newb ? .303 Semi
- Thread starter slipper
- Start date
No, not really. There was an experimental conversion of Lee Enfield bolt-actions to a fully automatic done by New Zealand during WWII that never went anywhere. The few examples in existence are thoroughly collected and won't be coming on the market while you hold your breath. It's called the Charlton.
The Globe conversions of SVT-40s are called Mohawks. Most of them didn't work very well, and being SVT-40s, they use SVT-40 magazines. Being made for a semi-auto - i.e the SVT-40 - the SVT-40 magazine is itself a prohibited device unless pinned to a capacity of not more than five rounds. Converting either the gun or the magazine it to another centrefire calibre doesn't change that. The way the regulations are written, the magazine for a centre-fire semi-auto long gun must not have a capacity greater than five rounds, even if you find you can use it in a gun that is not a semi-auto. It doesn't matter what can be done with a magazine, the law addresses it according to what it was made for.
Conversely, because the Lee-Enfield is a bolt action, the magazine for it can have a capacity greater than five rounds and is still legal, even if you find a semi-auto gun to use it in, like one of those rare New Zealand Charltons. This could mislead people like your buddy to claim there is a .303 legal loophole. The "loophole" isn't about the .303, it's that if a magazine is made for a gun that is allowed to have a magazine with more than five rounds, and it happens to work in a semi-auto centrefire long gun, you can use it. E.g. the LAR-15 pistol is allowed to have a ten round magazine because it's a handgun. The magazines are made for it and marked for it so they are not prohibited, but they happen to fit AR-15 type rifles so you can possess those magazines (even if you don't own the pistol for them) and use them in those rifles. If the LAR-15 maker hadn't bothered to make their own magazines, just got AR-15 magazines from someone else, those pistols would only come to Canada with AR-15 magazines pinned to five rounds. E.g. 2, the ten round magazines made for the AIA modernised Lee Enfield design in .308 is legal because it is made for a bolt-action. It happens to fit and work in M-14s, including the Chinese copies you can buy in Canada, so you can use that ten round magazine in that centrefire semi-auto long gun.
The Globe conversions of SVT-40s are called Mohawks. Most of them didn't work very well, and being SVT-40s, they use SVT-40 magazines. Being made for a semi-auto - i.e the SVT-40 - the SVT-40 magazine is itself a prohibited device unless pinned to a capacity of not more than five rounds. Converting either the gun or the magazine it to another centrefire calibre doesn't change that. The way the regulations are written, the magazine for a centre-fire semi-auto long gun must not have a capacity greater than five rounds, even if you find you can use it in a gun that is not a semi-auto. It doesn't matter what can be done with a magazine, the law addresses it according to what it was made for.
Conversely, because the Lee-Enfield is a bolt action, the magazine for it can have a capacity greater than five rounds and is still legal, even if you find a semi-auto gun to use it in, like one of those rare New Zealand Charltons. This could mislead people like your buddy to claim there is a .303 legal loophole. The "loophole" isn't about the .303, it's that if a magazine is made for a gun that is allowed to have a magazine with more than five rounds, and it happens to work in a semi-auto centrefire long gun, you can use it. E.g. the LAR-15 pistol is allowed to have a ten round magazine because it's a handgun. The magazines are made for it and marked for it so they are not prohibited, but they happen to fit AR-15 type rifles so you can possess those magazines (even if you don't own the pistol for them) and use them in those rifles. If the LAR-15 maker hadn't bothered to make their own magazines, just got AR-15 magazines from someone else, those pistols would only come to Canada with AR-15 magazines pinned to five rounds. E.g. 2, the ten round magazines made for the AIA modernised Lee Enfield design in .308 is legal because it is made for a bolt-action. It happens to fit and work in M-14s, including the Chinese copies you can buy in Canada, so you can use that ten round magazine in that centrefire semi-auto long gun.
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at over $1 a round (factory soft point) you wouldn't want to feed a semi auto .303 past 5 round mags anyhow 
.....that's not even taking into account how bashed you'd be after 2 10rd mags rapid fire.....not my idea of fun {loose fillings, bruised shoulder} ahhh who am I kidding? It'd be fun as he11.......just wouldn't want to do it all day long
.....that's not even taking into account how bashed you'd be after 2 10rd mags rapid fire.....not my idea of fun {loose fillings, bruised shoulder} ahhh who am I kidding? It'd be fun as he11.......just wouldn't want to do it all day long 
Nope, it'd fall under 12(3) Prohib as a Converted Auto.
Now, if you were to manufacture an all-new semi-auto only Bren...
The Globco 555, otherwise known as the Mohawk Carbine, was a semi-auto conversion of the Soviet SVT-40 rifle using (now rare) Finn capture rifles from the Winter War. The conversion work was done by Globe Firearms in Ottawa in the mid/late 1960s.
The rifles were fully modded to handle the .303 round, including new barrels. Magazines were modified to feed the .303 round and do not feed reliably with the 7.62x54R. All Globco magazines were cut down to 5 rounds; there were no "optional" 10- or 15-round mags offered.
The 555 CAN be a good, reliable rifle but you must know what you are doing if it is to be reliable. As modded, they have a very SHORT piston which gives them a VERY HIGH Port Pressure which can exhibit itself as extremely-high bolt speed. This has been known to cause damaged brass, violent ejection and even out-of-battery slam-firing which results in the destruction of the rifle. To PREVENT this behaviour, you need (a) a Tokarev gas-adjustment tool and (b) the knowledge to use it effectually, which means some knowledge of Port Pressures and the issues surrounding them.
Yes, there WAS the Charlton. I have seen and handled one and can attest that it was a wonderful adaptation from a time of utter desperation. Between New Zealand and Australia there were close to 4000 built. The New Zealand conversions (from Long Lee-Enfield rifles of Boer War vintage) were done by Charlton`s Motor Workshop, the Australian ones by Electrolux. Some were purposely destroyed after World War 2, most of the remaining guns, the bulk of production, destroyed in a fire. Today, less than a dozen survive. The one I saw had 2 magazines: a Lee-Enfield magazine and a modified Bren mag.
There also were original SMLE "Trench" magazines built during the Great War. Few were made, nearly ALL were recalled and destroyed and today they are one of the Ultimate Rarities. It would be silly to mod a $1000 magazine to fit a $300 rifle, even if you could get it to work..... which I doubt, being fully familiar with both rifles. And a regular Lee-Enfield magazine won't work on the converted SVT.
So your friend is wrong.
.
The rifles were fully modded to handle the .303 round, including new barrels. Magazines were modified to feed the .303 round and do not feed reliably with the 7.62x54R. All Globco magazines were cut down to 5 rounds; there were no "optional" 10- or 15-round mags offered.
The 555 CAN be a good, reliable rifle but you must know what you are doing if it is to be reliable. As modded, they have a very SHORT piston which gives them a VERY HIGH Port Pressure which can exhibit itself as extremely-high bolt speed. This has been known to cause damaged brass, violent ejection and even out-of-battery slam-firing which results in the destruction of the rifle. To PREVENT this behaviour, you need (a) a Tokarev gas-adjustment tool and (b) the knowledge to use it effectually, which means some knowledge of Port Pressures and the issues surrounding them.
Yes, there WAS the Charlton. I have seen and handled one and can attest that it was a wonderful adaptation from a time of utter desperation. Between New Zealand and Australia there were close to 4000 built. The New Zealand conversions (from Long Lee-Enfield rifles of Boer War vintage) were done by Charlton`s Motor Workshop, the Australian ones by Electrolux. Some were purposely destroyed after World War 2, most of the remaining guns, the bulk of production, destroyed in a fire. Today, less than a dozen survive. The one I saw had 2 magazines: a Lee-Enfield magazine and a modified Bren mag.
There also were original SMLE "Trench" magazines built during the Great War. Few were made, nearly ALL were recalled and destroyed and today they are one of the Ultimate Rarities. It would be silly to mod a $1000 magazine to fit a $300 rifle, even if you could get it to work..... which I doubt, being fully familiar with both rifles. And a regular Lee-Enfield magazine won't work on the converted SVT.
So your friend is wrong.
.
Bren gun drum magazines are specifically exempted from the 5 round limit:
Good luck finding one though.
Fascinating part of the "Prohibited Devices" section.........
(3) Paragraph (1)(b) does not include any cartridge magazine that
* (c) was originally designed or manufactured as an integral part of a firearm known as the Mauser Selbstadepistole C/96 ("Broomhandle"), or any variant or modified version of it, including the Model 1895, Model 1896..............
I take this to mean that a nice Mauser 20 shot made in 1897 that has the extended housing for 20 rounds..........does not require "pinning"? It also means that it can be classified as an "Antique", with no paperwork required.
Would my assumption be correct?
Cheers,
Bill
(3) Paragraph (1)(b) does not include any cartridge magazine that
* (c) was originally designed or manufactured as an integral part of a firearm known as the Mauser Selbstadepistole C/96 ("Broomhandle"), or any variant or modified version of it, including the Model 1895, Model 1896..............
I take this to mean that a nice Mauser 20 shot made in 1897 that has the extended housing for 20 rounds..........does not require "pinning"? It also means that it can be classified as an "Antique", with no paperwork required.
Would my assumption be correct?
Cheers,
Bill
That's great! Thanks for finding it!
I really wish someone could find an ad for the EAL .303 rifle. Anyone have anything like that? I really want to know where they were sold.
I really wish someone could find an ad for the EAL .303 rifle. Anyone have anything like that? I really want to know where they were sold.
If it ain't a Lee Enfield or a Garand, it's 5 rds.
Grizz
