375 Ruger Factory ammo

[Johnn Peterson]

Different man in a different time. He was very good friends with PO Ackley and yet a very different mindset, and a very different education base as well. Unfortunately I came along too late to meet either of these two. I have friends who were good friends with both these men, but as I said, never actually got to meet them. Why not? (Ted) knew Ackley quite well and my very good friend Bevan King spent weeks with PO learning how to make barrels and other neat sh!t. They have both related many stories but it's just not the same as hearing it from the MAN himself.
According to those that I know, who knew Keith personally, he suffered from a serious case of SMS (small man syndrome) which explains his almost obcessive single mindedness with large calibers, and his overall attitude, which comes through vividly in his writings.

ouch

 

[Gatehouse]

Different man in a different time. He was very good friends with PO Ackley and yet a very different mindset, and a very different education base as well. Unfortunately I came along too late to meet either of these two. I have friends who were good friends with both these men, but as I said, never actually got to meet them. Why not? (Ted) knew Ackley quite well and my very good friend Bevan King spent weeks with PO learning how to make barrels and other neat sh!t. They have both related many stories but it's just not the same as hearing it from the MAN himself.
According to those that I know, who knew Keith personally, he suffered from a serious case of SMS (small man syndrome) which explains his almost obcessive single mindedness with large calibers, and his overall attitude, which comes through vividly in his writings.

He definitely had a big dose of SMS. As you say, it comes through vividly in his writings. I'm sure that little guys had an ever tougher time growing up back then than they do now, so I could see how he developed a huge case of SM syndrome.

 

[Silverback]

I was at Prophet River last week and they sold two 375 Rugers that week, of course I bought one of them, Gatehouse could be right, all hail the new king!

 

[Boomer]

Elmer may well have suffered from SMS, but during his formative years, jacketed bullet technology was in its infancy, and the only way to get good bullet performance was to load to moderate velocities and go big or stay home. If you've been taught that something works, and have seen it work first hand, it takes very few failures of something untried to reinforce those beliefs. Elmer's contemporaries had other points of view, otherwise we'd probably still be hunting with .45/90s, but that neither diminishes his observations or his contribution to our knowledge base.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

I've made mention of it previously after following many of his articles in various publications, in the mid 70s I had the good fortune of meeting with him, on two occasions. I consider these meetings to be the high points in my years of shooting. The 1st meeting was a very informative and enjoyable day spent with him at his home in Salmon Idaho. And again, this picture, presently serving as my avatar, was taken as I was preparing to depart.

My 2nd meeting with him took place at a dinner in his honour after a gun show in Kalispell Montana.

Even prior to that time and at a point at when I was first really getting involved in handgun shooting, I sent him at least two letters, making inquiries to aspects of shooting and hunting I was unsure on. Replies were timely and to the point.

I admit to being a fan, that's a matter of record and truthfully, I was quite suprised by the SMS insinuations. In my meetings with him, in correspondence with him, in his articles published in various magazines and in his books, I have never seen any indication that would even remotely confirm that. What I have found to be closer to the truth is his writings, opinions and conclusions are the result of what he found to work in the field.

Yes, his experiences and opinions differ sometimes considerably from those of some of his other 'colleagues' of the day, Jack O'Connor for example. While admittedly I am primarily a fan of Elmer, I have nothing against Jack and contrary to Elmer, I do have a 30-06 and a pair of 270s.

Technology, especially that of bullets, has evolved considerably since Elmers hay-day but part of his rationale for bigger may be explained by this quote.

SMS, I don't think so.

 

[philthygeezer]

Love all the poking and flicking. Good discussion and great thread.

I wouldn't mind if the 375 Ruger and 338 Federal prove to be successful in the long term, like the 7mm-08. I've settled into an H&H, but the notion of a lighter weight 375 Ruger with the same power sounds interesting. Wonder if a .375-06 is a useful wildcat in a .338 Federal kind of way...

 

[Boomer]

SMS, I don't think so.

I think the SMS comments come from the injuries Elmer suffered as a child in that fire, and had nothing to do with his preferring a .338 for antelope. Few hunters on this side of the Atlantic have seen as much game shot (with the possible exception of Dogleg and C-FBMI) and I have no doubt that those observations caused him to draw certain conclusions and form pretty strong opinions towards certain cartridges. Since he was christened the "Dean of Shooting", and had the audacity to disagree with Jack O'Conner, Townsend Whelen, and Steward Edward White, he was unfortunately considered a blowhard in some circles. This was both unfair and unkind, as Elmer's observations as to how bullets performed on game where reported honestly and and accurately, the fact that they did not jive with the observations of others is irrelevant.

 

[Boomer]

Love all the poking and flicking. Good discussion and great thread.

I wouldn't mind if the 375 Ruger and 338 Federal prove to be successful in the long term, like the 7mm-08. I've settled into an H&H, but the notion of a lighter weight 375 Ruger with the same power sounds interesting. Wonder if a .375-06 is a useful wildcat in a .338 Federal kind of way...

You could try a .375-284, the wildcat was apparently successful in the 99 Savage, and has the same capacity as the longer '06 case. |Chambered in a standard action length bolt gun, the bullet could be seated well out to maximize the powder capacity.

 

[Johnn Peterson]

I think the SMS comments come from the injuries Elmer suffered as a child in that fire, and had nothing to do with his preferring a .338 for antelope. Few hunters on this side of the Atlantic have seen as much game shot (with the possible exception of Dogleg and C-FBMI) and I have no doubt that those observations caused him to draw certain conclusions and form pretty strong opinions towards certain cartridges. Since he was christened the "Dean of Shooting", and had the audacity to disagree with Jack O'Conner, Townsend Whelen, and Steward Edward White, he was unfortunately considered a blowhard in some circles. This was both unfair and unkind, as Elmer's observations as to how bullets performed on game where reported honestly and and accurately, the fact that they did not jive with the observations of others is irrelevant.

I recall the stories of his being burnt and it was something that also came up in my first day long visit with him. I don't and didn't equate the injuries he sustained with SMS. Something about the two don't fit together, however, perhaps another one of the many things in life I don't understand.

At the post gun show dinner I had Elmer sign a couple of his books for me. Bit of a side issue but one of the people at the gun show dinner in Kalispell who knew him well, related a couple of 'stories' to a small group of us. In telling us he stressed that because of their political incorrectness, they are not stories one would find in any of his books. The first took place at an eatery on the east coast during his attendance at an NRA convention or function. The second had to do with a prototype of the S&W model 29, with handloads, that he gave to a friend in Africa to test. The politically incorrect part was the 'test results'.

'Goodie'
I neglected to mention, and also following his take on a shotgun guage and shot recommendation for it, my shooting buddy and I both bought a 25lb bag of Lawrence #3 shot from him.