Is the .325wsm going to make it

[AlexF]

Just in case nobody knew this, 325 WSM exists because Winchester was unable to develope a 338 WSM
The WSM short fat case only works well from 270/7mm to 8mm, large efforts were expended to get a 257 WSM and 338 WSM working but I just didn't work from an engineering point of vue.

325 WSM is still an excellent cartridge, very accurate and extremely powerful.
It's definetively a slow starter but remember that 338 Win Mag was also a slow starter and keeps gaining steam every year.

Alex

 

[archie_james_c]

Just in case nobody knew this, 325 WSM exists because Winchester was unable to develope a 338 WSM
The WSM short fat case only works well from 270/7mm to 8mm, large efforts were expended to get a 257 WSM and 338 WSM working but I just didn't work from an engineering point of vue.

325 WSM is still an excellent cartridge, very accurate and extremely powerful.
It's definetively a slow starter but remember that 338 Win Mag was also a slow starter and keeps gaining steam every year.

Alex

Ya if I recall correctly (maybe im wrong) they could only get numbers out of the 338 WSM that mimic an anemic 338-06?

...still would have sold better than a 325WSM

And besides...the only WSM you really neeed is the 7 WSM *grin*

 

[LongBomber]

Isn't the B.C. of .338 bullets much better on average than the .325 cal bullets available?
QUOTE]
The short answer is yes, however the longer ogive to tip length that helps the 338's BC makes it a tighter fit in a short action. The 338 will just fit into my short 700, but will not feed as it is touching both ends of the mag well. Seating deeper would work, but the bullet is pretty deep already. It will feed from my short action M70 and a savage short would give a tad more room.

Here is a pick of the 300, 325 and 338 wsm. The 338 is set to place the ogive of the bullet right at the case mouth, as is the 325. The 300 is 0.2" ogive to case mouth.

 

[r106]

It's funny how so many say there is no gap between a 300 and a 338, yet the same guys will likely argue tooth and nail how much difference there is between a 270 and a 300. Yet there is the 7 mag which sells well. Notice the diameter gap is roughly the same, 277-308 vs 308-338.

Most of the guys that say "no" have likely never used one, and the guys who have tried it seem to like it. There will always be brass easily available since it is a simple neck up of 300wsm brass. The bullet selction runs from 150gr to 220gr, with some very decent bullets available from a gameking to a ttsx. Winchester, Browning, Nosler, and HS all chamber rifles in 325. If it does die that will be to bad, it does fill a gap.

Plus Kimber and savage . I went out today and got a win m70 extreme weather Chambered in .325wsm. Realy happy with the rifle topped it off with a leupold vx3 3.5-10X40. Put a few rounds through it today Just to get the scope on paper at 100y. I'll see what it can do tomorrow.

Recoil was a lot less than I was expecting

 

[Andy]

x2. Its marketing a new improved cartridge to create a demand for new rifles. Just my opinion.

It's common for people who own only two or three chamberings to consider the ones they own as the best at their respective purposes. Once you own 20+, you become less of a "cheerleader" for the rounds you shoot (and for new rounds), and recognize that there is enormous overlap and redundancy out there. You then adopt the attitude that you buy a new chambering because you want to, not need to.

The fact is that anything created in the past 20 years for hunting purposes (I could just as confidently say 40, but might miss one), did not fill any "hole". The 325 WSM certainly fits into that category. Please don't amuse us with a hunting scenario where only the 325 WSM is best - there just aren't any.

 

[xwe666]

R106 let us know how your 325wsm is shooting.

 

[pharaoh2]

Most of the guys that say "no" have likely never used one, and the guys who have tried it seem to like it.

Your mostly right. I say "no" not because I've never used one, (though it is true) but because nothing in 8mm has ever been popular in North America. That's why they called it the .325 WSM instead of the 8mm WSM. Why they couldn't build the .338 WSM is beyond me, but I do know one guy who owns a 8mm WSM () and quite enjoys it.

 

[LongBomber]

Why they couldn't build the .338 WSM is beyond me

This is my guess - Here is a lineup of bullets to compare lengths. 308-165tsx, 308-165accubond, 308-165ttsx, 308 180 BT, 8mm-200gr accubond, 8mm-220gr gameking, loaded 338wsm, 338-250gr accubond, 338-225gr ttsx.

The 338 take up much more room inside the case when seated with the ogive at the case mouth. You run into the same reason the 338 win mag case is shorter than the 300 win mag case. The bullet length from tip to ogive does not fit well with a short action and a wsm case. Take a look at the tip to ogive length of the 8mm bullets, very short, it allows you to seat the bullet out further for a given mag length. Winchester could have made a slightly shorter case, you would think that they tried and maybe it came up short..
With the 338wsm you end up eating a pile of actual case capacity with the bullet, a 338-06 is in a long action, which has plenty of space for the bullet to be seated further out. If you built a 338wsm for a long action, throated it long to use the space you should get pretty much exactly a 338 win mag. The 338wsm may push the lighter bullets like the 160ttsx pretty fast, I may have to find out one day. Just like winchester should have

 

[AlexF]

It's common for people who own only two or three chamberings to consider the ones they own as the best at their respective purposes. Once you own 20+, you become less of a "cheerleader" for the rounds you shoot (and for new rounds), and recognize that there is enormous overlap and redundancy out there. You then adopt the attitude that you buy a new chambering because you want to, not need to.

The fact is that anything created in the past 20 years for hunting purposes (I could just as confidently say 40, but might miss one), did not fill any "hole". The 325 WSM certainly fits into that category. Please don't amuse us with a hunting scenario where only the 325 WSM is best - there just aren't any.

Yes and no, short and fat cartridges are simply technically superior to convential and long cartridges.
Being more efficient and more accurate, they might fit a niche market in long range hunting where the hunter needs both top accuracy and velocity.

That being said, there are very few thing that a modern rifle in 7 Rem Mag, 300 Win Mag or 338 Win Mag can't do that a 270 WSM, 300 WSM or 325 WSM can do or can do better.

The only real advantages are a shorter action, lighter weight, and better accuracy which I readily admit won't make a difference almost all of the time.

The problem with saying that nothing new is need in terms of cartridges is that this argument has been true since 7mm Mauser, 30-06 and 300 H&H Mag were designed.

You can't stop progress but it's mostly incremental not revolutionary in nature.

Alex

 

[Gatehouse]

IIRC, Winchester tried to do a .338 WSM but it seemed the case mouth wouldn't hold many bullets in the correct place.

If a guy wants a factory 338 short mag, he can buy a .338 RCM though.

 

[Whelen B]

...Winchester was unable to develope a 338 WSM

Such children

IMO the technical explanations (excuses) are mostly pretending I think. Anyone can open UP a case mouth and get more energy at the muzzle - better with heavier bullets too. Sure bullet choice -weight, construction, ogive shape and length - is important and may require thought (changes) but it always has been like that. For bigger game the 325WSM is the best of the WSM litter I think - a 338WSM would have been better yet.

Alot of custom builders have built themselves 338WSMs and as expected they do make 338WinMag performance - no issues - easy peasy. My 350WSM has chronographed 2800 with 250RNs from a 22" tube with some experimental slightly hot loads. It's regular hunting loads with no excessive pressures are 2740MV with 250s and 2900MV with 225s. Both exceed considerably the mighty 338 WinMag factory ammo specs. And I am not alone.

To the question - I think the 325 WSM is a good big game cartridge and will remain so over time. Will it retain it's modest popularity over time - maybe - a VERY modest following as time rolls on IMO.

 

[medvedqc]

the technical side of why the 325 wsm was a valid point ... what was used by some snipers in the Ex Yugoslavija wars : the 8x57js there is a least two studies made by US Army and the Marines Corps about that ...

plus the 8x68S story between hunters. again a great caliber.

i dont know if the 325 wsm is here to stay but it s a damm great caliber ...

 

[bearkilr]

This is my guess - Here is a lineup of bullets to compare lengths. 308-165tsx, 308-165accubond, 308-165ttsx, 308 180 BT, 8mm-200gr accubond, 8mm-220gr gameking, loaded 338wsm, 338-250gr accubond, 338-225gr ttsx.

The 338 take up much more room inside the case when seated with the ogive at the case mouth. You run into the same reason the 338 win mag case is shorter than the 300 win mag case. The bullet length from tip to ogive does not fit well with a short action and a wsm case. Take a look at the tip to ogive length of the 8mm bullets, very short, it allows you to seat the bullet out further for a given mag length. Winchester could have made a slightly shorter case, you would think that they tried and maybe it came up short..
With the 338wsm you end up eating a pile of actual case capacity with the bullet, a 338-06 is in a long action, which has plenty of space for the bullet to be seated further out. If you built a 338wsm for a long action, throated it long to use the space you should get pretty much exactly a 338 win mag. The 338wsm may push the lighter bullets like the 160ttsx pretty fast, I may have to find out one day. Just like winchester should have

It would be nice if you had a picture of 8mm and 338 bullets which are perhaps a little closer in weight. The difference may be a bit less

For example, in the Nosler Accubond, the 200gr. 8mm has an OAL of 1.390" and the 200gr. 338 has an OAL of 1.340, a difference of 0.05".

 

[Huntin' Gun]

Most of the guys that say "no" have likely never used one, and the guys who have tried it seem to like it.

The OP's question wasn't about who likes or dislikes it, but who thinks it will be popular over time.
Maybe people who like it think it SHOULD be popular, but I think we all know that it is doomed.
It may be very fantastic, but it isn't going to last. It'll be about as popular as the .308 Norma. Very good, but not popular.

 

[LongBomber]

It would be nice if you had a picture of 8mm and 338 bullets which are perhaps a little closer in weight. The difference may be a bit less

For example, in the Nosler Accubond, the 200gr. 8mm has an OAL of 1.390" and the 200gr. 338 has an OAL of 1.340, a difference of 0.05".

That is what I had on hand, if you want to buy some more, I will take a pic Heck I'd even put them in a wsm and have a shoot off!

You are right about the length difference between those two accubonds, but a better comparison would be a 225gr 338 to a 200gr 8mm. The SD is closer as is the BC.

 

[338jd]

I picked up a 325 WSM in a Browning. So far it seems to like 200gr Accubonds and H4350. Been playing with 195 Horn but it seems to be a little finicky with those. I didn't buy it to fill a void between cartridges I bought it because I wanted one. I have a 338 Win Mag and a 338 Federal and like both of those rifles too. I think that the 325 WSM is good cartridge and I hope it sticks around.

 

[r106]

R106 let us know how your 325wsm is shooting.

I will. I'm going to start working up a load with 200gr accubonds. just have to figure out what powder I want to use

 

[grizzly416]

its the awnswer to the question no one asked

 

[thumper1]

Yup it'll make it cause its a winchester cartridge now if it were a rem catridge i'd say no!

 

[hawk-i]

I'd say NO , it will go the way of the 8mm Remington Mag (which BTW is ballistically superior) and not because it isn't a good cartridge but in my opinion because of bullet availibility. If someone was to make .323 long range bullets in say weights of 250-280 gr. it would be a different story.