357 max powder?

bandit86

bandit86

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Been searching reloading my 38 for cowboy load and 357'mag for long range shooting and I'm confused why the difference in the grains of powder, some more some less, yet the speeds are different.

http://www.reloadammo.com/357loads.htm

On this site, for 110 grain bullet if loading 9-10 grains of Unique gives mv of 1450-1550 fps, yet 23-24 grains of w296 Give m of 1992-2078 fps. Could not more unique be used to get to 2000fps? I thought max load grain was for over pressure but if a bullet is pushed 35% faster there would be more pressure, no?

My 357 new vaquero has a 4 3/8 barrel, what would be best powder in 38 cowboy and 357 full power load? How would it work in a 18 inch barrel?
 
Unique is a faster powder than W296.
This means Unique will produce a shorter (spike) pressure curve while W296 will yield a longer one. The area under the pressure curve is the energy imparted to the bullet.
A lot of the W296 will burn outside the barrel while Unique will be about 98% spent inside.
 
The listed charges come close to the safe pressures the gun can handle.
If you increase the amount of Unique, it will burn even faster in about the same time creating overpressure.
 
296 / H110 are the same powder! They are pistol powders . What is best for a short barrel only your gun and bullet combo will tell you. It also depends on what you are looking for as far as load performance as well, you can load anywhere from mouse fart loads to gravel and dynamite boomers in the 357 mag.
 
Fast powders are best for short barrels and light bullets.
For your 357mag, if you want max power in both short an long barrel, then you might want a heavier bullet and a slower powder. Winchester 231 or IMR4227 could be a good compromise.
I use Alliant 2400 and 158gr bullets. The powder is somehow wasted in pistol and great in rifle.
 
Win 296 (the same propellant as H110) is not a rifle propellant, but was formulated to work well in large cased magnum HANDGUN cartridges such as the 44 Mag, 454 Casull, and also your 357 Mag. It is commonly used in the 22 Hornet, which is mostly fired in rifles, but this does not make it a rifle propellant.

Because Win 296 is a much slower burning propellant than Unique, it will also give higher velocitied than Unique, when these cartridges are fired in an 18 or 20" rifle.

Remember, that your revolver has a short barrel and you cannot expect to get, or safely get the same velocities as when the same load is fired in a 7.5", 8.375 or even 10.5" barrel. Expect at least 25-50ft/s less for each inch which the barrel of your 357 Ruger is shorter than the one used by the people who compiled the data. Also do not try to load your particular Ruger to the same maximum loads as in say the former Ruger Redhawk which is a massive and very strongly built Ruger revolver.

Use Unique if you want to use less propellant and have less muzzle flash, use 2400 or Win 296 if you want more speed, but ALWAYS STAY WITHIN RELIABLE PUBLISHED DATA IN A RELOADING MANUAL.
 
Trying to limit everything to one caliber, 357 revolver with 4 3/8 barrel, 357 mares leg and 18" marlin 1897. Would it make sense to load two different bullets easily distinguishable, one for handgun and one for the rifle and the mares leg as a grab whatever?
 
bandit86 said:
Trying to limit everything to one caliber, 357 revolver with 4 3/8 barrel, 357 mares leg and 18" marlin 1897. Would it make sense to load two different bullets easily distinguishable, one for handgun and one for the rifle and the mares leg as a grab whatever?
Click to expand...

certainly
 
Some very confusing information given in this post.
A maximum load is a maximum load in 357, whether it is shot in a 4, 8 or 18 inch barrel.
Unique, and similar powder should only be used for light loads in a 357. Full pressure will be reached, but the bullet will not be up to heavy load velocity, even in a 4 inch barrel. Even in a short barrel you have to use slower powders to get maximum velocity.
Maximum velocity in a 357 revlover is reached with slow burning pistol powders, like H110/296 or 2400. With standard weight, 150-160 grain bullets, those powders will also likely give the fastest velocity in a 4 inch barrel.
The same load in a rifle will have about 300 fps more velocity than it will in a 6 or 7 inch revolver, mostly due to the loss of pressure between the cylinder and the forcing cone in the revolver..


Given by legi0n---"For your 357mag, if you want max power in both short an long barrel, then you might want a heavier bullet and a slower powder. Winchester 231 or IMR4227 could be a good compromise."

This is highly dangerous information.
Winchester 231 is one of the fastest burning powders available, much faster than Unique. It is as least as fast as the traditional fast powder, Bullseye.
 
H4831 said:
Some very confusing information given in this post.
A maximum load is a maximum load in 357, whether it is shot in a 4, 8 or 18 inch barrel.
Unique, and similar powder should only be used for light loads in a 357. Full pressure will be reached, but the bullet will not be up to heavy load velocity, even in a 4 inch barrel. Even in a short barrel you have to use slower powders to get maximum velocity.
Maximum velocity in a 357 revlover is reached with slow burning pistol powders, like H110/296 or 2400. With standard weight, 150-160 grain bullets, those powders will also likely give the fastest velocity in a 4 inch barrel.
The same load in a rifle will have about 300 fps more velocity than it will in a 6 or 7 inch revolver, mostly due to the loss of pressure between the cylinder and the forcing cone in the revolver..


Given by legi0n---"For your 357mag, if you want max power in both short an long barrel, then you might want a heavier bullet and a slower powder. Winchester 231 or IMR4227 could be a good compromise."

This is highly dangerous information.
Winchester 231 is one of the fastest burning powders available, much faster than Unique. It is as least as fast as the traditional fast powder, Bullseye.
Click to expand...

You're absolutely right H4831. I meant W571 not W231
That's why noone should just take advice from the internet without cross-checking with a reputable source.
 
Bandit,

I do not mean to be disrespectful in any way, but you need to understand some of the basic principles of reloading and powders. Assumptions and presumptive conclusions, such as was written in your post, can be very dangerous.

The maximum limits in a loading manual are based on the pressures reached by the powder, and not the velocity of the bullet. The bullet velocity shown corresponds to the pressures generated by the charge listed.

Faster powders burn more rapidly than slower ones. This means they reach their maximum generated pressures faster as well. The maximum pressure listed in the manual is the maximum SAFE pressure for that powder charge. Increasing it will almost exponentially increase the pressures beyond safe and well before the bullet even begins to exit the chamber. Increasing the maximum charge by 30% could result in the chamber catastrophically failing and causing serious injury to the shooter.

Before experimenting with different powder charges, firstly become familiar with the principles of reloading within the confines of the manuals. Buy tow, three or four different ones and compare results. Try the light load powders (trail boss) etc and then others. I use Unique and it is a great powder for light rifle and cowboy (revolver) loads, but that's it. If you want more velocity, you will have to go to a slower burning powder.

Many manuals reference the burn rate of almost all powders. Study how recommended powders seem to be grouped together, while light loads (cast - Lyman manual) use faster burning powders for much lower velocities.

Be safe man and check in here often, just to make sure.
 
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