Do 350 gr 0.458 bullet @ 2350 fps qualify for African.....

I'd agree with the previous post.
If there's any question of what you're going to hunt then just do it all with a .416.
 
BigUglyGuy

I'm confused, you have advice and an opinion on everything, but from reading your inputs, you haven't killed anything larger than a buff in Africa. Possibly you should leave the advice to those of us who have ACTUALLY killed the big five. I'm sorry, but you have never faced an enraged elephant at 18 mtrs. You have never played footsy around a tree at 2 mtrs with a rhino, and apparently you've never had a leopard try and climb in the blind with you etc, etc, etc. Possibly you should bow out and read and learn from those of us who have ACTUALLY done it.
When I recommend a caliber, I have actually hunted and killed game with it, probably the game the op has asked about. Apparently not you.
But you know what, it pi**es me off to no end, when some wet behind the ears whelp, counters my advice that is given with years of experience.
Just a thought, but maybe you should read more and opine less !!!
Apparently you own a double, whoop de doo so do I. That in and of itself does not make you an authority on doubles or African hunting of big game.

Douglas
 
c-fbmi said:
I'm confused, you have advice and an opinion on everything, but from reading your inputs, you haven't killed anything larger than a buff in Africa. Possibly you should leave the advice to those of us who have ACTUALLY killed the big five. I'm sorry, but you have never faced an enraged elephant at 18 mtrs. You have never played footsy around a tree at 2 mtrs with a rhino, and apparently you've never had a leopard try and climb in the blind with you etc, etc, etc. Possibly you should bow out and read and learn from those of us who have ACTUALLY done it.
When I recommend a caliber, I have actually hunted and killed game with it, probably the game the op has asked about. Apparently not you.
But you know what, it pi**es me off to no end, when some wet behind the ears whelp, counters my advice that is given with years of experience.
Just a thought, but maybe you should read more and opine less !!!
Apparently you own a double, whoop de doo so do I. That in and of itself does not make you an authority on doubles or African hunting of big game.

Douglas
Click to expand...

Got up on the wrong side of the bed this morning?
 
rant

My apologies to all for my ranting and particularly,BigUglyGuy.
My ammended advice to the OP is to read John Taylor's book entitled "Use Enough Gun". Then you can get advice from a true expert.
 
c-fbmi said:
My apologies to all for my ranting and particularly,BigUglyGuy.
My ammended advice to the OP is to read John Taylor's book entitled "Use Enough Gun". Then you can get advice from a true expert.
Click to expand...

Taylor's "advice" was from a different time and place. His interest was poaching elephants, and poaching as many elephants as possible in the shortest amount of time possible. While interesting, it is of anecdotal importance today. While I've not shot an elephant in self defense (didn't have to - we ran fast enough, something young guys like me tend to do better than old pelters), I still feel that my advice is solid and grounded in fact. Perhaps you can point out where this "wet behind the ears whelp" has it wrong?

If I'm to read more and learn from people like you, I'd likely learn no more than how to run my mouth and act like a condescending ass. For a guy that can't even quote a username right you have an impressive set on you.

Now that I think of it, you remind me a little of our dear beloved kutenay. Not-so-distant relation perhaps?

Now, let's get back to the discussion at hand and insult each other via PM to keep this interesting topic from being locked. :D
 
rant

Again I must apologise to BigUglyMan for getting his "handle" incorrect, and I must also correct myself "Use Enough Gun" is by Robert Ruark not John Taylor as I stated.
To BigUglyMan, you are correct, what I wrote was condescending and not appropriate. No excuses, my apologies. I am no expert either, having marginally more experience than you. As far as your opinions on Taylor's experience and writings, well, let's just say you are entitled to your opinions. I'm just not sure how his motives for killing 200+ elephants detracts from his experience with different cartridges, you've lost me there.
 
4 bore

negative, 1899, why you got one for sale? A buddy of mine, machinist extrordinaire built himself one from the ground up, a double, beautiful work.
I have fired an 8 bore BPE but never a 4. No my double is a .470 NE and I have a Steyr 50 BMG.
 
And i thought that caliber wars for NA game were bad. For the guys that have actually done it how often do you get charged or that kinda thing. I can only assume that there really is the risk of danger or there wouldn't be such demand for these huge calibers. As a NA hunter i can't imagine feeling under gunned with a 375 but i guess thats a testimony to these animals if they can make someone feel undergunned with one lol
 
c-fbmi said:
negative, 1899, why you got one for sale? A buddy of mine, machinist extrordinaire built himself one from the ground up, a double, beautiful work.
I have fired an 8 bore BPE but never a 4. No my double is a .470 NE and I have a Steyr 50 BMG.
Click to expand...

I thought maybe you were that machinist. ;)
 
Many guns will kill true big game, but to do it well is a whole 'nother matter. To be honest, I'm often perlexed by a few things regarding firearms choice for Africa, such as why North Americans seem to feel that the established Africa cartridges are merely supported due to nostalgia and legacy. They aren't, but rather have earned their reputations honestly, many of them over a century and the .450 Marlin isn't one of them.

You like guns, buy the right tool for the job, a controlled round feed (Ruger, Winchester, Kimber to start) .375. It confuses and irritates me that are people always trying to justify and unsuited rifles for use in Africa because they have a fondness for it or how it was marketed to them. Hunting takes tools, use the right ones for the right results. Yes, you can get by with the wrong tools in a lot of jobs, but you're very likely to make a mess of the job too. Leaving alone the danger side of dangerous game (of which I've admittedly only hunted the "Black Death", which is on the whole, a lot safer than writers would like you to think), the biggest risk is messing up a hunt you're dropping $20,000 or more on because you have an affinity for a peculiarly weak / low bullet weight and sectional density big bore in a push feed rifle.

A good Winchester Model 70 .375 will cost you very, very little and will do a lot more than that .450- including still launching 350gr bullets much quicker and flatter than the .450 will. You'll also find you'll be able to get ammunition when your separately packed ammunition (as required by IATA regs) doesn't show up in Africa, hell your PH will have a hundred or more rounds on hand from past clients leftovers alone. So, to wind down my gripes... just ditch the .450, and buy the right gun before you leave. Your .450's a peculiar gun, not big enough to move the bullet weights that allow reasonable SD's for Africa to any speed, and less effective than a straight Ruger Alaskan (I dare say I'm recommending the .375 Ruger... though you're only moderately more likely to find ammo for this too) on anything you shoot with it for a package of similar size.
 
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