keeping in mind that my range is only 280-300 and using .223 would this be a good choice for a scope?

FALCON 4-14X44 EMD
FalconM14EMD.jpg


MAGNIFICATION RANGE 4-14x
FIELD OF VIEW @ 100y 28.5 - 7.9ft
EYE RELIEF @14x 98mm / 3.86in
TOTAL ELEVATION ADJUSTMENT RANGE 26.0MRAD
ADJUSTMENT VALUE PER CLICK 0.1MRAD
ADJUSTMENT PER TURN 6.0MRAD
RETICLE CHOICES EMD (Enhanced Mil Dot Reticle)
RETICLE INSTALL First Focal

TOTAL LENGTH 338mm / 13.31in
WEIGHT 750g / 26.5oz
TUBE DIAMETER 30mm / 1.18in
CONSTRUCTION 1 Piece Tube/Saddle/Objective
OBJECTIVE LENS DIAMETER 44mm / 1.73in
OUTER OBJECTIVE DIAMETER 52mm / 2.05in
OUTER OCULAR DIAMETER 43mm / 1.69in

ADDITIONAL SUNSHADES 2 Supplied
FLIP UP LENS COVERS Yes, Supplied
 
As one other poster already replied, checkout the Vortex Viper 6.5-20X50 for an entry level scope. I have had one for several years and I love it. It tracks very well, always returns to zero, has very decent glass and clarity is good too. At $500 you really can't go wrong with it. And the warranty is unbeatable too.
 
First, go back and read post #2 of this thread.

Now if a factory rifle is what you are after, and your heart is set on a .223 (nothing wrong with that) check out the Savage 12 F/TR. First off it comes with a 1:7" twist. This will allow you to shoot up to 90 gr bullets. An 80 gr .223 bullet gives up nothing to a 155 gr bullets fired out of a .308 when the wind is blowing, in fact the .223 might have a slight advantage. Come ups from 300-1000 yards are about the same.
 
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