Can you win with a Glock?

The Baron

The Baron

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I just completed my BB course and am looking forward to my first IPSC match (not signed up anywhere yet, but will be looking shortly in hopes of shooting a match before Christmas).

When I re-entered pistol shooting last year I tried several different guns and decided I liked Glock best for their simplicity and reliability (I shot revolvers previously, back when gas was $.50/litre:rolleyes:). I've been shooting IDPA about a year and doing just fine with the Glock. I've enjoyed it so much I bought a Glock 34 and have been working with it a few months and liking it. Now looking at IPSC, the G34 will put me in Standard and I'd rather shoot production so that required me to pull my G17 back out (no point in shooting my G22 or G21 as there's no benefit to shooting "major" in production).

So, with that back story out of the way... I find myself on the line to start the shooting for my BB course. First few strings of fire we shoot simply for accuracy - 10 rounds slow fire to set a baseline. After doing so I see my groups are very poor compared to most other shooters. There's three guys with Beretta 92's and one guy with a CZ and they're all driving tacks whereas I'm barely able to hold A's slow fire. This is annoying and no, it is not me - my G34 shoots much better. Interestingly enough, the faster we go through the course the better I get. All other guys' groups start to open up with speed drills - some quite significantly - but my groups barely change and with the 4 stage 'mini-match" to conclude the training I win by a 15% margin. I'm in no way bragging because because a couple of guys had brain farts and/or equipment problems through the match and if they hadn't the results might have been different... my point is I'm now thinking perhaps I am handicapping myself with a Glock? I'm reasonably fast... for a newb... and now I am thinking if my group sizes stay tight at speed, should I be considering a gun that shoots better to begin with?

I don't want to start a "this gun vs. that gun" pissing match, just looking for some discussion. I've never been to an IPSC match, but my understanding it there are lots of CZ's on the line in production. My plan is to shoot a few matches with my Glock because it's familiar and I am competent/safe with it. I'm not at all concerned with winning, for now, but is it even likely to happen with a Glock? I like my Glocks a lot and if the SHTF I'd be happy to have one on my hip, but maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree for competition... :confused:
 
From what I understand Vogel's G 17 was box stock at the World Shoot. He is a machine. He finishes 30 seconds ahead of the next fastest shooter at the US IDPA Nationals shooting a Glock 34. Not being quiite as talented as Vogel, by a lot, I need all the help I can get so I shoot a M&P PRO.;)

Take Care

Bob
 
Bob would have won with any gun in Greece, but he would have done better if he'd been shooting a Glock set up the way he runs them in USPSA. There they get to do pretty much what the like to the trigger, whereas IPSC has the 5lb rule and no non OEM parts. Given that, you can win with a Glock, but it will be easier with a DA/SA gun like a Shadow or Stock.
 
ipscgraz said:
Don't forget why you are shooting...to have fun. Are you there for the score or the fun of the competition?

I shot for years with a Browning because I enjoyed it...but then I went full open. Had just as much fun with the hi power, but I was mixed in with a higher scoring crowd.
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I win and I have fun.
 
As those that pray at the Tupperware alter have already said; Yes - you can win with a Glock.
IF you are a pro or have significant skills above the others competing against you.

As much as they tout the prowess of Sevigny and Vogel in the past; Grauffel is laying to waste everyone else these days with his Tanfoglio - Just as Tyk did with his CZ.

You can't use these people as a reference.

If you are competing with similar skills to the guy next to you who is shooting with a Shadow or Stock II/III; you're toast.
They simply have far more advantages in the division.

You have the right plan; shoot what you have for a little while and then make a decision based on what your goals become.
 
Love to see Grauffel and Vogel go head to head. Maybe next year. It is always the archer not the arrow, although some arrows are made better than others.:>). For mortals, Grauffel and Vogel aren't from this planet, the DA/SA gun has the advantage in IPSC Production. The action loses the advantage when you do away with the minimum first pull trigger requirement.

Take Care

Bob
 
Freedom Ventures said:
If you are competing with similar skills to the guy next to you who is shooting with a Shadow or Stock II/III; you're toast.
They simply have far more advantages in the division.
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This is what I am thinking. With the baseline of slow fire accuracy, the SA/DA option seems to have a definite edge vs. the Glock with it's spongy 8# trigger pull (I have a trigger pull gauge and that's what all my stock Glocks are at, except the G34 which is closer to 7#).

My plan is to order some Warren Tactical tights and swap them out for the night sights on my G17, as I think that will be an improvement for me. I'll continue to train with a focus on increasing trigger control/accuracy and will perhaps see if I can find ammo that wrings a bit more accuracy from my G17 (I've tried 1/2 doz. different factory options so far). Then I'll get some matches under my belt and get a feel for the whole IDPA experience with the goals of safety, learning, fun and winning in that order of priority. In the meantime I'll try some shooting with other production class guns and see if anything grabs my attention.

Thanks guys.
 
The Baron said:
This is what I am thinking. With the baseline of slow fire accuracy, the SA/DA option seems to have a definite edge vs. the Glock with it's spongy 8# trigger pull (I have a trigger pull gauge and that's what all my stock Glocks are at, except the G34 which is closer to 7#).

My plan is to order some Warren Tactical tights and swap them out for the night sights on my G17, as I think that will be an improvement for me. I'll continue to train with a focus on increasing trigger control/accuracy and will perhaps see if I can find ammo that wrings a bit more accuracy from my G17 (I've tried 1/2 doz. different factory options so far). Then I'll get some matches under my belt and get a feel for the whole IDPA experience with the goals of safety, learning, fun and winning in that order of priority. In the meantime I'll try some shooting with other production class guns and see if anything grabs my attention.

Thanks guys.
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Try a Glock 3.5# connector, it will reduce your trigger pull weight down to about 5.5 pounds. Polish the internals, it will make your trigger smoother. Maybe try some handloads: 124 grain bullet and 4.1 grains of Vihtavouri 320, a soft, clean, and accurate load.
 
It can be done, but I think there's a bit more of a challenge to mastering that particular trigger system. I shot CZ and only recently started GLOCK and still can't shoot it well but at the very least you'll be original. Just about everybody is shooting CZ and, even if you don't win, at first, you'll stand out. :)
 
Your G34 shoots "much better" than your G17? The Berettas and CZ shooters shoot better at slow fire...so it must be your gun?

I'm barely able to hold A's slow fire. This is annoying and no, it is not me - my G34 shoots much better.
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You barely held the A zone?
 
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I really like my Tanfoglio's. I never really drank the Glock kool-aid,..but did drink from the HK Kool-aid cup. I actually think the HK series like the USP to be one of the most reilable pistols (i owned 3 USP's, and 2 P30-L's). I have pushed a few shooters to Tanfoglio's in my province....NONE have said.."oh, I wish I had my glock again"...
MY tanfoglios,..especially the my hard chromed Stock2's to be very reliable. Shoots very flat,..nice trigger, accurate, reliable. What more can you ask for...plus they actually look cool.

Bob Vogel is an awesome shooter,.I was also told the grip he puts on his Glocks is unreal. (ie: he can break bone with his grip)..Apparently he is only one of a handfull of guys that can grip some contraption.
 
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