Bought my first Enfield...

fenceline

fenceline

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Well, 2 of them.

The first one is a 1917 ShtLE (Short Lee-Enfield) No.1 MkIII

The second one is a 1950 Lee-Enfield No.4 MkII(F). When I bought it, I was thinking the bolt matched the "wrist socket strap" (correct term?). When I got home I realized I might be dyslexic when I found I had misread the numbers... The first four digits were the same... but the 5th and 6th were interchanged... And the left side of the receiver which appears to be one piece with the "strap" has a different number. Mish mash gun???

SN AA25701 (Bolt/Wrist? Strap)
SN AA25071 (Bolt Lever)
SN 3/50 PF196### (Left Receiver, "true serial number" hence the editted ###)

What are the chances of finding a bolt with a serial number so close? Is it possible that whoever was on the line had a bad day and was dyslexic himself?

Pics of the guns below....

201204107.jpg
 
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Guy was selling some guns on FC locally so I went to look at the 1950 Enfield and an SVT40 he had. When I got there he had the 1917 as well. Haggled and made a group purchase. My credit line made it happen haha. I got a fair price, just wasn't thinking I was going to buy three rifles haha :D
 
I've editted the original post to reflect a third number I've found on the receiver. I'm trying to google and search the forum for answers, but figured I'd post what I found in case someone has an answer for me before I find it myself.

There are 3 numbers on this gun. One on the left side of the receiver (very faint), one on the "wrist band" (which appears to be part of the receiver) and the "dyslexic" serial number on the bolt (almost a match to the band, two numbers switched around).

Do I have a complete mish mash gun or is there some history here that I'm missing (ya, not ever that lucky).

TIA.
 
If the numbers are that close it would seem to weird to me not to be a mis stamp rather than a mis match? Does the patina of the bolt match other metal parts and surfaces?

There have been all kinds of miss stamped Lee Enfields...
 
flying pig said:
If the numbers are that close it would seem to weird to me not to be a mis stamp rather than a mis match? Does the patina of the bolt match other metal parts and surfaces?

There have been all kinds of miss stamped Lee Enfields...
Click to expand...

The metal "blue" on the bolt handle seems to match the rest of the receiver. What is odd is that the reciever and the wrist have two different numbers, but are all part of one piece of metal on the gun. There is the "for sure" serial number on the left side of the receiver under "No4Mk2(F)" and then the other "AA" number on the left side of the receiver on the "wrist" section between the shoulder stock and the fore stock above the trigger group. Then of course the slightly off number on the bolt.

All very odd...
 
It's possible (with Enfields you must remember anything is possible) that the 2 rifles went through FTR together and the bolts got switched, it's not possible however to predict where the other rifle might be. That number 1 is beautiful by the way.
 
FTR is short for Factory Thorough Repair, Enfields would be sent back to a manufacturing plant to be reconditioned to 'as new' operating condition. This frequently would include forced matching of parts - in this case the original serial may have been ground off a replacement bolt and a new serial stamped on. The way it was done on this rifle suggests a mis-struck serial. Striking the Serial number on the left wrist could indicate that the rifle was in service with a foreign military or with a different branch of the services (other than army).
 
Thanks enefgee!

The original serial number and branding on the receiver is very very faint. Hurts the eyes to squint to see it clearly and a flashlight across the surface only mildly helps. I know it is only a possible explanation, but what you say makes sense for what I have.
 
The original SN would be electropencillled into the receiver, sometimes just barely deep enough to show metal under the Suncorite coating - if it was refinshed, or parkerized at a later date it becaomes very hard to read. The bolt at the rear of the stock (the through bolt) is definitely not factory (the Brits never used Robertson)
 
From the engraving I've seen on some others via google, the serial numbers look silver as in bare metal. The original serial number on this gun is the same color as the rest of the receiver, so it would appear the "FTR" treatment is correct.
 
SMLE receiver serial number will be on the right side of the receiver ring. The number should also be on the breech of the barrel (under the handguard), on the rear of the bolt handle, on the bottom of the rear sight leaf, on the nosecap (end of bayonet boss), on the bottom of the forend just behind the nosecap, on the magazine. Have a look.

3/50 PF196### are on the left sidewall of the receiver? These sound correct for Fazakerley. Usually during FTR the original serial would be retained. The AA numbers were obviously intended to be the serial numbers of record when they were applied. The 701/071 is just a stamping error. Butt socket, not wrist strap.
The Robertson socket head is most definitely not something the Brits would have done.
 
tiriaq said:
SMLE receiver serial number will be on the right side of the receiver ring.
Click to expand...

- Not seeing a serial number anywhere on the right side of the receiver.

tiriaq said:
The number should also be on the breech of the barrel (under the handguard)
Click to expand...

- No serial number anywhere on the barrel under the hand guards. It did have * BNP .303" 2"222" 18.3 tons (square)" * on the top left side,
and a "F" over "50" on the top right side. It also has the word "SURRAY" on the top of the barrel.

tiriaq said:
On the rear of the bolt handle
Click to expand...

- See posted pic. AA25071 x

tiriaq said:
On the bottom of the rear sight leaf
Click to expand...

- Nothing

tiriaq said:
On the nosecap (end of bayonet boss)
Click to expand...

- Nothing

tiriaq said:
On the bottom of the forend just behind the nosecap
Click to expand...

- Nothing

tiriaq said:
On the magazine.
Click to expand...

- No number on the magazine...


tiriaq said:
3/50 PF196### are on the left sidewall of the receiver? These sound correct for Fazakerley. Usually during FTR the original serial would be retained. The AA numbers were obviously intended to be the serial numbers of record when they were applied. The 701/071 is just a stamping error. Butt socket, not wrist strap.
The Robertson socket head is most definitely not something the Brits would have done.
Click to expand...

What type of screw should be there? I'm thinking now I have a parts gun, and no clue as to whether it will fire well, if at all with the mismatched bolt. It looks very nice and clean, just not what I originally thought it might be. Live and learn.
 
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