hunting capacity

My 10 shot magazines are stamped with the following . . .

RRA MODEL LAR-15 PISTOL MAGAZINE
.223/5.56 NATO-10 ROUND CAPACITY

Under Canadian Law, these magazines are legal for use in AR-15 rifles or other semi-auto rifles which accept AR-15 magazines. The only disadvantage I can see in their use is that they won't lock into (my rifle) unless the bolt is locked back. However, their use in a hunting rifle is subject to the hunting regulations in your particular province, as some provinces require a maximum of 5 rounds in a magazine when hunting. Why magazine capacity matters when you are limited to a single animal on your license is a mystery, but there it is.
 
tvismyjob said:
OMG!!! now I'm really confused....I think what I'll take from all this, is I can legally use the LAR 15 10 round mag in my vz58 rifle for plinkin but if I go hunt some coyotes I shoud switch to a pinned 5 round AR mag of my choosing just to be safe from any game warden I may run into.

THX for all your info
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No, you can hunt with it as the magazine in question is legal under federal law. However, it never hurts to ease the mind by calling MNR...which you should do if there is any doubt at all.
 
sobo4303 said:
Ok, the printout you provided emphatically states that the magazine can be used in the LAR-15 Pistol. Item 2(b) goes on to further unequivocally state that it is not an adaptation for of the mag used in the semi-auto rifle. The RCMP accepts is an acceptable handgun magazine. We are not allowed in Canada to hunt with handguns. Will this mag fit in a rifle - you folks say it can. The law says that if you put more than 5 in it while in the semi-auto rifle, then it's illegal. That's it. To clarify the comments, if the OP wants to use, break a leg, just don't use more than 5 rounds, as stupid as it sounds.

The excerpt from the Bullentin I copied clearly states this fact.

2. Magazines designed or manufactured for both centrefire calibre rifles and handguns

Magazines designed to contain centrefire cartridges and designed or manufactured for use in a semiautomatic rifle are limited to five cartridges. However, magazines designed to contain centrefire cartridges and designed or manufactured for use in a semiautomatic handgun are limited to 10 cartridges. Magazines designed or manufactured for use in both semiautomatic rifles and semiautomatic handguns are subject to the limit of five cartridges.
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The thing you're not getting is it's the magazine thaat has the regulated capacity, not the firearm. If the magazine is a legal 10 round pistol maagazine, it does not matter what firearm it is used in. Quite. Frankly, this topic of discussion is 6+ years old, and it should not be necessary to continually explain it.
 
Quite frankly, I really don't understand what all the bashing is about. I'm not trying to argue, just trying to ensure that nobody gets into trouble as a result of internet advice.

I called the CFO number this morning and asked her to clarify the bulletin I posted and the Criminal Code section for me this morning. It came down to this, the maximum allowable capacity of the magazines in a semi-auto is 5. She referred me to the last sentence in Bulletin #2 which says "are subject to the limit of five cartridges". She interpreted to be pinned to 5 if the mag is to be used in a semi-auto rifle and also stated that if the magazine capacity exceeds 5 rounds, then it gets complicated as the magazine then comes under the definitions of being a prohibited device.

As to some of the comments, I get it. I also read the applicable section in the Ontario hunting regulations. It states:

"Under the the Criminal Code of Canada you cannot possess any clip/magazine that holds more than five shots for a semi-automatic centre fire non-restricted firearm unless that clip/magazine has been specifically exempted, pursuant to the firearms regulations."

According to the bulletin I posted earlier, it appears to allow the use of the pistol magazine the OP questioned into a rifle but only if it is exempted under the regulations (CFO's office?). With the Ontario hunting regulations wording (which is enforced by the Wildlife Officers), it says "unless the clip/magazine is specifically exempted, pursuant to the regulations". It was late last night, so I didn't check if that particular make/model of magazine is specifically listed as an exception or not. At this point, does it really matter?

My point in this mess and this post is that ultimately, if the OP uses the mag in question, or any mag for that matter, the judgement as to compliance with the regulations is going to be made by by a Wildlife or RCMP officer based on their interpretations of all the information as opposed to some of the advice provided to date on this subject. Rightly or wrongly, their interpretation may not agree with the opinions or objections of some Gunnutz members (as suggested by the lady in the CFO's office I spoke to) - which could result in a complicated and messy situation for the OP, who just wanted to use his rifle to shoot some 'yotes in the first place. Why not just suggest to avoid the risk of any trouble and hassle by just using a pinned mag in the first place?
 
This law is very clearly defined, it is not up for interpretation or opinions like you state.

semi-auto rifle mags =5
pistol mag=10
IN ANY FIREARM, it is the magazine that is regulated not the firearm, forget about the firearm, if you have a mag built to be a rifle mag it is a prohibited item if it holds more that 5 rounds, if that same manufacturer builds that same magazine but stamps for pistol use then 10 rounds are 100% legal.

In Ontario the OP is good to go, in other provinces there may be other restrictions but that would be because of a provincial law dictating the rifles capacity for hunting purposes only, nothing to do with the legality of the magazine.
 
Op, call the MNR to be sure. Those 10 mags are legal to own and use in federal law, Ont. may have laws to prevent them being used when hunting. Ont. cant undermind federal law but they can place further restrictions. I have been looking online to try to find a clear cut answer for you but cant find one. I have found forms that say those mags may be used for hunting. However other web pages say the opposite. MNR and Ont hunter ed program web pages say 5 rounds only. The MNR and hunter ed page could just be quoting federal law as from what I gather the 10 shot mags are a loophole thing that perhaps they have left off the pages. Such a pain in the but trying to sort gun and hunting law here in Canada isnt it. We would be better off if liberals were not allowed to make gun laws.
 
I thank you all for your info. I am sorry this question seems to have stirred some controversy, I asked it only because the Ontario regulations seem to be a bit unclear and shooter friends of mine seem to have different opinions as well.
 
I just got off the phone with the MNR, they said they have NO restriction other than the 3 shells in a shot gun. Info found on there web sit is in general form and thats why it says 5 round limit. The CO said as far as the MNR goes It is legal to use you 10 round Pistol mags for hunting, they have yet to place further restrictions( he also told me its doubtful that they ever will). He did say to call the township and county to check if your municipality has any restrictions. Hope this helps you OP. My call was less than 5 mins long, in the future it may be best just to give them a quick call. For anyone that thinks this is BS heres the number to call 1 800 667 1940
 
sobo4303 said:
Quite frankly, I really don't understand what all the bashing is about. I'm not trying to argue, just trying to ensure that nobody gets into trouble as a result of internet advice.

I called the CFO number this morning and asked her to clarify the bulletin I posted and the Criminal Code section for me this morning. It came down to this, the maximum allowable capacity of the magazines in a semi-auto is 5. She referred me to the last sentence in Bulletin #2 which says "are subject to the limit of five cartridges". She interpreted to be pinned to 5 if the mag is to be used in a semi-auto rifle and also stated that if the magazine capacity exceeds 5 rounds, then it gets complicated as the magazine then comes under the definitions of being a prohibited device.

As to some of the comments, I get it. I also read the applicable section in the Ontario hunting regulations. It states:

"Under the the Criminal Code of Canada you cannot possess any clip/magazine that holds more than five shots for a semi-automatic centre fire non-restricted firearm unless that clip/magazine has been specifically exempted, pursuant to the firearms regulations."

According to the bulletin I posted earlier, it appears to allow the use of the pistol magazine the OP questioned into a rifle but only if it is exempted under the regulations (CFO's office?). With the Ontario hunting regulations wording (which is enforced by the Wildlife Officers), it says "unless the clip/magazine is specifically exempted, pursuant to the regulations". It was late last night, so I didn't check if that particular make/model of magazine is specifically listed as an exception or not. At this point, does it really matter?

My point in this mess and this post is that ultimately, if the OP uses the mag in question, or any mag for that matter, the judgement as to compliance with the regulations is going to be made by by a Wildlife or RCMP officer based on their interpretations of all the information as opposed to some of the advice provided to date on this subject. Rightly or wrongly, their interpretation may not agree with the opinions or objections of some Gunnutz members (as suggested by the lady in the CFO's office I spoke to) - which could result in a complicated and messy situation for the OP, who just wanted to use his rifle to shoot some 'yotes in the first place. Why not just suggest to avoid the risk of any trouble and hassle by just using a pinned mag in the first place?
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you should have asked her " can i legally use a 10 round pistol magazine in a semi auto rifle " ......
 
Sobo,

I suspect that you have not read the Newbie FAQ thing I wrote.
The link is in my sigline below.
This is the relevant mag capacity stuff.

tootall said:
Q: How many rounds can I have in my gun?
A: This is a never ending source of confusion. Pay attention, I'll try to sort it out.

SHORT ANSWER:
Rimfire rifle magazines - no limits
Magazines designed for centerfire or rimfire pistols - 10 rounds
Magazines designed for centerfire bolt/pump/lever firearms - no limit.
Magazines designed for centerfire semi-automatic rifles - 5 rounds

LONG ANSWER:
First thing to understand is that there is FEDERAL FIREARMS LAW, there is FEDERAL HUNTING LAW (Migratory game birds, ducks and geese), and there are different PROVINCIAL HUNTING LAWS.
First up, the federal firearms laws. This is the one we all have to follow, whether we hunt or not.

-For rifles with any type of action other than semi-auto, there is no limit! NONE, ZERO, ZILTCH, NADA.
Same for .22 rimfire, even if it is semi-auto. No Limit. A 50 round mag for a R***r 10-22 is fine.

-For semi-auto centrefire rifles, the limit is 5 rounds.
Note that this is 5 rounds in the mag, and does not include the one in the chamber. 6 rounds total, if the design permits it.
The one exception is for the M1 Garand, as it uses 8 round clips.
Also, any belt/link designed for belt fed machine guns designed before 1945 is exempted from the 5 rounds rule. A .223 belt would not qualify, based on age.

-For handguns, the mag limit is 10 rounds. Again, 10 plus one in the tube, 11 total.

Strangely enough, the wording is such, that the limits are on what the mag was designed for, rather than what it is used in at the moment. So if a rifle and a handgun use the SAME mag, and you switch them around, the mag that came out of the rifle would still be limited to 5, even if used in a handgun, while the 10 round handgun mag would in this case be OK in a rifle.
I don't make the rules, I just report them.:confused:

A good part of the confusion rests with the Fed FA laws getting confused with hunting laws, both Federal and provincial.

Migratory bird hunting is subject to federal rules. These laws state that the gun (a shotgun, obviously) be limited to 3 rounds total. That is a total of three, as in one in the chamber and two in the magazine. Most semi-auto shotguns have a removeable plug that allows you have 5 rounds when you are not hunting migratory birds. If you want to hunt crows, starlings, etc. or if you want to do a Tactical shoot, the Migratory rules do not apply. However the Federal Firearms Laws still do, so 5 rounds max for a semi. (No limit for a pump shotty!)

Provincial hunting rules differ across the country. Check in your area.

As with the full metal jacket ammo issue above, some Firearm instructors started by teaching hunting courses, so have the habit of mixing hunting and firearms law together, incorrectly.
Another source of confusion is the bizarre legal language the federal laws use. An example of this is the case of the Lee-Enfield magazine. It is a 10 rounder. As it is used in a bolt action, there are NO size limits. However, during WW2, there was a training gun made from old Lee-Enfields converted to Full-Auto fire (it can be done, but it was a pig-ugly contraption).
http://ww w.guncity.co.nz/303-charlton-machine-gun-xidp129426.html
Consequently, the laws make a specific exemption for the L-E mag, even though it is not neccesary to do so, as the mag was designed for the bolt action L-E rifle.
Not easy to follow, and I may well be corrected myself. (Twice, so far!)
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tvismyjob said:
I thank you all for your info. I am sorry this question seems to have stirred some controversy, I asked it only because the Ontario regulations seem to be a bit unclear and shooter friends of mine seem to have different opinions as well.
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It's unfortunate that it had to get so painful, but it's also helpful in a way. Many hunters and, how to put it nicely, casual fiream enthusiasts, have no clue that such regulations exist. They think that if a magazine is in a rifle, then it is a rifle magazine and thus restricted to 5 round capacity. The problem is that this myth has been perpetuated for so long it has become dogmatic to some. And nothing gets defended like a dogmatic fact. Threads like this, though they may cause localized hurt feelings, are ultimately positive in that they enlighten the ill-informed. Hopefully everyone has learned something from this discussion and we are all the better for it.
 
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