VERY Disapointed with a few hunters.

To much eagerness to inform on your fellow hunters. Are we all now willing agents of the state? I would suggest that the best course of action in ensure that you personally comply with the appropriate laws and leave it at that.

As has already been mentioned there is already a heavily biased and unequal application of the law anyways. Why further this.
 
USP said:
To much eagerness to inform on your fellow hunters. Are we all now willing agents of the state? I would suggest that the best course of action in ensure that you personally comply with the appropriate laws and leave it at that.

As has already been mentioned there is already a heavily biased and unequal application of the law anyways. Why further this.
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Too much? I say not enough. Matter of opinion I suppose. Any moron who shoots a bull and says he thought it was a calf deserves to have his licensed stripped. More then likely hes a liar and thought he could get away with it before the shot, but then just abandoned it out of fear of getting caught once the adrenaline wore off. Either that or hes too stupid to hunt. Remember those O so important rules when it comes to hunting/shooting? ENSURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT. ALWAYS CHECK BEYOND YOUR TARGET. Follow those rules and mistakes like this wont happen.

Monday I had a moose 75m in front of me but just could not make out if it had spike antlers or not. It was an easy decision for me not to shoot. That was the first moose ive ever had in front of me while moose hunting and I was excited beyond belief. Did I second guess myself after the fact? Yes. I am still am. But the bottom line is you dont shoot unless you are ABSOLUTELY SURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT.
 
blasted_saber said:
Too much? I say not enough. Matter of opinion I suppose. Any moron who shoots a bull and says he thought it was a calf deserves to have his licensed stripped. More then likely hes a liar and thought he could get away with it before the shot, but then just abandoned it out of fear of getting caught once the adrenaline wore off. Either that or hes too stupid to hunt. Remember those O so important rules when it comes to hunting/shooting? ENSURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT. ALWAYS CHECK BEYOND YOUR TARGET. Follow those rules and mistakes like this wont happen.

Monday I had a moose 75m in front of me but just could not make out if it had spike antlers or not. It was an easy decision for me not to shoot. That was the first moose ive ever had in front of me while moose hunting and I was excited beyond belief. Did I second guess myself after the fact? Yes. I am still am. But the bottom line is you dont shoot unless you are ABSOLUTELY SURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT.
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Well I dont make those shots, you dont make those shots. But I am also not some guy who trolls the woods looking for people to inform on or report to the MNR. I dont get why so many have such angst over some people who are stupid.
 
I personally know of three separate situations where moose were shot without the appropriate tag, and in each instance the hunters did the right thing and called the MNR. Only once was someone charged, and it was only $140.

Instance one was 2 bulls getting shot by the same guy, who thought he was shooting the same bull. No fine, hunter got to pick which bull to keep, and the CO helped him pack it out.

Instance 2 was a novice moose hunter who shot a cow on a calf tag, called the MNR, $140 fine, no problem.

Instance 3 was similar to instance 1, but twin calves, no fines issued and hunter got to keep his choice.

Given the experiences that people whom I know have had, I think I'd be honest about it, rather than have to deal with the possible consequences of Shoot, Shovel and Shut up.

Slooshark1 said:
If someone makes a mistake, I guess the right thing to do is turn yourself and your friends in, lose your truck, guns and hunting priveledges for 5 years. Have your name published in the paper so that your whole family can share your shame. It's the right thing to do rather than letting the animal get eaten by no good vultures, crows ravens, bears, wolves, foxes, porcupines and even mice. That's what happens when you go to the MNR with your hat in hand. I guess that's the right thing to do. If you get caught looking for someone with a tag, you get charged. If you know someone who has a tag and they're not hunting with you and they come out and tag it, you both get charged and if you try and sneak the animal home, then you're a no good poacher. I've found animals dead in the bush before and it's a damn shameful waste. If someone phoned me up and asked me to attach my bull tag that I waited 14 years to get, on a moose that he accidentally shot, I'd tell him to piss up a rope. Bottom line is these guys screwed up, they took the animals they could legally take home and will probably feel terrible for a long time over the whole ordeal. Some of them may never hunt again over it. Yes it sucks but it was a moose and not a person. Life goes on.
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blasted_saber said:
Too much? I say not enough. Matter of opinion I suppose. Any moron who shoots a bull and says he thought it was a calf deserves to have his licensed stripped. More then likely hes a liar and thought he could get away with it before the shot, but then just abandoned it out of fear of getting caught once the adrenaline wore off. Either that or hes too stupid to hunt. Remember those O so important rules when it comes to hunting/shooting? ENSURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT. ALWAYS CHECK BEYOND YOUR TARGET. Follow those rules and mistakes like this wont happen.

Monday I had a moose 75m in front of me but just could not make out if it had spike antlers or not. It was an easy decision for me not to shoot. That was the first moose ive ever had in front of me while moose hunting and I was excited beyond belief. Did I second guess myself after the fact? Yes. I am still am. But the bottom line is you dont shoot unless you are ABSOLUTELY SURE WHAT YOU ARE SHOOTING AT.
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So here we have a person with zero moose hunting experience telling us absolutely no way you can make a mistake!
I can clearly tell you a mistake is very easy to make.
A early born single calf can sometimes range almost as big as a small cow.
While late born twin yearling calfs standing beside large cow can look very small! I've seen me swear a yearling bull with horns shorter than it's ears looking right at me at 100yds was a calf when standing beside a huge cow.
We've had 8 of 10 people tell our camp we had shot a yearling not a calf till we counted the back teeth & proved them wrong...Wew!
 
A friend of mine shot a cow moose accidentally in a bull only area, minimum antler length 4 inches. He reported himself, they confiscated the moose and gave him the lowest fine possible. At least that CO had a sense of discretion which seems to be lacking with many of the younger CO's these days. My friend fully expected to get a far worse charge.
Point is, anybody can make mistakes. What separates hunters from poachers is to "man up" and admit your screw up. Abandoning a whole moose is a far worse crime than shooting the wrong ### and should be dealt with accordingly.
 
USP said:
To much eagerness to inform on your fellow hunters. Are we all now willing agents of the state? I would suggest that the best course of action in ensure that you personally comply with the appropriate laws and leave it at that.

As has already been mentioned there is already a heavily biased and unequal application of the law anyways. Why further this.
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id suggest u stay out of the woods if you're defending these actions and think its a good idea for responsible hunters to ignore crap like this. many people wait for years to get a moose tag in ontario, but its ok for d-bags to leave a dead moose in the bush?

i found a rifle shot deer that was still warm in a bow only wmu last december. i guess i shoulda ignored that instead of calling the OPP (figured they might show up as the guys were carrying rifles and smoking joints) and mnr with their description and plate #? i feel obligated to report poachers, but i guess some "hunters" dont have the same opinion. the worst part is im 99.99% sure one of those #### licks is a member over at another forum i visit. maybe its time i finally call him out on it. maybe he's over here too?

our fish and wildlife get raped due to bs attitudes and lack of enforcement. conservation officers in ontario need all the help they can get...
 
canadian hunter312 said:
id suggest u stay out of the woods if you're defending these actions and think its a good idea for responsible hunters to ignore crap like this. many people wait for years to get a moose tag in ontario, but its ok for d-bags to leave a dead moose in the bush?

i found a rifle shot deer that was still warm in a bow only wmu last december. i guess i shoulda ignored that instead of calling the OPP (figured they might show up as the guys were carrying rifles and smoking joints) and mnr with their description and plate #? i feel obligated to report poachers, but i guess some "hunters" dont have the same opinion. the worst part is im 99.99% sure one of those #### licks is a member over at another forum i visit. maybe its time i finally call him out on it. maybe he's over here too?

our fish and wildlife get raped due to bs attitudes and lack of enforcement. conservation officers in ontario need all the help they can get...
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Where did I say I was defending these actions? I dont get the mentality that constantly informing on others is somehow a good thing. The self righteous indignation is abit sickening at times from some. Its like saying "I would never make a mistake" so if you do I will tell on you.

As for the rifle shot deer in local WMUs, you get that a certain demographic has been caught using rifles in non rifle area alot around here right? They even caught them with lots of deer as well. I believe they claimed that the dead deer were being "counted".

The point is that there is a real unequal application of laws and rights in the woods right now. Those that are doing the bulk of the wasting and poaching get a pass due to ethniticity, where as others get heavily fined for less serious actions.

I was out with a buddy of mine a few weeks ago. He was bragging how he was out fishing (out of season) with a few of his friends. The MNR caught them, his friends all got huge fines, he got nothing due to his status card.

Yet they all had fish.

Rarely are events black and white and cut and dry. But some seem to think otherwise.
 
USP said:
Where did I say I was defending these actions? I dont get the mentality that constantly informing on others is somehow a good thing. The self righteous indignation is abit sickening at times from some. Its like saying "I would never make a mistake" so if you do I will tell on you.

As for the rifle shot deer in local WMUs, you get that a certain demographic has been caught using rifles in non rifle area alot around here right? They even caught them with lots of deer as well. I believe they claimed that the dead deer were being "counted".

The point is that there is a real unequal application of laws and rights in the woods right now. Those that are doing the bulk of the wasting and poaching get a pass due to ethniticity, where as others get heavily fined for less serious actions.

I was out with a buddy of mine a few weeks ago. He was bragging how he was out fishing (out of season) with a few of his friends. The MNR caught them, his friends all got huge fines, he got nothing due to his status card.

Yet they all had fish.

Rarely are events black and white and cut and dry. But some seem to think otherwise.
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i understand now. we should just assume that any illegal activities we see in the bush were committed by natives and forget about it? :rolleyes:

you need to wake up and smell the beans if you believe natives are responsible for everything.
 
canadian hunter312 said:
i understand now. we should just assume that any illegal activities we see in the bush were committed by natives and forget about it? :rolleyes:

you need to wake up and smell the beans if you believe natives are responsible for everything.
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Your reading is off abit today. My point was not what you wrote.

We have alot of people who beleive people cant make mistakes or if they do they should be punished really harshly. The laws as they are written give the MNR really broad sweeping powers of search, seizure and confiscation. At the same time these laws are not equally applied.

What seems to be lacking is any clear discretion here, alot have the mentality that its better to report anything that seems remotely off or illegal.

Somehow this is a good thing? Seems to lack common sense.
 
I know of two incidents (first hand) where a mistake was made and the incorrect ### (of a moose) was shot. The guilty partys fessed up and were simply fined. (there was no way they would have ever been caught either)

In another incident, a shooter (from Camp B) nails a moose in the bush for which his camp did not have a tag. Members from Camp A find the shooter and the moose and ask him if he needed any assistance. 'No' was the response so they go on their way. The next day, the guys from CAMP A go by the kill site and the moose is still there. Pissed they call the MNR on CAMP B where the shooter belonged. During the ensuing investigation, all the members of CAMP B pulled a Sgt. Schultz and tried cover it up. The shooter, (who had left camp and returned home), felt guilty about what he had done and went to the MNR and explained what had happened. All the members of the CAMP B were charged with obstruction for lying during the CO's investigation.

An old buddy was a member of CAMP A and said that even though it would have been illegal, they would have tagged the animal so as not to see it waste. It happens all the time in Ontario.
 
matty86suk said:
You guys are hunting in the wrong places if you come across other hunters....oh how i have been spoiled in BC...Suckers
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Where are you hunting around Victoria where you don't run in to other people? I can walk 8km into the bush, 16 miles up a logging road, and encounter dirtbikes and quadders.

Are you going up island or northern BC?
 
Fall Guy said:
I know of two incidents (first hand) where a mistake was made and the incorrect ### (of a moose) was shot. The guilty partys fessed up and were simply fined. (there was no way they would have ever been caught either)

In another incident, a shooter (from Camp B) nails a moose in the bush for which his camp did not have a tag. Members from Camp A find the shooter and the moose and ask him if he needed any assistance. 'No' was the response so they go on their way. The next day, the guys from CAMP A go by the kill site and the moose is still there. Pissed they call the MNR on CAMP B where the shooter belonged. During the ensuing investigation, all the members of CAMP B pulled a Sgt. Schultz and tried cover it up. The shooter, (who had left camp and returned home), felt guilty about what he had done and went to the MNR and explained what had happened. All the members of the CAMP B were charged with obstruction for lying during the CO's investigation.

An old buddy was a member of CAMP A and said that even though it would have been illegal, they would have tagged the animal so as not to see it waste. It happens all the time in Ontario.
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We won't have moose hunting unless we have more Camp A's than Camp B's.

There is a reason the folks who fess up get minimal fines - it seems only the poachers amongst us can't figure that out.
 
It's a very sad story, but because nobody saw it we can only speculate what really happened. Fessing up is a crap shoot; really depends on who you happen to talk to when you stroll into the government office and what kind of day they are having. And for people who rely on their hunted meat for food (as opposed to just liking it) risking no meat for five years because you can't hunt is nothing to scoff at. This is not a black and white situation.

My family once benefitted from a "kind-of" similar situation. We were out hunting and came across a fellow we knew and his friend. The looked nervous and asked us right away if we wanted a freshly shot bull moose. Apparently one of them shot a moose in shoulder high scrub brush and it went down. He told buddy where it was, and to go ahead and start buthering it as he moved the vehicle closer. The other guy gets half way there and the moose stands up, so he shoots it. He gets to the moose and there are two dead bulls fifteen feet away from each other. They're crapping their pants because they only have one tag and the second guy only shot because he thought he was delivering a finishing shot to a fatally wounded moose. Anyways, short moose hunt for my family.
 
Northman999 said:
It's a very sad story, but because nobody saw it we can only speculate what really happened. Fessing up is a crap shoot; really depends on whoy happen to talk to, and for people who rely on their hunted meat for food (as opposed to just liking it) risking no meat for five years because you can't hunt is nothing to scoff at. This is not a black and white situation.

My family once benefitted from a "kind-of" similar situation. We were out hunting and came across a fellow we knew and his friend. The looked nervous and asked us right away if we wanted a freshly shot bull moose. Apparently one of them shot a moose in shoulder high scrub brush and it went down. He told buddy where it was, and to go ahead and start buthering it as he moved the vehicle closer. The other guy gets half way there and the moose stands up, so he shoots it. He gets to the moose and there are two dead bulls fifteen feet away from each other. They're crapping their pants because they only have one tag and the second guy only shot because he thought he was delivering a finishing shot to a fatally wounded moose. Anyways, short moose hunt for my family.
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I really have no prob with that, sort of an impromptu party hunt. :eek:

I guess you got the meat you really count on. :D

Different situation than people who walk away from something they mistakenly or stupidly killed, like theives in the night - I hope they never enjoy a hunt again. Course then again, those folks probably never understood the hunt. Like the legal poachers.
 
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