I was just wondering if a webley mark 1 converted to .45acp safe to shoot the modern ammunition or is the conversion just done because of the ready supply of .45acp brass? I don't know a whole lot about antique fire arms and am just trying to figure out what would be a good buy.
webley MK1
- Thread starter cliface
- Start date
I don't think it would be a good idea. I have read that the strap (or what ever you want to call the piece that holds the chamber and firing pin area closed) cannot take the excessive pressures that the 45acp will produce. You would be better off re-loading with lead and lower pressure loads.
Here is yet another voice to add to the chorus....generally speaking it is not safe and over all a bad idea to shoot modern 45 acp ammo in a blackpowder proofed Webley. If your thinking about antiques seriously think about reloading.
Nobody can answer that question with authority. Some commercial rounds are too hot.
Think black powder pressures and velocities. That's what the gun was made for.
Most who want to shoot them use tailored reloads made to protect the gun from pressures higher than it was designed for.
tactical870
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Buckhorn, Ontario
I like this quote from the article cited above:
Yup... that about sums it up. If you want to play with antiques, you have to learn to reload, there's no ifs or buts about it.
A 5gr load of Unique behind a 200 gr .452 cast bullet in a 45 ACP case is what does it for .45ACP-converted Webleys. Running factory loads through them is suicide, at least for your hands! (and obviously for the gun itself)
Yup... that about sums it up. If you want to play with antiques, you have to learn to reload, there's no ifs or buts about it.
A 5gr load of Unique behind a 200 gr .452 cast bullet in a 45 ACP case is what does it for .45ACP-converted Webleys. Running factory loads through them is suicide, at least for your hands! (and obviously for the gun itself)
The .455 Webley cartridge has a maximum pressure rating of about 12,000 psi, while the .45acp has a rating of 18,000 psi. The old Webley MKI and MKII service pistols are designed to handle the webley .455. The pressure from a full power .45acp is 50% over what the pistols were designed for.
On the other hand, many MKI and MKII webleys have fired a lot full power .45acp and haven't blown up yet. It's a robust design and chances are it won't blow up in your face, at least not right away.
It's easy to spot a MKI that have been fed a steady diet of fullpower .45acp because they are loose in the frame hinge and latch. Those 120 year old frames are made from softer steel compared to modern firearms and over-pressure loads stretch the steel in the stress points of the hinge and latch assemblies. Also jacketed bullets will wear out rifling in these soft barrels much faster than soft cast lead bullets for the same reason.
The Webley MKI and MKII .455 / .45acp revolvers are like pressure vessels. If you run them at 150% of design pressure they fail quicker and wear out faster and there is always the possibility of a catastrophic failure.
SO - my answer to your question is: chances are good that full power .45acp will not blow your face off, but it definitely will cause cumulative damage over time and it will wear out your old pistol much faster.
Somewhere around 5.0 gr of Alliant Unique powder with a 250 or 265 gr .455" bullet in a .45acp case will give you fairly close to 12,000 psi, and still give you a very respectable load without damaging the old pistol.
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45 Acp factory in a MKI .
you will shoot the gun loose over time because the latch screw will bend and the front hinge pin will wear.
Them are the two points that take most of the stress.
The cylinder will get loose on its bushing to if you really shoot alot thru them.
The barrel and cylinder can take the presure the frame can to but the weak point is the hinge point and barrel latch.
A MKVI has a redesigned better latch than the earlier webleys had.
I have a MKI** thats a MKI frame with a Upgraded MKV Barrel and cylinder installed i shoot 45 acp factory copper jacketed ammo in it from time to time.
The latch screw is newer so is the front hinge pin. It shows no ill effects from shooting. tho i use the lead bullet stuff most of the time.
If your gun is a Standard MKI or MKII then its best to reload the 5 gr unique loads with lead bullets. Does everyone do that? No they dont.
you will shoot the gun loose over time because the latch screw will bend and the front hinge pin will wear.
Them are the two points that take most of the stress.
The cylinder will get loose on its bushing to if you really shoot alot thru them.
The barrel and cylinder can take the presure the frame can to but the weak point is the hinge point and barrel latch.
A MKVI has a redesigned better latch than the earlier webleys had.
I have a MKI** thats a MKI frame with a Upgraded MKV Barrel and cylinder installed i shoot 45 acp factory copper jacketed ammo in it from time to time.
The latch screw is newer so is the front hinge pin. It shows no ill effects from shooting. tho i use the lead bullet stuff most of the time.
If your gun is a Standard MKI or MKII then its best to reload the 5 gr unique loads with lead bullets. Does everyone do that? No they dont.
I have an auto-loader designed to shoot .45 ACP. The gun was made in 1914 and I have been thinking that I need to take it easy on the old timer. The ammo as far as I know is almost the same as when originally made in terms of pressure and FMJ.
The gun on the other hand is getting old and things have worn out.. the barrel was not spared. The cases bulge and would be hard to reload so I need a new barrel.
Shooting smokeless rounds through a black powder gun should be left to the experts.
The gun on the other hand is getting old and things have worn out.. the barrel was not spared. The cases bulge and would be hard to reload so I need a new barrel.
Shooting smokeless rounds through a black powder gun should be left to the experts.
Anyone who can reload a modern cartridge competently can reload a ,45acp cartridge for use in an antique webley just as competently. It's not witchcraft like some people would have us believe,
Yup...was having some hiccups last night until Ben suggested an improper die set up.
He was right, all was good to go after the 'tardation correction!
The great thing about .45 ACP is that the straight-walled cases are remarkably easy to deal with
, and that a veritable plethora of bullets are available for it....You can basically reload a .45 ACP style cartridge a lot more easily than you could a .455 ........
I shoot .452 Hornady XTP's out of mine.....
Yea..
..I'd be careful about that...
...cast (unjacketed) lead bullets are what I'd recommend....
- Location
- Quesnel B.c
I shoot fiochi 455 mrk 2 out of my webly all the time. I have read alot on it and its ok.
- Location
- Not really sure.
Yeah..... the only factory loads I'll run are .32 rimfire and 8mm lebel revolver, other than that, reloading it is for me with the antique irons.
