Looking to start shooting in IPSC/IDPA, need advice!

[timoram]

Well I have been around guns most of my life. I have always considered shooting competitively but never seriously considered it.

I'm wanting to start out at the bottom end of things as I am not wanting to devote a huge amount of funds towards this so I need to get an idea of the cost of competing.

The gun I want to use is the Springfield Arms XDM 5.25 45ACP.

Now form my understanding anything over 5inches would require me to run in the Standard division? Is this correct?

How much does it cost to shoot at an event?
On average, how much ammunition do you go through in an event?
Any costs that you would consider necessary to shoot at an event?

I'm located in Port Coquitlam so I am near some events and may or may not travel to shoot in Kelowna and surrounding areas...just want to get my foot in the door.

 

[race1911]

You're very close to Port Coquitlam range where they shoot a fair bit of IPSC...Yes, your XDM over 5" would be in Standard division....for an IPSC club match (look at the range calendar) you would need an inner and outer belt, holster, a few mag holders and at least four mags, match fees $20 or less, 200 rounds of ammo (includes extras)......Level II and higher require you take the Black Badge course which is offered thru people at the club and is VERY MUCH advised to take even for just club shoots for the information you will learn......if you would like to check out a Level II match there is one indoors at Abbotsford gun club on Dec. 17......hoping you get involved

 

[simar]

How much are you planning on competing will determine how much you spend. If you have a weekly practice say 100 rounds, thats 5200 rounds a year. say a monthly match, $20 min $240/year, and 200 rounds average (100-150 course of fire, and some extra for reshoots) 2400 rounds a year. One major match a year (provincials), $1000 (hotel, driving, food and booze, match fee), 350 rounds a year. Add on your onetime cost and you have a really good idea what this hobby will cost you at a base, if you get addicted it will cost you more.

 

[timoram]

Thanks for the reply.
I was happy to find out that quite a few matches are right next to home. Makes enjoying this that much easier.

For the belt I have been looking around and not sure what is a good belt to go with. My other issue is I'm in the process of loosing some more weight (about 20lbs) and am sitting at a 34-38 waist depending on the pant. Do you have any recomendations on belts? I would prefer to purchase something I could continue to use for a number of years without the need to upgrade. Was considering the S&J Hardware inner and outer.

I was told that 6 magazines is ideal as some courses of fire will consist of 40-45 shots. 5 on belt and one in the gun?

For the holster I am not sure what will work best for this. I'm not the best out there by any means and I don't need something super fancy but looking for something that will not put me at a disadvantage.

I will see what the family is up to and see about checking out the event on the 17th....would be nice to watch it in person.

You're very close to Port Coquitlam range where they shoot a fair bit of IPSC...Yes, your XDM over 5" would be in Standard division....for an IPSC club match (look at the range calendar) you would need an inner and outer belt, holster, a few mag holders and at least four mags, match fees $20 or less, 200 rounds of ammo (includes extras)......Level II and higher require you take the Black Badge course which is offered thru people at the club and is VERY MUCH advised to take even for just club shoots for the information you will learn......if you would like to check out a Level II match there is one indoors at Abbotsford gun club on Dec. 17......hoping you get involved

Right now I am looking at it as a chance to enjoy a good time with good people and work on my proficiency with a hand gun. Keeping that in mind I would like to try and attend an event once a month or so. Depends on the time of year and what my work schedule will work around.
As time goes on I'm sure I will want to attend more events but for the time being I would like to compete once a month.
I would also consider practising once a week in the beginning.

My main concern is I am newly a father to the most amazing little girl so I don't want to take to much money or time away from the family for this. So for now it will be a bit of a juggle. I would like to compete as much as my budget will allow me.

How much are you planning on competing will determine how much you spend. If you have a weekly practice say 100 rounds, thats 5200 rounds a year. say a monthly match, $20 min $240/year, and 200 rounds average (100-150 course of fire, and some extra for reshoots) 2400 rounds a year. One major match a year (provincials), $1000 (hotel, driving, food and booze, match fee), 350 rounds a year. Add on your onetime cost and you have a really good idea what this hobby will cost you at a base, if you get addicted it will cost you more.

 

[Slavex]

I don't normally try to dissuade people away from their choice of gun, however in this case I'll make the exception. Have you tried the gun out yet or compared it with others? The XD don't have the most stellar reputation in competitive circles. If you are set on it realize that parts and accessories for it are much harder to come by.

 

[Geoff B]

Check it out first

Like any other sport, go to an event as an observer and talk to the folks. See what most people use and ask them why. You should have no trouble getting people's opinion, but be prepared to get your ear talked off!

 

[supermariov]

I have to agree with Geoff B , you can learn more by going to a match and talking to the competitors and checking out their guns and equipment. Ask first of course!

 

[timoram]

I have handled the XDM in the 4.5 offerings in all 3 calibre choices and I do enjoy the gun very much. I'm not looking to be the fastest guy out there, more to get out there and enjoy my time there.
In years past I would normally pull out one of my Glock's and go at'er....but I have become VERY tired of my Glock's and want to play with a new toy.

I'm going to be leaving the gun in close to stock configuration so I am not to worried about parts or accessories for it. However, the only thing I seem to have trouble finding for the model I want to use is a holster.

What have you heard about the XDM's not being very good in the competitive scene? I have not heard a lot bad about the XDM's from anyone.

I don't normally try to dissuade people away from their choice of gun, however in this case I'll make the exception. Have you tried the gun out yet or compared it with others? The XD don't have the most stellar reputation in competitive circles. If you are set on it realize that parts and accessories for it are much harder to come by.

I intend on doing just that. However, when it comes down to the gun choice I have made up my mind on that. Its more of a personal enjoyment thing than all out competition.
We will see how I do and build from there, but for now its about fun.

Like any other sport, go to an event as an observer and talk to the folks. See what most people use and ask them why. You should have no trouble getting people's opinion, but be prepared to get your ear talked off!

 

[CeeZer]

.45acp may not be ideal to get into the sport due to heavier recoil and high ammo cost. They may get you discouraged.

IMHO, a 9mm gun is a better choice, especially if you can shoot it in IDPA SSP/ESP and IPSC Prod Div to start with. Consider going thru at least 150rds a week to just keep your muscle memory in check.

Dual belt system is not absolutely necessary for IPSC, good holster and mag pouches are. You can get a belt like Wilderness Frequent Flyer (5 stitch) and use it for IDPA and IPSC. IDPA wont allow dual belt. Also, pay attention to what holster and mag pouches requirements are for the two sports, they differ, but you still can get by with one Blade Tech holster for both, by just using proper belt loops on holster.

 

[euxx]

As CeeZer said, .45acp will cost you about half the price more for the ammo (compare price of projectiles alone, using AIM projectiles as an example: 9mm - $107/1000 vs .45acp - $154/1000). If you're planning to practice once a week, 100..200 rounds is bare minimum.

 

[timoram]

Recoil is no so much of an issue. I have been shooting Glock starting at 9mm all the way up to the 10mm.
I really enjoy the deep thump you get from a 45acp and this is more about enjoyment for me than anything.
Ammo cost is not as big a concern as I do reload for my personal consumption so cost is decent as long as components don't sky rocket any time soon.

150rnds a week is manageable for me. I was budgeting for 200 to be on the safe side.

For the belt I was wanting to get a dual system as they seem to be the most common style being used by competitors and they all say good things about them.
IPSC is my starting point. I may shot IDPA in the future as well but I want to get my foot in the door.

Holster and mag pouches are a bit of concern as the only holsters I can find for the 5.25 in 45acp are the Blade Tech and CP Speed holster. The CP would be great but at $200 for a holster it can be a little on the spendy side of things. Mag pouches are of no worry tho, plenty of those around for the XD mags.

Tim

.45acp may not be ideal to get into the sport due to heavier recoil and high ammo cost. They may get you discouraged.

IMHO, a 9mm gun is a better choice, especially if you can shoot it in IDPA SSP/ESP and IPSC Prod Div to start with. Consider going thru at least 150rds a week to just keep your muscle memory in check.

Dual belt system is not absolutely necessary for IPSC, good holster and mag pouches are. You can get a belt like Wilderness Frequent Flyer (5 stitch) and use it for IDPA and IPSC. IDPA wont allow dual belt. Also, pay attention to what holster and mag pouches requirements are for the two sports, they differ, but you still can get by with one Blade Tech holster for both, by just using proper belt loops on holster.

 

[Onagoth]

Recoil is no so much of an issue. I have been shooting Glock starting at 9mm all the way up to the 10mm.
I really enjoy the deep thump you get from a 45acp and this is more about enjoyment for me than anything.
Ammo cost is not as big a concern as I do reload for my personal consumption so cost is decent as long as components don't sky rocket any time soon.

150rnds a week is manageable for me. I was budgeting for 200 to be on the safe side.

For the belt I was wanting to get a dual system as they seem to be the most common style being used by competitors and they all say good things about them.
IPSC is my starting point. I may shot IDPA in the future as well but I want to get my foot in the door.

Holster and mag pouches are a bit of concern as the only holsters I can find for the 5.25 in 45acp are the Blade Tech and CP Speed holster. The CP would be great but at $200 for a holster it can be a little on the spendy side of things. Mag pouches are of no worry tho, plenty of those around for the XD mags.

Tim

I shoot IPSC with all my IDPA gear...if cost is at all a concern for you, I would buy gear that plays in both sports.

As others have said, shooting .45 can be fun, but the cost is quite higher.

 

[Slavex]

I've seen a couple dozen XD's of all stripes come through my weekly classes each year. Not once have I seen one make it through the night without a significant failure (oh actually there was a 9mm that recently was in class and it just had a few minor failures). Now some of them have been the same gun from year to year as not one of my students has kept them, so some other unlucky shooter gets it, shows up, it sucks and then they dump it. So probably over the last 10 years I've seen maybe 60 or 70 different XD's tops, and none of them have worked right.
for me the gun is giant failure.

 

[soup13]

A quick note on the XDm in IDPA. It will only qualify for ESP, because it's technically single action. So it would compete with 1911s which could put you at a disadvantage. But, if you're goal is just to have fun then no worries!

As mentioned before, parts are pretty hard to come by (trigger kits are usually over $100 so you can't import them yourself), although the 5.25 is well set up for competition... despite the trigger.

That being said, I would probably take my 4.5 XDm 9 into competition. I really like the gun and would like to see how it performs in competition.

 

[Canadian_Eh]

The advice about watching a match is great. People are very friendly and will answer any questions.

Having just finished my first year I would say the most significant and memorable part about IPSC is obvious, and it is not the choice of pistols. It is hearing a beep, and executing something close to your plan, often while moving, and then smiling like crazy because it is 100 times better than just going to the range.

Here's a video of a match they put on at PCDFHC in Coquitlam. It may give you an idea of what it can be like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmzyqaoWy0g&hd=1

 

[maurice]

I've seen a couple dozen XD's of all stripes come through my weekly classes each year. Not once have I seen one make it through the night without a significant failure (oh actually there was a 9mm that recently was in class and it just had a few minor failures). Now some of them have been the same gun from year to year as not one of my students has kept them, so some other unlucky shooter gets it, shows up, it sucks and then they dump it. So probably over the last 10 years I've seen maybe 60 or 70 different XD's tops, and none of them have worked right.
for me the gun is giant failure.

That chamber is unforgiving for ammo....I had a shooter who had major malfunctions with just about any ammo. I sold him some proper chamber checked ammo....and it ran tickety -boo. He had trigger return spring break on him recently. Getting spare parts was not a walk in the park. It will do the job if you shoot proper ammo, but there are so many better firearms out there you could choose. I would put the M&P about a mile ahead of that gun if you want a striker fired pistol.

 

[timoram]

I may end up with no choice on this on. Looks like safari land is the only holster I can use.
45acp is a bit more expensive to shoot but for me it's an enjoyment thing. I reload and have a good stick of 45acp in the ammo locker.
I plan on shooting both as time goes on as they both seem like a whole lot of fun.

I shoot IPSC with all my IDPA gear...if cost is at all a concern for you, I would buy gear that plays in both sports.

As others have said, shooting .45 can be fun, but the cost is quite higher.

Wow! That's the first I have heard of issues like this. Was there a common failure with these it was it different each time?
I have not fired the XD before but I'm told that the XDM shoots much better.

I've seen a couple dozen XD's of all stripes come through my weekly classes each year. Not once have I seen one make it through the night without a significant failure (oh actually there was a 9mm that recently was in class and it just had a few minor failures). Now some of them have been the same gun from year to year as not one of my students has kept them, so some other unlucky shooter gets it, shows up, it sucks and then they dump it. So probably over the last 10 years I've seen maybe 60 or 70 different XD's tops, and none of them have worked right.
for me the gun is giant failure.

I wasn't aware that the XDM was classed like that. I saw on the IPSC site that it was treated the same as a Glock when it came to the class.

Trigger parts are not a big deal. The stock setup is what I would shoot and just run it like that. I may change up a few things but I just want to get shooting.

A quick note on the XDm in IDPA. It will only qualify for ESP, because it's technically single action. So it would compete with 1911s which could put you at a disadvantage. But, if you're goal is just to have fun then no worries!

As mentioned before, parts are pretty hard to come by (trigger kits are usually over $100 so you can't import them yourself), although the 5.25 is well set up for competition... despite the trigger.

That being said, I would probably take my 4.5 XDm 9 into competition. I really like the gun and would like to see how it performs in competition.

I'm really looking forward to meeting people and seeing how things work. From what I have seen and know it looks like a lot of fun.

The advice about watching a match is great. People are very friendly and will answer any questions.

Having just finished my first year I would say the most significant and memorable part about IPSC is obvious, and it is not the choice of pistols. It is hearing a beep, and executing something close to your plan, often while moving, and then smiling like crazy because it is 100 times better than just going to the range.

Here's a video of a match they put on at PCDFHC in Coquitlam. It may give you an idea of what it can be like.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmzyqaoWy0g&hd=1

I havent heard an issue with the 5.25 XDM and any type of loading. Was this experienced on an XD or XDM?

That chamber is unforgiving for ammo....I had a shooter who had major malfunctions with just about any ammo. I sold him some proper chamber checked ammo....and it ran tickety -boo. He had trigger return spring break on him recently. Getting spare parts was not a walk in the park. It will do the job if you shoot proper ammo, but there are so many better firearms out there you could choose. I would put the M&P about a mile ahead of that gun if you want a striker fired pistol.

PS Sorry if the reply is a little short and to the point. I'm currently stuck in a hospital bed right now.

 

[Canuck44]

To play in both sports you have to look for common denominators. For new shooters Production/Stock Service Pistol are the two closest divisions for pistols.

Caliber: 9mm is the least expensive round to shoot

Belt: Wilderness/Riggers Belt style 1 3/4" belt works in both sports

Holster: Blade Tech or Comp Tec are two of the most popular. IPSC allows the Dropped and Offset while IDPA doesn't. Go with the IDPA compliant holster. I have tried both and there isn't any time difference for me in my draws. For the more skilled the dropped and Offset maybe faster. In any event the draw in many IPSC stages doesn't count for much and not much more in IDPA IMHO. If you must have the dropped and offset design Blade Tech offers removable back attachments to comply with both sports.

PIstol:

Steel

The most popular pistol I believe in IPSC Prodcution is the CZ Shadow. Unfortunately you have to reduce it's weight to 39oz for it to play in IDPA. It can be done but the mods (Grips and different CZ mag brake) add to the cost. For steel the CZ 85 Combat works in both sports and you won't give anything away to the CZ Shadow shooters.

Polymer

You have three great options and both have their followers. Glock 17, M&P FS and the STI GP 6. IPSC has a minimum trigger pull limit of 5#'s so you might want to avoid the M&P Pro. The M&P FS works but I have a good friend who had one and with use the trigger pull dropped below 5#'s. You can buy heavier trigger springs for the gun but I am not sure what the IPSC rules are now for spring replacement in Production guns.

Turning to your 1911 in .45acp. Great pistol for IDPA CDP Division, a division designed around the 1911. IPSC has their new Classic Division which I know little about but the gun should work well in that division. You have the reloading equipment so ammo cost will be almost a wash.

Personally I would go out to a few IPSC/IDPA club matches and see what you think. Before you spend a lot of money decide first if either sport is for you. If you find you like one but not the other then focus on equipment for that sport and the division you want to shoot in. If you like both then look for common compliant equipment. I am sure you will be competitive in both sports using the same equipment. Onegoth does and he handed me my butt when we shot together.....then most of the guys did that day.

Hope some of this helps.

Take Care

Bob

 

[animalamidon]

If you have a gun you like to shoot, then use it. If you find you need sometihng else later on down the road then thats another story. As long as you get a hold of a good belt ( I would recomend not cheaping out on a belt because it is the "foundation of your entire shooting rig) either AA or CR can be had for 50-60$. Find a holster that fits your gun and at least 4 mag pouches and you will be good to go. If you can make it out to the Abby match DEC. 17, i would highly recomend it. As for shooting .45, its really a personal choice. I shoot .45 because i love it. After all, i shoot IPSC for fun, and for me theres nothing more fun than shooting .45. The next Black Badge course at the Poco range starts February 6th. I beleive it will be run by Murray Gardner, you can contact him with any questions about IPSC or the Black Badge course at 604.889.3822 or email doc@mdgardner.com

 

[1TOPGUN]

Check IDPA....

You sound like you want to have fun, compete and do this all at very little cost. you need to go talk to some IDPA shooters and shoot with them at least once. For IDPA your XD is fine, the stages are under 20 rounds, you could look at Fobus on ebay for paddle holsters and mag holders. If you look on ebay.ca buy only the holsters from Israel not Hong Kong or the USA. The price for the holsters is usually about $25.00 free shipping from Israel and they come in about one week. I have four different models and used them for some time with no issues what so ever. I shoot an M&P in 40 cal and use the fobus for it. No race guns in IDPA and no pressure to keep up with the Jones. NO offence IPSC guys, ive shot IPSC as well but when money , time and keep it simple are the issue IDPA prevails. I had a growing family ,found myself at more and more sports practices with kids. flipped to IDPA and never looked back. Good Luck