Picture of the day

[RRCo.]

You can be sure that all record of what was actually said to the Nazis in 1940/41 has long since vanished up the chimneys of Whitehall. And as someone observed at the time, the British are one of the few nations that actually know how to keep their mouths shut.

do you think that we will ever hear the "true story" behind the Herman Hess "mission of peace"? I think that one would really throw conventional history on its ear, along with much of the true events of the second world war.

No, I don't think we ever will. But I don't think there is anything in that story that will "throw conventional history on its ear."

Did he go with Hitler's knowledge? Did he take off in one plane and land in another? What was said to convince him to go? Was the man in Spandau really Hess?

His wife and son said they believed he was, but one of his American doctors noticed that he did not have the scars that Hess' WWI records indicated, and the man in Spandau became highly agitated when he pointed this out to him during an examination.

But then who would play such a role for 50 years and why? What did Goering mean when he taunted Hess at Nuremburg to "tell us your secret"?

It's a strange case, but I don't think it's more than a footnote to the history of WWII.

Here's another interesting footnote: ht tp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Tandey

“The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.” Tom Clancy.

 

[screwtape]

You can be sure that all record of what was actually said to the Nazis in 1940/41 has long since vanished up the chimneys of Whitehall. And as someone observed at the time, the British are one of the few nations that actually know how to keep their mouths shut.


do you think that we will ever hear the "true story" behind the Herman Hess "mission of peace"? I think that one would really throw conventional history on its ear, along with much of the true events of the second world war.

Are the two of you suggesting that Winston Churchill may have written his six volume memoir, The Second World War, within 5 years of the war's end for some reason other than a simple wish to occupy a bit of spare time and earn a bit of extra income? That he was perhaps also trying to control the future "mainstream" narrative of British involvement in the war? Such cynicism...

 

[RRCo.]

Are the two of you suggesting that Winston Churchill may have written his six volume memoir, The Second World War, within 5 years of the war's end for some reason other than a simple wish to occupy a bit of spare time and earn a bit of extra income? That he was perhaps also trying to control the future "mainstream" narrative of British involvement in the war? Such cynicism...

Churchill's mother was one of those American women who came to Britain in the late 1800s to marry what money could not buy them: titles and lineage. (Although in many cases that was in effect what they were doing) She then proceeded to spend the family's fortune at a high rate of speed while allowing hundreds of others to spend in her at no charge.

As a result Churchill had to make money where he could and he made most of his by writing. He was also a worker and knew how to crank them out. I don't think he was particularly concerned with controlling the narrative; he was concerned with getting his account onto the market while the getting was good! He knew hundreds of others of important figures would write their memoirs as well, and he could do nothing to control what they said, or what the verdict of history really was. Of course one of his bon mots was "History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it myself", and obviously he wanted his account to be public as much as anyone else wanted theirs to.

History hasn't needed to "be kind to him" IMO, because never before in the history of human conflict was so much owed by so many to one man.

 

[Dark Alley Dan]

Goebbels had a field day with this one:

"Churchill the gangster"...

Also, this:

http://4.bp.########.com/-FWj6dZTsG0o/UCODptE2iGI/AAAAAAAAA4E/XN9dK9C5IlM/s400/Churchill+with+Sten.jpg

And this:

He's going to be dumping hot brass all over Ike...

Anyone know what ever became of his C96 Mauser?

 

[RRCo.]

It is hard to sum up the combination of ideals, strategic vision, and simple humanity that forms greatness, but he had it. Even those who practically lived with him in WWII saw this, although they complained about his hours, his whims, or what they called whims, which sometimes were nothing more than intense frustration with the dullards and 'business as usual' people who could not grasp the urgency of the situation, nor its wider implications. What was needed was inspiration and he inspired while keeping a firm grasp on reality. He had the breadth of knowledge and outlook that characterized the Victorians and Edwardians. Well, the captains and the kings have long departed folks.

 

[RRCo.]

I thought you'd have this one for sure.

He probably lost his C96 when he was captured. Some Boer enjoyed it and where did it go from there? Turned in at the end of the war? Probably not!

Whoa, hang on...just checked and saw this:

Churchill's Mauser was auctioned at Sothebys in London in 1971. I held it in my hands briefly: it was engraved "WLS Churchill" on the magazine and was in excellent condition, with much, if not most, of the blue finish remaining. When it came up, TV cameras and lights went on - it was an event. If you want to see it, rent the film "Young Winston." The original pistol was used in a couple of scenes. I believe the buyer, in 1971, was a representative of David Attenborough, who directed the film. Where the Mauser is now, I've no idea.
JJK

 

[Dark Alley Dan]

Imagine putting your hands on that pistol, if only for a moment. My God, what an honour.

If the gentleman is correct when he suggests the pistol was used in Young Winston, then I suppose this would be it:

Please, Firearms God, don't let him drop it...

 

[762shooter]

Its interesting that Private Tandey was in the army for 16 years before WWI, served all through the war with distinction and was still only a private at the end of the war. I would have thought that a 16 year pre-WWI veteran would have been an NCO in the war time army for sure. I wonder if he was a bit of a "bad boy" who kept getting busted?

 

[Don Kael]

Anyone know what ever became of his C96 Mauser?

It definitely made Churchill himself a believer in the Mauser C96. He kept it to the end of his days. It is said to now repose in a museum in England, and the story goes that this actual gun was used in the filming of the movie, “Young Winston".

A good read on C96's: ftp://ftp.fwpubs.com/Outbound/Direct Brands/GD2013_C96.pdf

 

[RRCo.]

Its interesting that Private Tandey was in the army for 16 years before WWI, served all through the war with distinction and was still only a private at the end of the war. I would have thought that a 16 year pre-WWI veteran would have been an NCO in the war time army for sure. I wonder if he was a bit of a "bad boy" who kept getting busted?

He joined up in 1910.

More likely that he didn't want stripes IMO; some people prefer it that way for various reasons. I suspect he was 'pushed upstairs' after WWI as it just 'wouldn't do' to have the most decorated Other Rank in the Army a mere Private Soldier and he would get a better pension as a NCO of course.

 

[screwtape]

He joined up in 1910.

More likely that he didn't want stripes IMO; some people prefer it that way for various reasons. I suspect he was 'pushed upstairs' after WWI as it just 'wouldn't do' to have the most decorated Other Rank in the Army a mere Private Soldier and he would get a better pension as a NCO of course.

Very definitely the case with Tandey. Interesting that, according to the citation for his first bravery medal, the Distinguished Conduct Medal, during an attack on 28 August 1918, he was "in charge of a reserve bombing party" when he noticed the advance being held up by a strongpoint and led a couple other guys across No Man's Land to throw grenades into the German trench. So even though his rank was Private, he was effectively acting as an NCO.

He was discharged after the War, then re-enlisted the following day with the rank of Acting Lance Corporal, but a little less than two years later reverted to being a Private again at his own request. When he was finally discharged 5 years later, his rank upon discharge was sergeant but it sounds like he was promoted to that rank immediately before discharge for pension purposes.

 

[fingers284]

There are two reasons that main land Europe and Britian did not become under Nazi rule ...Winston & Gen George S Patton. Both badgered and be-littled anybody or anything that tried to impede them getting the job done.

The only eventual drawback as I see it is that now we have Peirs Morgan in America as an aftereffect.

 

[Ganderite]

I read an excellent book that compared the design and production of weapons in the UK vs. Germany. I really enjoyed it but cannot recall the name. the author was a well-known name.

 

[r.fallon]

There are two reasons that main land Europe and Britian did not become under Nazi rule ...Winston & Gen George S Patton. Both badgered and be-littled anybody or anything that tried to impede them getting the job done.

Mainland Europe did come under Nazi rule, and until mid-late 42 England was on the ropes. Gen Patton...about as glorious and brave a leader as his Soviet counter-part Gen Zhukov. Patton was, and still is, a poster child for American propaganda and in my opinion was completely over rated.

 

[Dark Alley Dan]

Two days, no pix. Here you go.

Those lads on the foredeck might not have lived much past this picture.

 

[Kirk1701]

Two days, no pix. Here you go.

Those lads on the foredeck might not have lived much past this picture.

That makes me feel equally sad and grateful. Poor lads.

 

[RRCo.]

Two days, no pix. Here you go.

Those lads on the foredeck might not have lived much past this picture.

They weren't "lads", they were mostly senior German officers have a good poke around and a look-see. Apparently they'd forgotten Zeebrugge in WWI, and didn't have much imagination either.

Funny, since they'd just blown up a year or two earlier the memorial to the raid which was on the mole at Zeebrugge.

Fur ihnen ist der krieg zu ende; there's worse ways to go after all.

 

[smellie]

Zeebrugge: a whole bucketful of VCs..... and each and every one earned.

There is a good exhibit in the IWM on that 1918 raid, along with a small piece of Vindictive herself.

Had to overnight in Ostend many years ago, catch the Ferry to England. Wife was not aware of why I wanted to stay in a little hotel in Vindictivelaan until I told her all about the Raid and then its second part..... on Ostend itself..... a few days later. I think the ghost of Vindictive is still there.......

Sacred ground, all: Zeebrugge, Ostend, St.-Nazaire.

 

[Dark Alley Dan]

Quite the artificial reef.

The Murmansk, ex Soviet Navy, now a homely adjunct to the shoreline in Norway. I assume the Norwegians have asked Vlad to come by and get his stuff, but so far, nothing...

 

[Cdn303]

Can-UC with PIATbattery-1944.
Improvised by the Canadians in 1944, this consisted of 14 PIAT projectors mounted on a frame at the rear of the carrier in two series of seven. Each row could be fired simultaneously by means of a mechanical contrivance of steel rods attached to the firing triggers. A few vehicles so fitted were used in Europe in 1944-45.
The PIAT Battary in question was part of 16 Field Park Comapny, Royal Canadian Engineers, in Zutphen, Netherlands, 1944. Yes, they were used in action, to good effect. They were mounted on brackets on the rear of the carriers in two rows of seven, with a crowbar tack welded to the triggers of the PIAT, to provide a uniform firing mechanism.