mini 14 vs the rest of the black rifles

I haven't heard anyone mention that you can use the mini 14 outside of the rifle range. The beautiful but oh so evil looking black guns are restricted to range use only which sux in my opinion. Same as not being able to target shoot in th local pit with my hand guns.
 
paininthe10 said:
I haven't heard anyone mention that you can use the mini 14 outside of the rifle range. The beautiful but oh so evil looking black guns are restricted to range use only which sux in my opinion. Same as not being able to target shoot in th local pit with my hand guns.
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Not completely correct. The AR is restricted by name.

Swiss Arms PE-90, CX4 storm with non restricted barrel, FN P90 with non restricted barrel, SL8, HK UMP with non restricted barrel, Tavor, ACR, XCR etc aren't restricted providing they have barrels over 18.5".
 
I was in a fighting rifle course last month and the only gun that consistently (and I mean all the damn time) failed was a Mini14. Utter garbage. Just don't buy it.
 
Here is an alternative view.

I picked up a newer stainless mini30 on the ee for about the price of a CZ858 after doing some rather extensive research on the mini series of rifles. I picked the gun mostly because I have a LOT of surplus 7.62x39 that the stainless components won't care much about and the it will be good for banging bush in wet conditions without rusting.

The immediate drawbacks that should be mentioned when compared to most black type rifles are of course the stock configuration and availability of mags. The mags are gonna be pricy and there are aftermarket stocks with pistol grips if you want to go that route. People making comparisons to rifles that cost about 4-5 times what I paid for this one aren't exactly comparing apples to apples, you can get a swiss with NEA lower and take it hunting but after scope mount etc your spending quite a bit of money and are probably gonna do something silly like put velcro on the ejection port to keep it looking pretty. The mini can be used hard with little regret.

Ergonomics: Mag changes are on par with an AK, VZ58, Swiss, M14. You can do fast changes no problem unlike the Benelli MR1 I looked at. Safety is easy to use with the trigger finger although different then the AR/swiss type it destroys the AK in that regard. I'd say as easy to use as an AR and essentially ambi. The rifle has a bolt hold open which is nice so it has that in its favor. Ergonomics aren't in AR territory but they aren't all that bad.

The trigger out of the box is about on par with a factory VZ58 or lower end AR. However with a trigger job these things are beautiful, Honestly I`d say my mini`s trigger is better then the Timney in my AR. We`re talking Savage Accutrigger good.

I think the newer minis are very well balanced, they are light enough up front that they point fast but aren`t so light that control is an issue. As far as pointablity it destroys any XCR or Classic Green, I`d say its comparable to a CZ858 with 18.5 barrel. Actually because the handguard is longer then the CZ I`d say its better for me at least. My Swiss 14.x carbine pointed about the same.

The major reason I bought my mini is that they are easy to mount a scope on. The newer rifles all have the ranch receiver which takes the reasonably priced Ruger rings which are of decent quality. I mounted a flat top picatinny rail to mine which give you more options.

Accuracy has always been the fly in the Mini`s ointment. Older mini`s were 6-7ìnch guns
new mini`s are a whole nuther story. With some minor tweeks getting consistant 1.5-3ìnch groups at 100m is pretty standard. Often I think its the finger behind the trigger that is the issue more so then the gun in front of it. Good ammo and skill make a lot of so called junk guns into solid shooters. Because a lot of new shooters buy mini`s I think the lack of skill in new hands helps with the negative rep. If you shoot average 3 inch groups out of a gun thats good for consistent MOA then you shouldn`t complain about 6inch groups form any semi. My Norc M4 is a tack driver but I`ve invested a lot of time and money on my skill level which is nowhere near pro competition level. I still have off days, that I guess I could blame on the guns.

As a scoped quick little rifle the newer minis are good to go, well worth the money.
 
ESQ said:
I was in a fighting rifle course last month and the only gun that consistently (and I mean all the damn time) failed was a Mini14. Utter garbage. Just don't buy it.
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I was on two courses where the only rifles that consistently failed were XCRs, lots of guys love their XCRs though.
 
The Benelli mr-1 accuracy make forgiveness easy for small detail, no mini cant shoot as thight as a mr-1... JP.
 
caramel said:
The Benelli mr-1 accuracy make forgiveness easy for small detail, no mini cant shoot as thight as a mr-1... JP.
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LOL sure that may be true but its all good and bad points. I`d probably never buy an MR-1 simply cause I don`t like its ergonomics.
 
I'm with Suprathepeg on this one...I've owned pretty much every variant available in canada of the Swiss Arms rifles, at least a half a dozen different variations of the AR15, an XRC, an AR180B, and several different configurations of VZ858. What have I kept? My VZ rifles and a couple of 581 series mini-14/mini-30 rifles. What do I shoot the most? I like my minis the best and definitely enjoy them far more than any of the other rifles mentioned above, even though I keep a couple of them around for posterity.

I also agree with his perspective on accuracy...that most folks who bash them likely have not put enough work into truly understanding what their gun is capable of doing. I can easily hit a man sized silhouette out at 300 yards with my mini-14 (equipped with a non-magnified aimpoint none-the-less), and I can do it from a sitting or crouching position. And since the Benelli MR1 is getting a bit of discussion in this thread I can't resist gloating that I used my inferior mini-14 to clean up on 10 inch steel plates at 100 yards in a direct standing position shootoff against my buddy wringing out what I now call his "tempermental italian princess". That may change as he gets more range time with the benelli, however I suspect it this will only be the case if we're proned out as from field positions the benelli, IMHO handles like a tonne of bricks compared to the lightweight and quick-pointing ranch rifle. The best part was half way through the 50 round string when, in a desperate attempt to salvage his shooting honor, my buddy swapped out his benelli for his 581 series mini scoped with a low power leupold variable. He managed to catch up a bunch, which was just the icing on the cake for me...:)

For me the traditional stock of the mini points better than pistol grip stocked rifles.

Yes, I do shoot my swiss arms classic green better, however it is a rifle that now costs more than 4 (or five if we're talking used prices in the EE) times the cost of the mini, so I too believe the comparison is unfair.

Have I played with a bunch of much higher dollar and "nicer" rifles? You becha. But I keep coming back to my favourite mini...:)

Cheers,

Brobee
 
mebiuspower said:
There's a mini-30 in this video and man what a pain to shoot it.

http://vimeo.com/27795471
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Started to watch @ the 2:12 mark and felt the pain right away. Nothing like Ruger's sub-par over priced & out standing quaility control.
Also if you are plaining on getting a used mini-30 before you start slapping surplus threw it swab the barrel.
Also with the ergo's that suprathepeg be talking about. With 2 add on parts to the VZ 58 platform...
Extended Bolt & Mag Rlease
Blows the doors of this rifle. Also the part about the handguard B.S. well it's just that. If you ever are thinking about a mini :kickInTheNuts: then :slap:. Grow a pair and get the M14. A botched design that SUCKS. The only thing I do agree with Rauch Tactical sorry I mean suprathepeg on is for the fact that the mini serris of rifle stole the M14/M1 Granad design of trigger assembely.
Also Brobee honestly if you had to pick between a mini rifle or an VZ rifle you telling me that there would be any thought about the mini going threw your head? How hard is it to get part's, warrenty work, after market gear and mag's for? with in 300 meter's how hard are they both to shoot? Witch one has given you more issue's with?
Now like I said before lets compare apples to apples. When the KelTec SU16 is released you will see 2 rifles both in the price range of 500 USD on our market that both are piston driven, shoot 223 and come stock looking very similar. Again you will see that the mini cult following praising there rifle or will a lot of people will be switching there faith due to multiple things that the Ruger Mini just won't & can't do.
 
mini's don't group, they pattern.

trigger is brutal. the ruger factory mounts are not great. they need locktite/ nailpolish to keep them on the gun.
 
Mini-14 is a decent gun. Definately one of your cheaper non-restricted options.

Once you shoot anything with AR balance/recoil/ergonomics you will have an AH HAH moment.

As in AH HAH thiiiiis is why the US military switched and can't find a replacement.
 
Warning, ### Content:

Ruger Mini-14 .223 Rifle
All metal parts removed and re-parkerized with greyish black Teflon coating. Installed Clyde Armory SCAR-CQB Stock, Hogue rubber grip, Choate Flash Supressor/Front Sight, 'Har-Bar' barrel stabilizer, Harris bipod rail adapter, Leupold VX-II 1-4x20mm scope, TangoDown rail covers.

pimped_mini14_1.jpg


pimped_mini14_2.jpg


(No affiliation with tacord but I love their work).
 
cadgo said:
Not a chance, not even the old mini-14s.
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Believe it or not. My $200 Norc SKS-D can out shoot my $700 Mini-14.

When I was first looking into them, I ignored guys like me and figure they can't be THAT bad. I was wrong. Dead wrong.

Mini-14's should be a $200-$300 rifle brand new cause they are utter and complete junk.
 
I bought a 581 series Mini 14 and was very pleased with it. I liked the way it handled and the operation was very similar to the other WW2/Korea era rifles I've owned and shot (I'm including the VZ 858, SKS, M1A, M1 Garand, AG42, plus others). Straight out of the box I don't think it was outshined by any of them in the accuracy department and ergonomics were similar.

I sold it though because magazines are too expensive. I had a hard time swallowing a $100 price tag for a steel mag. If I wanted to use it in a 3 gun shoot I'd have to carry 8 magazines which was worth more than the rifle itself. At that time the cheaper plastic mags weren't available and if they were I'd probably still have the rifle.

Unfortunately the Ruger Mini 14 is the only non restricted semi auto mag fed rifle in 223 that's less than $1000 in Canada. The new VZ series rifles in 223 sound promising though and if their mag adapter proves reliable then the Ruger will have some serious competition.
 
Satain said:
Started to watch @ the 2:12 mark and felt the pain right away. Nothing like Ruger's sub-par over priced & out standing quaility control.
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This dude's setup is less than ideal (if he is living in the US, why is he using factory 5 round magazines when there is high availability of factory ruger 20 round mags? If he is living in Canada, he should buck up some coin and import some 5/20 mags.) Additionally, his handling indicates poor familiarity. He needs to practice more.

Satain said:
Also Brobee honestly if you had to pick between a mini rifle or an VZ rifle you telling me that there would be any thought about the mini going threw your head? How hard is it to get part's, warrenty work, after market gear and mag's for? with in 300 meter's how hard are they both to shoot? Witch one has given you more issue's with?
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In shooting more than 30,000 rounds of .223 through my various minis the past 5 years I have had a grand total of a half a dozen FTFs that were caused by issues relating to poor quality control with some of my dillon produced handloads. I have never had a part break, and all I've ever replaced on my rifles are the recoil springs. None of the firing pin issues some folks whine about, no bolt issues, no ejector issues, and no trigger group issues.

I have sent two guns to the factory repair depot in Quebec (a good bunch of guys)...one because I bubba-ed up a barrel when installing my custom made GB lug and one because I f*cked up the gas system by installing a home built replacement gas bushing that was 0.030 too long and caused mis-alignment/binding of the operating rod and the gas piston. I sent it in for repair because I was too stupid to figure out that I had caused the problem (they were very graceful in their revelation of what was wrong too...my ego has mostly recovered! :)). In both cases I had my guns back within 6 weeks and the quality of their work was outstanding.

My regular 7.62x39 VZ rifles have been pretty reliable, other than their irritating tendency to misfeed about 1 in 7 Prvi Partisan lead tipped hunting bullets. Yes, they've been designed for Full Metal Jacket projectiles and with FMJ they work flawlessly, however I like to hunt and it's a bummer they don't feed the exposed lead point stuff reliably. My mini-30 on the other hand has had 500 rounds of the Prvi Partisan hunting stuff through it hitch-free.

The .223 CSA non restricted rifles are another story. I have close to 1500 rounds through two I bought this spring, and they definitely have extraction issues that are ammunition independent (I have no doubt that they are caused by a combination of the extractor design and the increased gas pressure of the .223 round as compared to that of the 7.62x39 round).

Spare parts for the VZ rifles are currently plentiful (so I stocked up) but how long is that going to last? Kinda like the USGI parts for the M14?

Briefly on the topic of the M14/M1a, I love these rifles and thoroughly enjoy shooting mine. That's part of the reason I also like the mini.

As for the mini and accessories...I like my guns pretty spartan and IMHO the mini does not need much along the lines of improvement. The utlimak scout rail is worthy though and has good availability through brownells. On the rail I like to set up a full size 2 moa aimpoint in a factory aimpoint low ring (currently this also has high availability). I replace the front sight with one of my own design (bayo lug/sight block with an M14/M1a NM 0.062 front sight...the sight comes form Brownells and the sight block I have made here in Calgary) and have the barrel threaded 1/2x28 for an A2 flash hider. I have had trouble finding A2 flash hiders recently...but wait that is an AR15 part.

Optics on the VZ platform are ok too....I like (alot) the NEA front rail for the same aimpoint setup I run on my minis, however for magnified optics my opinion is that the mini is easier to scope well than the Czech rifles. Yes NEA makes that strange cantilever mount, however it positions the rings too high for proper cheek weld plus it is my opinion that it looks like cr*p. While rings on the mini set the scope high, they do so less than magnified optics on the Czech rifles.

Magazines for the mini can be somewhat problematic, however if someone is prepared to blow 3.5k$ plus on a swiss arms rifle, for the same money they can also afford to buy a mini and then pay someone to properly import several dozen 5/20 mini magazines. That's what I did.

As for the "cult of the mini"...whatever. :rolleyes: There are just as many religiously vehement mini-haters as there are ranting & raging mini-proponents. Which gun is better? Figure out which one you shoot better and that's it. As there are lots of different people in the world the answer will likely vary from person to person. For me, right now, I shoot my mini better and I also enjoy it more.

So anyway...there's my opinion and guess what...that's all it is...an opinion. Hope it helps the original poster!

Cheers,

Brobee
 
Have a mini 14 target laminate stock, with 55 PMC it's 1" at 100.

The bases are integrated and comes with rings - however swapped them out with Burris rail & signature rings. Enjoyed it enough that trigger tuned, adjustable gas block (brass no longer lands in next postal code), lighter recoil spring and synthetic buffer. At some point when have more time will bed it too.

5 round flush fitting mags are under $30 new (Reliable).

It's not a bench rest rifle (though heavy) but for plinking and varminting works well enough. A few times when I bought other rifles (CX4 non restricted, RFB, 10PC) I thought about selling it but haven't yet.
 
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