V max expansion

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g-manz35

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I load my own 223 with 53gr V max for coyotes. My muzzle velocity is about 3250. I was thinking this would be a great round for coyotes. I shot one the other day at about 35 yards broadside. I hit it just behind the shoulder and caught it between the ribs. It exited between the ribs on the other side. The thing that surprised me is that all it left was a pin hole. I guess without hitting any bone or substantial flesh the bullet did not expand. I thought that at that speed it would have. I even checked to see if there was a lot of internal damage suspecting that just a small peice of the jacked exited, but from what I could tell it ran right through without expanding at all!? Am I expecting too much? The coyote did drop in its tracks so it my be a mute point. I thought that with a broadside shot there may not be an exit wound, but I'm starting to think this would be impossible.

Should have posted this under hunting maybe?

G
 
Sounds like not enough resistance just passing through some thin meat and organs. I could be wrong though.
 
I'm not surprised that vmax acted how it did at 35yds. IMO that's within 00 buck range, but that's for another section :) I'm sure the same test at 100 yds+ would give much better results.
 
I've shot the same bullet at targets which were backed by a steel tank.
Fmj went through both sides of tanks and the vmax just splattered.
 
id guess it hit too fast, and not enough to go through, with the vmax tip you need plenty of dense material to hit before it expands, you would have needed a hollow point for fast expansion.
 
A varmint bullet that hits "too fast" will simply expand more violently, not pencil through.

Like Sask Hunter suggested, it was probably just a fragment of that V-Max that went out the far side.

If the bullet had failed to expand, That 'yote would have run quite some distance before dropping, especially if no bone was hit.

Eagleye
 
Agree with Eagleye and Sask hunter

The bullet probably entered the yote, expanded and fragmented violently, blew the hell out of it's lungs and heart and a small hunk of the bullet exited.

You can't really judge bullet performance on exit wound appearance alone. It's what's inside that counts
 
Sask_Hunter said:
It was probably a piece of lead or jacket that made it through.

What did the inside look like?
Click to expand...

I wish I knew. I did not bother getting my knife out to find out. I thought it would not run through at that velocity. Most of the coyotes around here have a lot of mange so I hate to handle them too much. The way it dropped in it's tracks I'll assume that what exited was just a fragment. I'm used to hitting them with a 30-06 or 270 with my regular deer loads.

Thanks guys. G
 
Eagleye said:
A varmint bullet that hits "too fast" will simply expand more violently, not pencil through.

Like Sask Hunter suggested, it was probably just a fragment of that V-Max that went out the far side.

If the bullet had failed to expand, That 'yote would have run quite some distance before dropping, especially if no bone was hit.

Eagleye
Click to expand...
This makes sense to me so :agree:
 
What's the twist on your rifle ?

I've heard, key term heard, that if a bullet is spinning TOO fast, it will cause it to "bore" thru the target instead of expanding.

Faster isn't always better. It's all about application. If you WANT expansion, you could try slowing it down, or getting a heavier bullet. If it's getting the job done regardless of expansion, enjoy it for what it is.

Try testing some loads on gatorade bottles full of water. I would not be surprised if you find that expansion got from pin hole to violent as you slow it down.

I shoot A-Max bullets, which are pretty much the heavy versions of V-Max, out my 223 at about 2500fps, and at 100 yards you'd swear the target was hit by a 308 with how violent the expansion I get.
 
Conte said:
What's the twist on your rifle ?

I've heard, key term heard, that if a bullet is spinning TOO fast, it will cause it to "bore" thru the target instead of expanding.

Faster isn't always better. It's all about application. If you WANT expansion, you could try slowing it down, or getting a heavier bullet. If it's getting the job done regardless of expansion, enjoy it for what it is.

Try testing some loads on gatorade bottles full of water. I would not be surprised if you find that expansion got from pin hole to violent as you slow it down.

I shoot A-Max bullets, which are pretty much the heavy versions of V-Max, out my 223 at about 2500fps, and at 100 yards you'd swear the target was hit by a 308 with how violent the expansion I get.
Click to expand...

Sooo much fail....faster always= more expansion....ALWAYs.
Bullets don't "bore" regardless of the twist...
If he opened up that coyote he would have found that the bullet blew up, and all that exited was a fragment of lead/jacket.
 
g-manz35 said:
I load my own 223 with 53gr V max for coyotes. My muzzle velocity is about 3250. I was thinking this would be a great round for coyotes. I shot one the other day at about 35 yards broadside. I hit it just behind the shoulder and caught it between the ribs. It exited between the ribs on the other side. The thing that surprised me is that all it left was a pin hole. I guess without hitting any bone or substantial flesh the bullet did not expand. I thought that at that speed it would have. I even checked to see if there was a lot of internal damage suspecting that just a small peice of the jacked exited, but from what I could tell it ran right through without expanding at all!? Am I expecting too much? The coyote did drop in its tracks so it my be a mute point. I thought that with a broadside shot there may not be an exit wound, but I'm starting to think this would be impossible.

Should have posted this under hunting maybe?

G
Click to expand...

Lots of people seem to have mis-read the OP's post.
 
Conte; The OP later admitted not opening the 'yote up to examine damage.

Fast twists, in fact, make expansion even more likely to be violent, not "bore" through.

It may have appeared by the outside of the exit that this bullet left intact.
I'm willing to bet the farm that if opened, that 'yote's lungs would be mush.

I have shot a lot of 'yotes, some with FMJ bullets when that was still allowed.
Unless expansion takes place, or the spine or brain are hit, the dog will run from 50 to several hundred yards before dying.

Eagleye.
 
I had the same experience with a 53 grain, it was a broadside shot at 230 yards on a smaller sized coyote, between the ribs with a .22 cal hole on each side! My load isn't top of the line for velocity more like a 2800fps with a 1-9 twist. my follow up shot to the head however expanded violently!

I've used a couple hundred of these on gophers this year and must say I love them for accuracy but find the downrange results inconsistant, most of the time they seem to evaporate the gopher and leave a cloud of vapor where it was standing, and sometimes they seem to pencil through and do very little damage. Range was always between 50-200 yards, maybe 5% in total dont seem to perform up to standard.
 
Conflicting thearies! I like it. I had seen this some time ago and found it again. At about the 3:30 mark it shows a large fragment of the bullet that penetrated while the rest of the bullet exploded in the first 4". This MAY explain what happened.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCqmclsRQmM

Now I realize that coyotes are not made of balistic jelly, but if I had to guess I would say that the bullet did expand. The coyote drop to all fours and perished right there. Did not take a step. He looked like a dog laying at at his masters feet. Kind of weird!

G
 
Over the spring/summer I worked up a 53gr vmax load for this fall and winter season. Great accuracy as expected but have not been in the field with the 53's yet. Now that it's cooling off we'll be out there soon so we'll see what kind of results we get. I had been expecting to see results similar to the 40 & 55 gr vmax and the tried and true 55gr spsx loads. Now after reading this thread I'm wondering what we are gonna see with these 53's. Time will tell...
 
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