S&W 44 rusian double action perscribed antique?
- Thread starter demencuik
- Start date
FRT says that all frames were made prior to 1899. It also says that the 54,668 were made until 1913.
Your link doesn't say anything in regards to prior 1898 which will satisfy CFC/CBSA.
I would be very careful.
You can always get a letter from S&W with the exact date but that takes time and may not be satisfactory.
tactical870
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Buckhorn, Ontario
My understanding is that all the frames are antique regardless of the date the gun was assembled and sold....
Since you are saying that, I am wondering how your Wells Fargo S&W 44 DA got the RCMP letter with serial number over 52,000?
.
Because the cut off is Above my guns ser # thats obvious! but below the 54600 or what ever are made. What you think im makeing this stuff up. LOL
Its not hard to find the cut off for any gun just call CFC i cant remember the exact Number off the top of my head thats why i wont post it.
By the way the information you posted about the FRT # could be wrong theres a diffrent FRT # for each barrel length and caliber haveing a diffrent FRT # so unless you know his barrel length you could be giveing him incorrect information.
OP you should Phone a Tec at CFC to get the real info thats what i do you cant go off whats posted here way to many guys here think they know everything when you look into it there wrong more than right.
in fairness things change at CFC all the time as they find new info on certin guns so best advise is to call and check before buying a gun your not certin on.
Last edited:
They don't update antique FRT.
All 44 Russian DA are under one FRT.
If you know better, why do you not just give the guy a straight answer, only after I ask you?
\
I dont know the exact cut off.
I just call and ask is this one OK they say yes or no.
Your wrong about FRT # to theres several for the S&W DA models.
there called
Top break no 3 double action new models aint that a mouth full
theres frt #s theses are for the 44 Russian
44864-7
44864-1
44864-2
each one for a diffrent barrel length and theres more to.
I get my FRT#s from a CFC tec
The number you gave him is useless if he does and online application.
You need the - and last number to do a online application for a rcmp letter.
I just find like reloading info its best to watch the info you give make sure its right or its not helpfull is it.
And saying they dont update antique FRTs well how long you been at this ???
The S&W DA antique cut off used to be 42000 6 years ago now its above 52000 they change the info all the time.
By the way a brand new FRT # was just made for a gun i bought last week its antique and the RCMP made a FRT # just for that gun for me because it did not exist in there data base. so theres and update for you
If a new gun is found that doesnt exist in there info they will make up a FRT number for it so you can get a letter tho that doesnt happen offten it shows they do edit change things all the time.
If someone wants a cut off # call CFC
Im not gona say some guns antique on a guess and have some guy end up with a seizure.
And Remember guys by law you dont even need a RCMP letter just make sure the guns a antique.
I find most guys like to have a letter with there guns tho.
So the cutoff number is 54,667, no?
A phone call to CFC @ the RCMP lab in Ottawa will answer any question specific to your gun in about 5 minutes maximum. Their information is all that counts. A letter from a manufacturer may or may not be correct as far as CFC is concerned, and that's the only source that you can rely on to be correct in Canada.
If one thinks CFC is wrong they can be challenged, and as far as I'm concerned the techs like to get new updates on the info they have on file. Any additions/alterations etc. that they get will be added to the next FRT disc when it is released.
The 54,667 refers to prior 1899, the cut off date for Canada is 1898 in case you didn't know that.
So you are saying that a letter form the manufacturer doesn't count? Hmm.
As Dingus said said above the cut off is 52,600 now, I answered to my best knowledge and the FRT doesn't say anything about a cut off number and they only update the antiques once in a while. Most don't have any info at all, just classed as prohibited or restricted with the remark that some manufactured prior 1898 are antique.
Just look at the Belgian guns for example, CFC doesn't have a straight line and goes case by case, some ELG with a crown above have antique letter, some are prohibited or restricted. Even new cases from this year, nothing about those guns in the FRT, just case by case.
I dont know the exact cut off.
I just call and ask is this one OK they say yes or no.
Your wrong about FRT # to theres several for the S&W DA models.
there called
Top break no 3 double action new models aint that a mouth full
theres frt #s theses are for the 44 Russian
44864-7
44864-1
44864-2
each one for a diffrent barrel length and theres more to.
I get my FRT#s from a CFC tec
The number you gave him is useless if he does and online application.
You need the - and last number to do a online application for a rcmp letter.
I just find like reloading info its best to watch the info you give make sure its right or its not helpfull is it.
And saying they dont update antique FRTs well how long you been at this ???
The S&W DA antique cut off used to be 42000 6 years ago now its above 52000 they change the info all the time.
By the way a brand new FRT # was just made for a gun i bought last week its antique and the RCMP made a FRT # just for that gun for me because it did not exist in there data base. so theres and update for you
If a new gun is found that doesnt exist in there info they will make up a FRT number for it so you can get a letter tho that doesnt happen offten it shows they do edit change things all the time.
If someone wants a cut off # call CFC
Im not gona say some guns antique on a guess and have some guy end up with a seizure.
And Remember guys by law you dont even need a RCMP letter just make sure the guns a antique.
I find most guys like to have a letter with there guns tho.
Your information is incomplete when it comes to the FRT, there are more subclasses than you mention and he didn't mention barrel length and other info, so with FRT 44864 you have all the info right there.
44864-1 prohibited barrel length 102 mm
44864-6 antique barrel length 102 mm
44864-5 antique barrel length 127 mm
44864-2 restricted barrel length 127 mm
44864-3 restricted barrel length 152 mm
44864-7 antique barrel length 152 mm
44864-4 restricted barrel length 165 mm
the 44864-2 and 44864-1 you mention above are all not antique due to age as already outlined.
I must admit that I emailed CFC with a question and used the email address above in the sticky since many member here said that they won't answer the phone anymore. I got a reply 3 weeks later that they don't understand my answer. I replied back with a very specific question and haven't received an answer back for 2 weeks now. I guess email won't work.
I will try to call next time and hope that I will have the same success and help as Dingus received.
Personal word to Dingus: Next time please share your info, all the guy asked was a simple cut off number which you didn't share in your first reply.
I challenged you since I saw that the S&W DA Wells Fargo has SN 52### (gunbroker auction) and then the info came out.
I also agree that 52,600 makes a lot sense as cut off number since all frames were made prior to 1899, so we just have to go one year back and that's easy enough to calculate. The assembly date doesn't count, the manufacturing is important as outlined in the law.
Thanks.
.
This was your earlier post ^
Now read your last couple your all over the place.
Now they Do change antique FRTs
All 44 Da are NOT all under one FRT#
Now you You have more FRT#s numbers than me and im holding back info LOL
If you read my post i said there were more #s i dont have them tho.
I never said the cut off was 52600 i said i called and asked if my guns was antique and they said yes.
Where did i say that it was 52600 ? not in this thread maby some old thread but if i did thats not 100% correct as i dont know the exact number.
I dont like giveing out info like that that changes from time to time.
Do you know the exact cut off now ?
Last edited:
It's good to know that the cut off number is way higher than what most people thought so far, higher than It would be nice if they would include it in the FRT table.
Anyway, the FRT number is 44864, no matter which of the sub numbers you put in the FRT search function, the main number 44864 plus all the above mentioned sub numbers will show up.
Last edited by a moderator:
The 54,667 refers to prior 1899, the cut off date for Canada is 1898 in case you didn't know that.
Wow! Thanks, it's a bad day when you don't learn something.
So you are saying that a letter form the manufacturer doesn't count? Hmm.
That's correct. Some manufacturers are more reliable than others, eg. some started new number series every year, some may have changed serial number sequences with model changes and etc. Information obtained on the web and sometimes from manufacturers can be misleading, and being merely human we have a tendency to believe the info that suits our purpose. CFC only accepts information that they can document clearly, often from a first person source or one which is known to be reliable.
As Dingus said said above the cut off is 52,600 now, I answered to my best knowledge and the FRT doesn't say anything about a cut off number and they only update the antiques once in a while. Most don't have any info at all, just classed as prohibited or restricted with the remark that some manufactured prior 1898 are antique.
Just look at the Belgian guns for example, CFC doesn't have a straight line and goes case by case, some ELG with a crown above have antique letter, some are prohibited or restricted. Even new cases from this year, nothing about those guns in the FRT, just case by case.
That's correct. Some, but very few early Belgian makers did keep accurate and verifiable records re d.o.m. and caliber.
tactical870
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Buckhorn, Ontario
No good can come of discussions like this.....
...
