Reloading problem (newly setup press)

Exhopek

Exhopek

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Regina, Saskatchewan
Hi Guys,

I just got into reloading and I have a couple of problems. Here's the tale. Press is LEE Loadmaster, it was originally setup for .40 SW from the factory, bought the deluxe die kit for 9mm and put the new dies in. I have a 5 die press, universal decapping on station 1, case resizer and priming on station 2, powder through expander on station 3, bullet seater on station 4, and factory crimp die on station 5. I managed to setup the case feeder and powder drops, both works fine.

Issues:
1.) I managed to set the primer depth nicely where its supposed to just go in a little over flush. The problem is it kinda looks like the primer ram is out of position. I get kinda like a crescent moon imprint in the finished primer. Am I crushing the primer?

2.) Problem with OAL, Im shooting for a 1.120 length for a 9mm Luger, with 124 gr. RN Berrys bullets. I was able to set it up where I get consistent OAL if I do a bullet one at time. But when I make them one after another which is what a progressive press should be doing my OAL goes from 1.120 to 1,135 or 1,140. Now if I push down the bullet seater to 1.10 for the first bullet then do a progressive run I get my desired 1.120 except for the first bullet and the last two or three ones.

Any help would be great.


(PS. please dont tell me to buy a dillon coz I don't have enough money to buy one)
 
Question 1
Is there a little piece of brass on top of primer push rod?
Is it the right size of push rod?
Is the timing of the shell plate set correct?
Set it so the primer is flush. Not below flush.
2
One or 2 of the dies needs to contact the shell plate to stop the change in seating depth. I like to set it so the die hits the shell plate at the same time I hit the end of the arm stroke. I had my carbide resizing die and carbide factory crimp die bottoming out on the shell plate.
Hope this helps.
 
tigrr said:
Question 1
Is there a little piece of brass on top of primer push rod?
Is it the right size of push rod?
Is the timing of the shell plate set correct?
Set it so the primer is flush. Not below flush.
2
One or 2 of the dies needs to contact the shell plate to stop the change in seating depth. I like to set it so the die hits the shell plate at the same time I hit the end of the arm stroke. I had my carbide resizing die and carbide factory crimp die bottoming out on the shell plate.
Hope this helps.
Click to expand...

Question 1
-There was took it out it smoothed the primer but its still there a half moon/crescent
-I believe there is only two push rods, 1 is for large pistol like cal .45 and 1 is for small pistols, .40 and 9mm uses the same primers hence Im assuming same push rod.
-Timing of the shell plate... ??? Sorry newbie I don't understand this.
-Hmmm I thought the primer shouldn't be flush or sticking out but actually a little bit in? I looked at a commercially reloaded ammo and theirs is in deeper. I'm using CCI primers I don't know if that would matter.
2
-I have both maybe 1/16 above the shell plate. I make sure to get a full stroke everytime though with the arm hitting the end stop nubs. Thanks for this tip I will try this. By the way what difference in OAL is acceptable? .005?

Thanks again for the info.
 
Exhopek said:
1)[...]I get kinda like a crescent moon imprint in the finished primer. Am I crushing the primer?

2.) Problem with OAL, [...]my OAL goes from 1.120 to 1,135 or 1,140.
Click to expand...

1) shouldn't look like that. Most likely a timing issue, also might be adjusted a bit low (hence some crushing). You can call Lee for advice.

2) that's life on a Loadmaster. There is a lot of unpredictable flex in the system. And bullets aren't made exactly the same each time either, so when you measure OAL from the tip there will be some variance even if the press if "perfect". As on page 17 of my writeup (http://www.comrace.ca/cmfiles/dillonLeeHornadyComparison.pdf), I routinely found .015" variance, which is close to what you are finding.
 
Exhopek said:
Question 1
[...]
-Hmmm I thought the primer shouldn't be flush or sticking out but actually a little bit in?
Click to expand...
That is correct - in the perfect world, .003" to .005" below the case. This pre-loads the anvil and results in reliable, consistent ignition.

Having said that, the loadmaster is not terribly consistent in primer seating for the same reason that the bullet seating is here-and-there. So you will have it adjusted to reliably seat into the primer pocket, and some will be a bit over-seated, because the opposite condition (primers sticking out) can be dangerous - slamfire before the round is full in the chamber.
 
Mine seats the primer depth reliably its just that it leaves that half moon imprint. It makes me think that the rammer is out of position when it goes up.

Wish i read your write up before I made the purchase :p oh well.

You mentioned on the write up you use case lube. Im kinda thinking with all the five dies working something is binding causing the dies to push up and flex or get stuck and push up making the OAL longer. Since Ive said I can get upto .005 variance running the process one at a time. I dont use lube since it says carbides dont need them.
 
Unbolt press throw ouver left shoulder. Go and purchase a best quailty reloading press bolt to bench.
Adjust press never have problem again.
Names like Dillon or RCBS come to mind.
:>) Don
 
Exhopek said:
Mine seats the primer depth reliably its just that it leaves that half moon imprint. It makes me think that the rammer is out of position when it goes up.

Wish i read your write up before I made the purchase :p oh well.

You mentioned on the write up you use case lube. Im kinda thinking with all the five dies working something is binding causing the dies to push up and flex or get stuck and push up making the OAL longer. Since Ive said I can get upto .005 variance running the process one at a time. I dont use lube since it says carbides dont need them.
Click to expand...

If your dies feel"sticky" get some imperial die wax or Hornady unique ( in the white tub ) and apply VERY sparingly to every 5 or 10 pieces of brass, The residual lube left behind should "slick things up "
 
Exhopek said:
(PS. please dont tell me to buy a dillon coz I don't have enough money to buy one)
Click to expand...

Exhopek said:
Wish i read your write up before I made the purchase :p oh well.
Click to expand...

You knew what you were getting into but probably thought it couldn't possibly be that bad. Most people try to save money by purchasing an inferior product and in the long run end up spending twice as much.

P.S. I don't mean to sound ambivalent but hopefully this will help others save until they can afford the right machine for the job.
 
Exhopek said:
Since Ive said I can get upto .005 variance running the process one at a time.
[...]
I dont use lube since it says carbides dont need them.
Click to expand...
1) When you do one at a time, the only thing happening during seating is seating, so variance is minimal. As soon as other operations - mostly sizing - show up, you get flex. Because sizing has a variable amount of force, based on the amount required for that case, how clean it is, and so on, the flex is variable.

Don't worry about the OAL variance unless you are shooting bullseye or some other slow-fire precision sport. It makes no difference for plinking or action shooting.

2) you don't need lube... it just makes things somewhat easier / smoother, especially with tapered cases like 9mm. This is the case on any press system. A lighter-than-usual mist (of spray lube) works fine.

And ignore the Lee-bashing that you have, and will, receive. Your press can be made to work fine. It just takes more fussing to setup, more adjusting to keep it setup, and will have relatively more stoppages than the other two common brands.

Of course, if you dislike or are not psychologically suited to fussing and stoppages, and can afford another press, then you might consider a move. Just remember that the grass is always greener and other presses have quirks (fewer, but still there).
 
I was shown a dillon by a colleague and for the price it was pretty simple plus it was a manual index which really made me decide to go with the LEE. He spent 1500 on his and I spent 400 on mine so yeah thats one more reason.

Im gonna pull out all the dies and do the whole adjustment process again. See if that helps and Ill pick up a die spray from wholesale sports.

My concern with the OAL changing this much is more on the variance in pressure created.

One more thing Ive noticed is the primer rammer has a mark on one side telling me the rocker arm is applying more pressure on one side creating a gouge. Could the rammer be tipping slightly causing the half moon imprint on the primer?
 
Exhopek said:
I was shown a dillon by a colleague and for the price it was pretty simple plus it was a manual index which really made me decide to go with the LEE. He spent 1500 on his and I spent 400 on mine so yeah thats one more reason.
Click to expand...

That can't be right!

I just bought a brand new Dillon XL650 (progressive and auto-indexing) for $650 (all-in) shipped to my house in Ontario from Calgary.

I think you're describing the Dillon 550 which is even less expensive than the model I purchased.
 
Complete set with two or three die changes a primer sensor and who knows what else, he bought his from dillon, was sent straight to him from the US. So this includes shipping and taxes. Bought about 3 or 4 years ago.
 
xHEADSHOTx said:
That can't be right!

I just bought a brand new Dillon XL650 (progressive and auto-indexing) for $650 (all-in) shipped to my house in Ontario from Calgary.

I think you're describing the Dillon 550 which is even less expensive than the model I purchased.
Click to expand...

yea, but if he had it shipped by dillon, ups, paid broker's fee, etc, can you see where this is going?-
 
Yeah did that before i bought the press, watched it a couple of times and had my laptop beside me when I first did the setup.


I've been reading through the forums apparently other people have this problem and the recommendation is getting 3 dies to touch the shell plate to balance the forces
 
Once set up that LoadMaster should spit out 1000's of rounds!! It has a grease fitting!! Does it need grease?
Lube pistol brass by spraying lyman quick spray into a large ziplock bag (2 seconds worth). Throw in 300 pieces of brass agitate. Fill brass feed tubes and have at her. After I throw the loaded rounds into a sweat shirt and agitate to remove excess lube. I load 5000 45acp a year, using this method and carbide dies.
Do you have a manual with the press?
Does one of your dies not touch the shell plate? This is how the seating depth is controlled I thought.
 
I bought the press brand new theres a manual but Ive been following their videos instead. The videos always show backing out the dies after making contact. If there wasnt any give in the system the only thing that needs to be touching is the sizing die so you could size the full length of the brass. The bullet seater, universal decapper and carbide factory crimp die are all adjustable.

Thanks for the info on the lube :). How consistent are the oal on the ammo you are making?
 
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