Shooting my Swede m1867 12.7x44R RB

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Metman2

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I took my son out for some fun last week. Amongst other toys, we fired a few dozen rounds through the m1867. He's quite the avid young marksman:

http://s1093.photobucket.com/albums/i433/nilsek/m1867/

Results for 100 yards were similar, but the slow bullets didn't cut the paper as nicely. While looking through the spotting scope at 100 yds, I could easily see the bullets flying into the paper. A few weeks before, I'd chronographed some of my loads at 560 fps MV.

Without going into too much detail: From this and several previous sessions, I have found that Trail Boss (7-10gr), SR4759 (19-23gr), and Pyrodex (30-40gr) all work well. I used my own 450 and 525 gr boolits, cast from nearly pure lead (Lee moulds).

With re-formed .348 Win cases, the brass is still too thick after fireforming to fully seat the bullets without bulging the case to the point it won't chamber. For the smokeless rounds this isn't a problem: I just seat the bullet as far as I can without bulging. Looks odd but seems to work at the distances I've tested. That isn't practical for Pyrodex, so for that powder, I used only re-formed 8mm Lebel and/or modified .50-70 Govt, so that there's no air space.
 
Paatz said:
That's pretty cool.:cool:
I'm planning to start reloading for mine this summer.
Where do you get your brass?
Click to expand...

.348 Win brass was from Higginson Powders
8mm Lebel was from Tradex

They both require annealing, re-forming (I use .357 expander, then ..50-70 expander), and trimming. My gun requires max case length of 43mm (1.7"). Apparently there are variations between individual guns, but that's what I found for mine.

Starline .50-70 Govt. I had to trim both the length and rim diameter. The latter from .660" to .645" in order to chamber properly. I suppose it would still be OK to use in a real .50-70 Govt gun.

The .50-70 brass was surreptitiously obtained from a guy in the U.S. It's getting difficult-to-impossible to export small purchases from U.S., thanks to the paranoid ITAR. Maybe some dealer in Canada that can arrange the proper export licence papers with a U.S. supplier, will eventually get some that people can buy. But it probably won't be cheap. $2 each versus $1 each for the 348 or 8mm. But they'll last a long time with the loads I'm using.

My final word after much searching and gnashing of teeth: go for the Lebel brass and learn to enjoy the adventure of making your own brass.
 
Just a suggestion for fireforming - I use .348 cases to make 11mm Japanese Murata. I don't mechanically expand the cases, just fireform them. Charge of fast burning smokeless, rammed cornmeal, white glue seal to keep the cornmeal in place. They blow out very nicely.
11mm Netherlands Beaumont from .50-90 Sharps is a bit more complicated. Trim, then squeeze down in an 8mm Lebel die until the case will just chamber in the rifle, then fireform as above. Annealing is important for this one.
I think the .348 or 8mm Lebel into 12.7 would work just about the same as the conversion to 1mm Murata.

Strikes me that 560fps is a bit on the low side.
 
tiriaq said:
Just a suggestion for fireforming - I use .348 cases to make 11mm Japanese Murata. I don't mechanically expand the cases, just fireform them. Charge of fast burning smokeless, rammed cornmeal, white glue seal to keep the cornmeal in place. They blow out very nicely.
11mm Netherlands Beaumont from .50-90 Sharps is a bit more complicated. Trim, then squeeze down in an 8mm Lebel die until the case will just chamber in the rifle, then fireform as above. Annealing is important for this one.
I think the .348 or 8mm Lebel into 12.7 would work just about the same as the conversion to 1mm Murata.

Strikes me that 560fps is a bit on the low side.
Click to expand...

Great minds think alike! :D Actually, I did try fireforming - unique powder, cornmeal, but no glue, and it didn't blow out very well. Perhaps the pressure didn't build up high enough. I should try again with glue. Ican see where this could lead to thinner walls than just reforming with expanders, as the latter is pushing the brass back toward the base.

Yes 560 is very slow. At this early stage, I'm interested in keeping pressures down, and short distances to paper targets don't require much velocity. I didn't chronograph the heavier Pyrodex loads - recoil was substantially higher, so I suspect they were more in the 1000 fps range.

I've managed to adapt an internal ballistics program from ARL (Baer and Frankel, 1962) that computes burn rates, pressures, and bullet motion in the barrel. It is useful to get an idea of pressures, MVel, etc. for non-tabulated loads. e.g. how low a load of powder X will stick a bullet in the barrel, and what max pressure will be created. Lots of fun but it involves some fairly elaborate FORTRAN programming, as well as plowing through other very technical references. I hope to post separately on this in reloading forum.
 
If I remember correctly, I used just under 14gr of 700X, with the cornmeal rammed in stages to get it well packed, then the load was capped with glue overnight to keep the cornmeal in place.
 
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