Suggestions for an-all-around rifle....

CreamySmooth said:
Thanks "Dad". I needed to be told that I don't "need" a high cap mag. But you know what? Yer right. I don't need one. I WANT one. That doesn't mean I have to shoot the thing empty, but if I want, I can carry a big honkin magazine so I can look as Tactical as I damn well want. Just cause I wanna.

I shoot an elk, usually a moose and 1 or 2 deer a year, plus odd geese and ducks. So I eat lots of venison, and I do it with cool a$$ guns that are blacker than my soul whenever I can. So I eat lots of venison. And lots of "chicken dinna".

Thank you for the Fudd'ing.
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The bull Elk and Moose pics with rifles blacker than thy soul...? Still looking forward to seeing them.
 
Nobody has mentioned flinching. A newbie smacked by his or her first shot with a 300 win mag may well wind up with a flinch for life, I have seen it happen with stupid dads with their kids at the range. I run a shotgun shooting school for youngsters and adults and soon had to buy a Remington 1100 in 28 ga and it gets lots of use.
Because I don't want to have started a flincher, they may well never get over it.
I'd recommend a 308 to anyone starting out with a centrefire hunting rifle. Lots of surplus 7.62x51 ammo for practice, check if it's corrosive though.
 
In actual use I see the 6.5x55 as being indistinguishable from the 7x57, .260 Rem, .270 Winchester, .280, .308, .30-06 and a host of others. The trajectories of these are so close, that at any hunting range all but the most expert cannot distinguish a difference, out to 400 yards or more within a few inches of each other typically despite common perceptions. You do start to see trajectory and energy differences at range with the magnums, undeniably, but that gets into territory where most casual hunters do not have the skills yet to make use of them (I myself wouldn't include myself in the 400 yards+ with confidence club, where a magnum is seriously coming into its own). Flinching is a serious consideration, and while I don't see a .300 Win Mag as a particularly thumping round, all tolerances vary and in general hunting parlance it likely is a tad stout.

Back to the point, nothing wrong with the 6.5x55, I like its sectional density, but in real world use it doesn't do anything others won't. That said, we all have our preferences, and I like .257 Roberts, 7x57, and .375 H&H. Each for no particular strong reason I couldn't find in another cartridge, but I'm attracted to their history/panache/rifles chambered therein.

For a new hunter, have to admit they won't go wrong with a .308, a .270, even a .243 or .25-06 if not an old had with a centerfire. I'm as guilty as the next of getting overly married to a chambering.
 
Buy a Rem 700 for $700 in 308. If he's a flincher, then put a brake on it. That is a lot of rifle for someone to grow into....plus 308 is everywhere and can take most anything.

I really stay away from the 'one gun to rule them all' mystique.
 
Ardent said:
In actual use I see the 6.5x55 as being indistinguishable from the 7x57, .260 Rem, .270 Winchester, .280, .308, .30-06 and a host of others. The trajectories of these are so close, that at any hunting range all but the most expert cannot distinguish a difference, out to 400 yards or more within a few inches of each other typically despite common perceptions. You do start to see trajectory and energy differences at range with the magnums, undeniably, but that gets into territory where most casual hunters do not have the skills yet to make use of them (I myself wouldn't include myself in the 400 yards+ with confidence club, where a magnum is seriously coming into its own). Flinching is a serious consideration, and while I don't see a .300 Win Mag as a particularly thumping round, all tolerances vary and in general hunting parlance it likely is a tad stout.

Back to the point, nothing wrong with the 6.5x55, I like its sectional density, but in real world use it doesn't do anything others won't. That said, we all have our preferences, and I like .257 Roberts, 7x57, and .375 H&H. Each for no particular strong reason I couldn't find in another cartridge, but I'm attracted to their history/panache/rifles chambered therein.

For a new hunter, have to admit they won't go wrong with a .308, a .270, even a .243 or .25-06 if not an old had with a centerfire. I'm as guilty as the next of getting overly married to a chambering.
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and I have to admit ..u getting wise in ur old age sir ...
 
mbonner said:
Nobody has mentioned flinching. A newbie smacked by his or her first shot with a 300 win mag may well wind up with a flinch for life, I have seen it happen with stupid dads with their kids at the range. I run a shotgun shooting school for youngsters and adults and soon had to buy a Remington 1100 in 28 ga and it gets lots of use.
Because I don't want to have started a flincher, they may well never get over it.
I'd recommend a 308 to anyone starting out with a centrefire hunting rifle. Lots of surplus 7.62x51 ammo for practice, check if it's corrosive though.
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I have to agree with this. Do yourself a favour and start off with a lighter recoiling cartridge. I aquired a nasty flinch when I started hunting with a 54 cal muzzleloader- I got a nasty scope kiss (bled like a stuck pig) when I started shooting it, and 15 years later I still have to concentrate on NOT flinching. That's my 2 cents
 
Ardent said:
Got some pics of the good bulls with black guns? I believe you, I just like to see the different sides of the sport, lets see em. :)
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7.62 x 39 shot just north of Whitecourt, Alberta fall of 2012. 1 shot kill.

moose_zps29453ccd.jpg
 
SwL_Wildcat said:
7.62 x 39 shot just north of Whitecourt, Alberta fall of 2012. 1 shot kill.

moose_zps29453ccd.jpg
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That is wrong on so many levels! That poor bull went on to the happy hunting grounds in shame... he can't sit at the cool table in the heavenly lunch room...




Congrats on the bull... 7.62X39 eh? What bullet did you use on the bull???
 
hoytcanon said:
That is wrong on so many levels! That poor bull went on to the happy hunting grounds in shame... he can't sit at the cool table in the heavenly lunch room...




Congrats on the bull... 7.62X39 eh? What bullet did you use on the bull???
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Sellier & Bellot 123 Gr soft points at about 55 yards. It was my buddies bull, so I wasn't the one who pulled the trigger.

I honestly don't believe in the "not enough power" argument. I have shot quite a few moose with my 243. Shot placement is trump. Don't shoot farther than your ability or the power of the round you are using. Had the bull been at 150+ yards he would have tried to get closer or, failing that, passed him up.
 
Ardent said:
Interesting stuff and looking forward to seeing CreamySmooth's, and you fly I take it? I'm due in Whitecourt for PPC in a few weeks, lived there for a year. Nice Elk around there... just do em a favour and upgrade from the 7.62x39!
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Yeah, I fly when I get time. Our PA-28 is at the airport and I am building a Glasair Sportsman on amphibs at home. I am thinking of getting a XCR in 260 or 308... ;)
 
SwL_Wildcat said:
Sellier & Bellot 123 Gr soft points at about 55 yards. It was my buddies bull, so I wasn't the one who pulled the trigger.

I honestly don't believe in the "not enough power" argument. I have shot quite a few moose with my 243. Shot placement is trump. Don't shoot farther than your ability or the power of the round you are using. Had the bull been at 150+ yards he would have tried to get closer or, failing that, passed him up.
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I agree that shot placement is Numero Uno by a good bit... BUT, even more than caliber, bullet construction is a significant factor... The S&B 123 SP at 2200 fps obviously can get the job done... but it is not the best choice if there are other options available... the reason I cringe more than anything, is the number of yahoo's who read something like that and decide that their SKS will be "good enough." The average (not every) SKS owner, bought the gun because A. It was cheap, B. The ammo is cheap, and C. They want to spray some lead... none of these represent a good mind set when targeting a bull moose. I applaude your friends discernment and restraint on limiting the range to his chosen caliber... I just wonder how many can show restraint on a nice bull that is "just a little too far?" Tell your buddy... "Nice bull, congrats."
 
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