Comments of 260 Remington Cailber

[Gatehouse]

E=MV/2G

Or at least from my High school physics. It's been a long time but if nit picking is what counts I'll try to make sure everything is as correct as I can make it.

If you are going to base an argument on energy calculations, then you should at the very least understand how energy is calculated. You don't (or didn't) know, so you look foolish.


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The Elk you described shot with the plate ringer at 600yds, took 15 seconds to die. If a wounded moose shot at 300yds with a 260 can live for at least 15 seconds, it will cover 360 feet at a light trot of 15MPH, thats 120yds, through thick cover here in the east. Alot of animal may get shot at dsisatnce, but the animal themselves espicially white tail try to stay with few leaps of cover. Ever look for a wounded deer in thickets.

Too funny....You think that the west coast rain forest JUNGLE I often hunt in is any less thick than your area? They may drop on the spot or they may go a distance. With proper shot placement, animals will die, and you just gotta go find them. 3 of the longest tracking jobs I have had (about 50-100 yards) were with a 300 magnum, 375 Ruger and a 7mm Remington Magnum. On the other hand, these cartridges have also dropped animals in their tracks. For that matter, the bear I shot with a .223 dropped in it's tracks....so there is no definite cartridge that ALWAYS drops animals rigth there... Learning tracking skills may be an important lesson for you.

If the 260 and the 300 are on the shelf i'll take the latter to insure extra horsepower to take the game I may only be presented with once in the whole season.

Good choice for that application. As I said before, the larger cartridges do open up more options for the hunter. Using a completely adequate but less powerful cartridge simply means that you have to pick your shots carefully or walk away. Different people hunt for different reasons.

I'm sure you are a good hunter and marksman. Maybe your ga,e is taken in the west where the wounded animal would have to cover 2 km's to get out of view.
Here, they disappear very quickly and can be difficult to find without entrance and exit holes.

One of the beautiful things about the .260 and a good bullet is that you have both entrance and exit holes.

As to the part that I can't do basic math to determine energy, an attack on me personally, by someone in a discussion over ballistics and Rifle attributes, is not called for. If my arguement has no validity, I would never resort to a personal attack. I've seen it done in face to face encounters and its not pretty. Stick to whats on the table, both sides of the line drwan down the middle where we get to put our ideas, and its all good.

I am sure you are able to do basic math, it is simply that you were ignorant of the correct formula to do this math.

 

[RememberTheSomme]

If you are going to base an argument on energy calculations, then you should at the very least understand how energy is calculated. You don't (or didn't) know, so you look foolish.


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Too funny....You think that the west coast rain forest JUNGLE I often hunt in is any less thick than your area? They may drop on the spot or they may go a distance. With proper shot placement, animals will die, and you just gotta go find them. 3 of the longest tracking jobs I have had (about 50-100 yards) were with a 300 magnum, 375 Ruger and a 7mm Remington Magnum. On the other hand, these cartridges have also dropped animals in their tracks. For that matter, the bear I shot with a .223 dropped in it's tracks....so there is no definite cartridge that ALWAYS drops animals rigth there... Learning tracking skills may be an important lesson for you.



Good choice for that application. As I said before, the larger cartridges do open up more options for the hunter. Using a completely adequate but less powerful cartridge simply means that you have to pick your shots carefully or walk away. Different people hunt for different reasons.



One of the beautiful things about the .260 and a good bullet is that you have both entrance and exit holes.



I am sure you are able to do basic math, it is simply that you were ignorant of the correct formula to do this math.

Well now I'm ignorant as well I learned that formula in Grade 10 Physics 1975. When were you first introduced to it?

I showed the two variables in the equation leaving out the constant. The constant is always the same ,thats why it's called a constant. The formula as stated was to show what two variables decide energy which in turn on a given frontal area, determines penetration. If its 64.4 or 2056 it will still produce an answer of the same quanitative ratio. 2 times more energy, 50% more energy etc etc. Not to give distorted higher values on my side.
If this is how you try win your arguement, then I say it's a baloney way to skirt the data and actual experiences with both, as we both present them.

If you are to quote me in the future Gate, please quote the whole post so as not to have sentences taken out of context by accident, and responded to at length.
I hate it when I have to keep backing to the original post to see the whole context of the highlighted quote. While the option is avaliable, it's much easier to see the two conflicting points on the same page in their entireties.

 

[Gatehouse]

Well now I'm ignorant as well I learned that formula in Grade 10 Physics 1975. When were you first introduced to it?

Yes, you are (or were) ignorant of the formula. You said this:

Mass X velocity equals ENERGY

You are wrong. Period.

If this is how you try win your arguement, then I say it's a baloney way to skirt the data and actual experiences with both, as we both present them.

I'm not trying to *win* an argument, I am just presenting facts. If you put a bullet through the lungs of an animal, it will die. And a .260 (and many, many other cartridges with less properly calculated energy than a 300 Win Mag) will do the job.

It's pretty simple....Holes in lungs = no oxygen to brain = dead animal. That is about as basic a "formula" you can get.

 

[358 BLR]

Boy, oh boy, oh boy..... all these people arguing ballistics and you can't even get your energy calculations straight. So here's a little primer.

m = mass of an object
v = velocity of an object
c = the speed of light
KE = Kinetic Energy (the energy of an object as a function of it's mass and it's velocity) KE = 1/2(mass x velocity x velocity), or 1/2(m x v(squared))
We're all familiar with Kinetic Energy.

P = Momentum = mass x velocity (The conservation of momentum makes this important in calculating recoil)

And finally E=mcc or m x c(squared) is the Energy you would get if the mass of an object is converted into Energy.

The first two, "KE" (Kinetic Energy) and "P" (Momentum) are of interest to shooting enthusiasts. the third one "E" has no place unless you're shooting
some real kick ass bullets.

 

[two-dogs]

Boy, oh boy, oh boy..... all these people arguing ballistics and you can't even get your energy calculations straight. So here's a little primer.

m = mass of an object
v = velocity of an object
c = the speed of light
KE = Kinetic Energy (the energy of an object as a function of it's mass and it's velocity) KE = 1/2(mass x velocity x velocity), or 1/2(m x v(squared))
We're all familiar with Kinetic Energy.

P = Momentum = mass x velocity (The conservation of momentum makes this important in calculating recoil)

And finally E=mcc or m x c(squared) is the Energy you would get if the mass of an object is converted into Energy.

The first two, "KE" (Kinetic Energy) and "P" (Momentum) are of interest to shooting enthusiasts. the third one "E" has no place unless you're shooting
some real kick ass bullets.

oh boy, I'm totally lost here! Is that Algebra stuff? I only made it to Gr-8, well was in Gr-9, but got kicked out for good 1/2 way through the yr.

 

[Kelly Timoffee]

What's gonna wind up happening here is some of us are going to be learning and extra physics.Turn us into professors............................well some of us maybe, others like myself are beyond help.

 

[358 BLR]

If you're really nice to me, I'll teach you guy's how to read and write as well.

 

[kamlooky]

Don't know about all this pie are square and cakes are round stuff.
Load'em up, put the cross hairs where they belong and booooom drt.
Funny with the Gatehouse character...................
I just zip right by his posts as there is waaaaay too much hostility there.
Seems the chap/chaperette likes to argue up/down no matter if the sky is blue
today.
Yep Gatehouse, I'm refering to you.
Have at'er..........

 

[358 BLR]

I suppose I should get this back on topic, since I've contributed my share off topic already.
Yes, I think the 260 Rem is a great cartridge, but I also like the 6.5x55, the 270 Win, the 7mm-08, the 280 Rem, the 30-06 and the list goes on and on.
Do I think the 260 Rem is a good hunting cartridge? Well, the Europeans seemed to have already established that with 6.5x55 over the past 100 years,
or so. And yes I realize the 260 Rem and the 6.5x55 aren't exactly the same, but they are comparable. Also, the 260 Rem has good long range capabilities,
but that would have a lot to do with rifle and the load (not to mention the shooter). So in a nutshell, I think the 260 Rem is a good round for hunting,
within it's limitations of course and it has good long range potential. What's not to like?

 

[mg4201]

me personaly

given all the above arguments I would go with 260rem or 6.5x55. mostly because of the lighter recoil. I think that most if not all hunters could benefit from less recoil and more practice. the recoil of the 300 win mag is IMHO too much for the casual shooters that most hunters are. If you simply must have a 30 cal then .308 is a cartridge that is never a bad choice in NA.

 

[AlexF]

We demand .277, .284 or .308 entry holes in our game

given all the above arguments I would go with 260rem or 6.5x55. mostly because of the lighter recoil. I think that most if not all hunters could benefit from less recoil and more practice. the recoil of the 300 win mag is IMHO too much for the casual shooters that most hunters are. If you simply must have a 30 cal then .308 is a cartridge that is never a bad choice in NA.

I agree with the point that recoil kills accuracy for most hunters. The maximum acceptable recoil something like the M1 Garand dishes out:
30-06 150gr 2800fps in 9.5lbs rifle.
The success of 270 Win and 7 Rem Mag is that they get as good or better performance than 30-06 while a similar or lower recoil.

As for the caliber itself, 7mm Rem Mag destroyed 264 Win Mag and 7mm-08 Rem will crush 260 Rem, that's how it works in North America.
As North Americans, we demand .277, .284 or .308 entry holes in our game, nothing less !!! Especially not a "tiny" .264 hole

6.5 mm caliber are great target rounds and will stay that way for a long time in North America because of existing larger and better hunting calibers.

Alex

 

[Gatehouse]

Don't know about all this pie are square and cakes are round stuff.
Load'em up, put the cross hairs where they belong and booooom drt.
Funny with the Gatehouse character...................
I just zip right by his posts as there is waaaaay too much hostility there.
Seems the chap/chaperette likes to argue up/down no matter if the sky is blue
today.
Yep Gatehouse, I'm refering to you.
Have at'er..........

In person I speak directly. I post the same way on CGN. If this upsets you, then perhaps use the *IGNORE* feature of CGN if you don't wish to read my posts.

 

[kamlooky]

I suppose I should get this back on topic, since I've contributed my share off topic already.
Yes, I think the 260 Rem is a great cartridge, but I also like the 6.5x55, the 270 Win, the 7mm-08, the 280 Rem, the 30-06 and the list goes on and on.
Do I think the 260 Rem is a good hunting cartridge? Well, the Europeans seemed to have already established that with 6.5x55 over the past 100 years,
or so. And yes I realize the 260 Rem and the 6.5x55 aren't exactly the same, but they are comparable. Also, the 260 Rem has good long range capabilities,
but that would have a lot to do with rifle and the load (not to mention the shooter). So in a nutshell, I think the 260 Rem is a good round for hunting,
within it's limitations of course and it has good long range potential. What's not to like?

Just to toss a bone into this mix, how does the 25-06 fit into the scheme of this mix here?
I'm not asking for a whole bunch of algerbra, just some good horse
sense.
We own a 6.5X55 in a Mauser 98 action with a bull barrel and this thing is deadly accurate. Couple of 308's which are our go to deer rifles and the big brother to them, the 308 Norma Mag which is my favorite.

 

[kamlooky]

You can use the *IGNORE* feature of CGN if you don't wish to read my posts.

As for one who thinks other's can't ready, I use the zippy factor with you.
Mouse with the free wheel'in spool.
Works just formadubbly.

 

[Gatehouse]

Just to toss a bone into this mix, how does the 25-06 fit into the scheme of this mix here?
I'm not asking for a whole bunch of algerbra, just some good horse
sense.
We own a 6.5X55 in a Mauser 98 action with a bull barrel and this thing is deadly accurate. Couple of 308's which are our go to deer rifles and the big brother to them, the 308 Norma Mag which is my favorite.

Then you don't need a 25-06 unless you want one.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

Just to toss a bone into this mix, how does the 25-06 fit into the scheme of this mix here?
I'm not asking for a whole bunch of algerbra, just some good horse
sense.
We own a 6.5X55 in a Mauser 98 action with a bull barrel and this thing is deadly accurate. Couple of 308's which are our go to deer rifles and the big brother to them, the 308 Norma Mag which is my favorite.

It's one that works for me

 

[kamlooky]

Then you don't need a 25-06 unless you want one.

Again more non-sense.......
I already own one......

 

[Gatehouse]

Again more non-sense.......
I already own one......

Congratulations.

 

[martinbns]

Just to toss a bone into this mix, how does the 25-06 fit into the scheme of this mix here?
I'm not asking for a whole bunch of algerbra, just some good horse
sense.
We own a 6.5X55 in a Mauser 98 action with a bull barrel and this thing is deadly accurate. Couple of 308's which are our go to deer rifles and the big brother to them, the 308 Norma Mag which is my favorite.

25-06 uses more powder, produces better velocities with lighter bullets with BC's not as good as those in the 6.5 mm category.

It also lacks the larger bullets suitable for larger game, but lots of guys stack piles of animals every year.

 

[358 BLR]

Just to toss a bone into this mix, how does the 25-06 fit into the scheme of this mix here?
I'm not asking for a whole bunch of algerbra, just some good horse
sense.
We own a 6.5X55 in a Mauser 98 action with a bull barrel and this thing is deadly accurate. Couple of 308's which are our go to deer rifles and the big brother to them, the 308 Norma Mag which is my favorite.

I have no actual experience with the 25-06 and I have never really researched the cartridge, so I could only offer an ill-informed opinion at best. But a .25
caliber bullet on top of a 30-06 case, I'd imagine it would rival the .243 Win as a flat shooter and probably just as hard on barrels as the .243 as well. I have
come across quite a few owner's of the 25-06 and they all seem to think very highly of the cartridge, which is about as high a praise as a cartridge can get.

As for horse sense: Never lift the tail of a horse that's been eating Exlax.
Also, 2+2=4.2 when the GST is taken into account.