Goat and Elk which bullet - need some opinions

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Riflesmith

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Ok I am headed on a goat and elk hunt next fall in B.C.. Normally I have no problem with such a decision however this one does cause me some trouble.

The goat is the primary animal and the shots can be right out to 500 yards. I will be shooting a .300 wsm and I need to decide between the 150 and 180 grain barnes ttsx.

I am thinking the 150 gr however with the potential for elk would I be crazy to think this grain bullet is under weight? I haven't received the rifle so I can' say which one shoots the best.

I have both on hand and will try both for accuracy but if it were you what you you use?
 
ivo said:
Whichever shoots better. A well placed shot with a 150gr TSX out of a .300WSM will drop any bull elk.
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like he said, shot placement shot placement, 150gr tsx out of a 300wsm, according to nightforce ballistic program looks like it can do the job any day of the week. enjoy
DATA DATA POINT BLANK RANGE DATA
MUZZLE VELOCITY (fps) 3250 3250 TARGET SIGHT-IN HIGH LOW
BULLET WEIGHT (grains) 150 HEIGHT DISTANCE POINT POINT
SIGHT HT ABOVE BORE (in) 1.5 (in) (yd) (yd) (yd)
SIGHT IN DISTANCE (yd) 100 2 186 115 213
ALTITUDE (ft) 0 0 4 231 135 268
TEMPERATURE (deg F) 59 59 6 267 152 311
PRESSURE @ SEA LEVEL (in Hg) 29.53 29.53 8 297 166 347
PRESSURE @ ALTITUDE (in Hg) 29.53 29.53 10 323 179 378
RELATIVE HUMIDITY (pct) 78 78
WIND VELOCITY (mph) 10
WIND ANGLE (deg) 90 ( 3.0 O'Clock)
INCLINE ANGLE (deg) 0
MAX APPARENT TRAJECTORY (in) 0
BALLISTIC COEFF 0.369


Sight Adjustments Needed Trajectory Values 1 MPH Drop From Time of
RANGE Elevation Windage Tgt Lead Elevation Wind Drift Tgt Lead Velocity Energy Bore Line Flight
(yd) MOA MOA MOA (in) (in) (in) (fps) (ft-lb) (in) (sec)
0 0.00 0.00 0.00 -1.5 0.0 0.0 3250 3517 0.0 0.0000
50 0.50 0.25 1.50 -0.3 -0.2 0.8 3113 3226 -0.4 0.0471
100 0.00 0.75 1.50 0.0 -0.7 1.7 2979 2956 -1.7 0.0964
150 0.50 1.00 1.75 -0.7 -1.7 2.6 2850 2704 -4.0 0.1478
200 1.25 1.50 1.75 -2.4 -3.0 3.6 2724 2471 -7.4 0.2017
250 2.00 1.75 1.75 -5.3 -4.8 4.5 2602 2254 -11.9 0.2580
300 3.00 2.25 1.75 -9.5 -7.1 5.6 2483 2053 -17.7 0.3170
350 4.25 2.75 1.75 -15.2 -9.8 6.7 2367 1866 -24.9 0.3788
400 5.25 3.25 1.75 -22.3 -13.1 7.8 2254 1692 -33.7 0.4437
450 6.50 3.50 2.00 -31.2 -17.0 9.0 2145 1532 -44.2 0.5119
500 8.00 4.00 2.00 -41.9 -21.5 10.3 2039 1384 -56.6 0.5836
550 9.50 4.75 2.00 -54.8 -26.6 11.6 1936 1248 -71.0 0.6591
600 11.25 5.25 2.00 -70.0 -32.5 13.0 1836 1123 -87.8 0.7386
650 13.00 5.75 2.25 -87.7 -39.2 14.5 1740 1008 -107.2 0.8225
700 14.75 6.25 2.25 -108.3 -46.6 16.0 1647 903 -129.4 0.9111
750 16.75 7.00 2.25 -132.1 -55.0 17.7 1559 809 -154.8 1.0047
800 19.00 7.75 2.25 -159.5 -64.3 19.4 1476 725 -183.8 1.1036
850 21.50 8.25 2.50 -190.9 -74.5 21.3 1397 650 -216.8 1.2080
900 24.00 9.00 2.50 -226.8 -85.8 23.2 1325 584 -254.3 1.3183
950 27.00 9.75 2.50 -267.5 -98.1 25.3 1259 528 -296.7 1.4344
 
The way I would go would be right down the middle with Barnes' 168 grainer. A little heavier for the elk, and it will carry better at range than the 150.

Whichever weight bullet you end up going with, you're on the right track with Barnes X's. I've been using them since they first cam out something like 25 years ago.

Shot my 6x6 bull elk last year in northern B.C. with my .375 Ruger and a 270 gr Barnes TSX - broke both shoulders at 217 yards. We recovered the bullet just under the hide on the off side - after I cleaned the bullet up at home, it weighed 269.3 grains - lost a whopping 0.7 grain. That was the first of any of the various incarnations of the Barnes X that I've ever recovered from a boat-load of game.
 
whitetailbuck said:
just to clarify, at 500 yards your drop would be 41.9 inchs and would still retain 2039 ft-lbs of energy
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Ballistics programs are nice, but it's always a good idea to actually shoot the bullet/load at various ranges and make up your data card from live fire. Too many times I've seen actual bullet drop significantly different from that of a ballistic program.
 
Why not split the difference and get the 168 gr TSX boattail?

Awesome bullet, very accurate, you should be able to get close to 3100 fps from your 300 wsm.
 
Varmit said:
Just curious, if you are prepared to shoot out to 500 yards, what scope are you going to use?
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I will have a zeiss diavari 5-15 on top. I should mention that only the goat is a possible long shot. The elk should be 300 yards and under. I have a range at the farm that I can shoot out to 600 yards.

Thanks for the opinions guys I was leaning towards the 150. The last goat hunt I did I had the 150gr ttsx's and I was confident shooting out to 450 yards. I shot nearly 200 rounds that summer getting ready and I was confident that with a rest the goat would be in trouble.

Now to load up and get shooting when the rifle arrives. I have a year to get ready and the shooting is going to be the easy part - losing 30lbs thats another story!!
 
jaycee said:
The way I would go would be right down the middle with Barnes' 168 grainer. A little heavier for the elk, and it will carry better at range than the 150.
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martinbns said:
Why not split the difference and get the 168 gr TSX boattail?

Awesome bullet, very accurate, you should be able to get close to 3100 fps from your 300 wsm.
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What they said or do like I did, especially if you're concerned about long distance, and go with the 175gr LRX.

IMG_1926.jpg
 
Hey jaycee, martin and steve you guys have given me something to consider here. THe only reason I was leaning towards the 150 Is because I was going to make that my whitetail load after the hunt. Poor reasoning I guess.

I am going to look into the 168 a little more seriously here. As for the barnes they leave me with all the confidence in the world regardless of weight. I have yet to see the 175gr before and will have to have a hard look at that as well.

Thanks guys
 
The 150 TTSX will do the job on both goat and elk. If the 180 shoots better, I'd say go with that one. My 300 WSM really likes my handloads in 165 and some of my 180's shoot really well. Actually, the most accurate load I have in my 300 WSM is 180 Grand Slam with IMR 4350. But, which ever shoots best/what ever you feel most confident shooting accurately, I'd go with that. 150 or 180 - either will kill 'em!
 
whitetailbuck said:
just to clarify, at 500 yards your drop would be 41.9 inchs and would still retain 2039 ft-lbs of energy
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Actually, it is moving at 2039fps and has 1403 ft-lbs of energy.

I'd use a 180gr Nosler Partition. The trajectory is just as flat and you know the Partition will perform well.
 
Dogleg said:
I'd look into the 168 grainer as well. The drop and drift line is a bit blurry between the 168 and 180 grain, it could come down to whatever shoots the best.
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Yes after all the input here I am going to try the 150 - 168 - and 180gr barnes. Whatever shoots best will get the nod. Thanks again gents for the advice!
 
i guess things have changed- it used to be that the MINIMUM for elk was a 308/180 and the 250 grain loading 338 was the preferred load- and distances were under 300 yards- elk are tougher and bigger boned than most people figure
 
I've shot two goats and five elk. I must say that the elk (at least in my case) were more difficult to put on the ground. Both goats dropped in their tracks with good shot placement, one with a little 120 g ballistic tip out of my 6.5 x 55 swede and the other with a 140g Barnes x from my 270 weatherby mag. I've shot my elk with a 140g partition (also from my swede) and the last one with a 225 Barnes from my .338. I can honestly say the smaller bullet killed every bit as fast as the heavy .338 round as it went right where it was supposed to go.

All of that to say that if you pick a quality bullet that shoots well out of your rifle and take only the shots you have confidence in you'll be fine. Many would say the little 120 g ballistic tip out of the 6.5 was too small for goat but he never twitched. I had confidence in the shot and the rifle and he never left his bed. One shot at the base of the neck did it and I was thankful as he was bedded on the edge of a very deep canyon.

PS: Shoot the goat in the shoulder
 
t-star said:
i guess things have changed- it used to be that the MINIMUM for elk was a 308/180 and the 250 grain loading 338 was the preferred load- and distances were under 300 yards- elk are tougher and bigger boned than most people figure
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I agree those are minimums I kept in my head as well. I do believe that with the great bullets we have a slightly smaller caliber and lighter weight bullets can be used with complete confidence.

I should note my comfort zone for shooting on the goat will be 450 yards absolute max with good conditions and the elk 300 yards max. I need to make 100% sure of shot placement. My only concern was whether the 150 grain bullet would be too light. I have no intentions of taking a less than perfect shot on the elk. The elk is not one of my must have animals and I will be more than willing to wait for a perfect shot. To say nothing of the ethics of the matter.
 
Riflesmith said:
I agree those are minimums I kept in my head as well. I do believe that with the great bullets we have a slightly smaller caliber and lighter weight bullets can be used with complete confidence.

I should note my comfort zone for shooting on the goat will be 450 yards absolute max with good conditions and the elk 300 yards max. I need to make 100% sure of shot placement. My only concern was whether the 150 grain bullet would be too light. I have no intentions of taking a less than perfect shot on the elk. The elk is not one of my must have animals and I will be more than willing to wait for a perfect shot. To say nothing of the ethics of the matter.
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actually, i took a little liberty including the 308 winchester in that crowd- the article said the'06/180 was the absolute minumum, but i believe that the elk won't notice the 200 fps or less difference- he also recommended using premium bullets( in this case barnes solids) but he was also talking about busting through bone- i, for one, don't buy the modern bullets and lighter weight arguement-i'd still rather use a tried and true rather than a "guess"
about the biggest "advantage " you can get in goat/elk country is an EXPERIENCED GUIDE and a HORSE- the author was alone and on foot- far too many herds of elk have "disappeared" in the morning mist while you were "setting up"
short of that, read up on elk by val geist- you can google him- most folks don't know this, but that man has forgotten more about elk than most folks including most hunters
 
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