Tested out the Norinco 308 ammo today

Satain said:
Vector Optic's won't last to long on any M14. Even with the etech reticale. I have gone threw 4 of them before they told me no more warrenty returns. So the 4th 1 I shot it with my Vortex mounted on my M14. They last about 500rds then pack it in. You will notice your zero start to wander then think it's got to be something else but in the end you will relieze it's the scope. Although they are great for 22's and any other low recoil rifle design. Also I like there optic's selection.
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Maybe your spelling traumatized it? :D

Just kidding ... in all seriousness, though thanks for the head's up.

I will let you know if this one lasts beyond 500. I did put nearly 100 through it on day one, with no hiccups whatsoever.

We shall see ... it does claim to be rated for 50BMG and is built like a brick s**t house. I have a feeling some of their models are distinctly better than others.
 
Gothmog said:
Maybe your spelling traumatized it? :D

Just kidding ... in all seriousness, though thanks for the head's up.

I will let you know if this one lasts beyond 500. I did put nearly 100 through it on day one, with no hiccups whatsoever.

We shall see ... it does claim to be rated for 50BMG and is built like a brick s**t house. I have a feeling some of their models are distinctly better than others.
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Because of the excessive reciprocating mass on the garand action optics get pounded on the load as well as the recoil. This eats up optics which aren't built for jarring in both directions.

The first company to incorporate the size and mag options of the vector into good glass and turrets gets my money.
 
suprathepeg said:
Because of the excessive reciprocating mass on the garand action optics get pounded on the load as well as the recoil. This eats up optics which aren't built for jarring in both directions.

The first company to incorporate the size and mag options of the vector into good glass and turrets gets my money.
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Many of Vector's ideas seem to have origins in Europe ... I note similarities between it and some IOR optics. We may see some of the IOR tactical optics brought in (again) at some point.

Price point of course would be quite different ....

I will let you know if this one craps out early or keeps on running.
 
Wolverine is/was carrying IOR. Quality control, and customer service problems have plagued IOR which combined with their premium priceare the main reason they haven't taken off in North America.
 
I had a nice set of optics on mine, but it was just too heavy, so I abandoned that idea and just use the open sights. I reduced the width of the front blade to .060" and with the Norky rear, I have been able to get some fantastic groups. With a new bolt, oprod, oprod spring, Hornady BTSP, my groups at 100 yds, using nothing but my forearm as a rest, my groups are about 1.5 to 2" on average, with a few flyers. That's why I was surprised at the group you posted at 50 yards.

Maybe your glass is fried already, because with a rest, you should be way tighter than that. I am confident that you are a better shot than the group suggests. ;)
 
sobo4303 said:
I had a nice set of optics on mine, but it was just too heavy, so I abandoned that idea and just use the open sights. I reduced the width of the front blade to .060" and with the Norky rear, I have been able to get some fantastic groups. With a new bolt, oprod, oprod spring, Hornady BTSP, my groups at 100 yds, using nothing but my forearm as a rest, my groups are about 1.5 to 2" on average, with a few flyers. That's why I was surprised at the group you posted at 50 yards.

Maybe your glass is fried already, because with a rest, you should be way tighter than that. I am confident that you are a better shot than the group suggests. ;)
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Actually that group was shot with another rifle using a Bushnell scope, so I don't think that would indicate much about the Vector. :p
 
My mind was made up a while ago... And I'll only run etched recticle optics on my M14 rifles.
At this point my main rig is waiting for a night force. Expensive, yes, but I'll only have to buy it once :D
 
Re-test, comparison, and perhaps found a culprit

Well, I have thought about some of the comments here and decided to re test and compare with some other ammo, in order to try to take the shooter out of the equation to a degree. It's very nice that some of you think I must be capable of better groups, but I am closing in fast on 60, and have let my fitness slack off somewhat over the years ... so when I sit down with a scoped rifle at the bench it seems as though its quite a task to pick my spots between the fairly disruptive heartbeats. And its not always successful, let me tell you ... :D

So, I set about seeing what I could find in the ammo vault, and this is what I came up with:

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Some nice old IVI

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Some Portugese FNM ammo ... actually found nearly 2 cases of this, although one 40 round box was enough today. This was a nice surprise as I'd been looking for a case of South African which didn't shoot nearly as well, but found this instead.
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And of course, the Norinco ammo recently imported by Canada Ammo ...

The shooting: targets were shot at 50 yards, 5 shots at a time, Norc, then IVI then FNM. The first string of 5 was aimed at the hand of the target and the second string was aimed at the face. Yes I know I should adjust my scope, but I wanted to focus on testing ammo today, not fiddling with zero.

One string of 5 was shot using Norc ammo at 100 yards after this procedure. Then I discovered something which was a bit of a game changer.

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The Norc at 50 yards.
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The IVI at 50 yards. This stuff seemed to be prone to vertical stringing. The top 5 shots on the right were aimed at the face, one of the bottom group was likely a pulled shot (so it felt) and is on the extreme right.
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The FNM ... always liked this stuff! Looks like I pulled one of the upper string to the right. Anything that shoots as well as this stuff is the cats ass as far as I'm concerned .... as long as we are living in the world of FMJ military grade ammo, not finely tuned reloads or factory select loads.
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The Norc at 100 ... not too shabby, I think. That's a 2.5" group.

Then I decided to open up the rifle. I wasn't sure if this one had been upgraded to a Match Grade spring guide or not.
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And it had not. I had fortunately brought along one of the M14Doctor spring guides just in case this needed doing.

So I shot two strings of 5 at 50 yards once more using the Norc ammo. The first string was aimed at the hand, and I must admit I was feeling a bit excited and could tell I had pulled two of the shots. So I shot the second string at the face and you can see the results.

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And one more thing ... I believe these targets are a less than full size copy of the originals, so here's a pic to give you a sense of scale.
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Thanks for the review. I bought 3 cases of different calibers ammo from Can-am and have not got to the 7.62x51 yet, that is next weeks project.

The 5.56 my sons and I shot today hit the 2 and 300m gongs through my Colt SP-1 and the 9mm worked well in my Hi-Power but I had a few light strikes in the Nork Tokarev.
 
I haven't picked any of the new import norc ammo up yet but i just recently shot up the last of my stock from a few years back. I always found the norinco ammo to shoot very well in my mostly stock chinese rifles. Good on Canam for getting this stuff in :rockOn:
 
Sorry to hijack, Gothmog, but I had to say I'm running one of those M14Doctor M14 Op Rod spring guides right now with a USGI spring. Runs really well! :D

Nice report on the ammo!

Cheers,
Barney
 
sobo4303 said:
Now that's what I'm talk'n about. See...told ya you have better groups...just didn't figure on the rifle being out of that much adjustment.
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The match grade spring guide made all the difference. That group is 1.5" at 50 yards with the Norc ammo. The earlier groups (with a USGI or Springfield guide I'm not sure) were about 2.5" at 50 yards. The group at 100 yards was the same as the group at 50, interestingly enough.

Overall, I feel that the FNM was best, with the Norinco a close second and the IVI third. Now I am wondering how dramatically the new spring guide will affect the vertical stringing when using the IVI ammo ...
 
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