Apply for a Hunting Draw...or not

[AbLonewolf]

I read a comment on another post and did not want to hijack same...so I decided to start a new Thread on the matter at hand. By the way, I do not slam this person for his/her choice, and I will simply express my own opinion on this issue, and solicit other thoughts.

The comment made was an individual applied and was successful for an Alberta Hunting Draw, and advised that he would not hunt that particular specie, indicating a personal "conservation" reason.

The way I see it, if one does not wish to hunt a particular animal within the Alberta Draw system, then simply do not apply. By being successful after the draw, then state you will not hunt this specie kinda defeats the purpose. By doing that, one simply prevents another hunter from an opportunity obtaining a tag via the Draw system.

I have heard about "Special Non Hunting Groups" doing the exact same thing to limit success rates from legitimate hunters. All one needs is a WIN Card, and way you go.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

I read a comment on another post and did not want to hijack same...so I decided to start a new Thread on the matter at hand. By the way, I do not slam this person for his/her choice, and I will simply express my own opinion on this issue, and solicit other thoughts.

The comment made was an individual applied and was successful for an Alberta Hunting Draw, and advised that he would not hunt that particular specie, indicating a personal "conservation" reason.

The way I see it, if one does not wish to hunt a particular animal within the Alberta Draw system, then simply do not apply. By being successful after the draw, then state you will not hunt this specie kinda defeats the purpose. By doing that, one simply prevents another hunter from an opportunity obtaining a tag via the Draw system.

I have heard about "Special Non Hunting Groups" doing the exact same thing to limit success rates from legitimate hunters. All one needs is a WIN Card, and way you go.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a WIN card is proof you've taken a hunter training course or equivalent. Would seem to cut the PETA guys out of the loop. Guess I can understand a legitimate reason for not being able to hunt on a drawn tag, but just spoiling the ballot, so to speak, is unfair to everyone else who applied.

Grizz

 

[trevj]

Whatever.

If the guy has been applying, and burned his priority on a tag that he has no intention of using, eventually it does affect the numbers of tags issued, as it will end up reported as a non hunt, or a non-successful hunt. One way or another the guy bought the tag, it's his to do with as they please.

What's the game? Grizz? Sheep? Not much else out there other than those that really deal in small enough numbers of tags for some other guy to get pissy about the guy not wanting to use it now he's been drawn.

Sorta like having a neighbor win the lottery and drop the checque into the shredder instead of cashing it. Not yours, why worry about it.

Ah. Seen. The antlerless mule deer tag.

Nope. Not gonna make one whit of difference in the long run. Same reasons. The reported hunting days, the reported success rate, etc. all goes towards the next years doe tags.

All in, any animal left as overage in Alberta could well end up getting shot from a helicopter in the spring anyway.

Worry about the things you can do something about.

Cheers
Trev

 

[Duffy]

I believe that the individual feels that there are not enough mule deer in Albert in the WMU he hunts. And he does not agree with F&W ideas of game management. So he applies for the mule deer "doe" tag and then does not use it in an effort to "save a doe". Of course he is taking away another hunters chance to harvest a doe and is doing so on purpose.

At an Alberta Fish & Game Association conference a few years back a woman from the licencing section gave a talk. She said that they had tracked all WIN holders who had applied for a Grizzly licence. All of them had applied for other special draws and all had held a number of different licences the previous year. That seemed to be evidence that no "peta types" were applying for Alberta Grizzly licences.

 

[track]

I read a comment on another post and did not want to hijack same...so I decided to start a new Thread on the matter at hand. By the way, I do not slam this person for his/her choice, and I will simply express my own opinion on this issue, and solicit other thoughts.

The comment made was an individual applied and was successful for an Alberta Hunting Draw, and advised that he would not hunt that particular specie, indicating a personal "conservation" reason.

The way I see it, if one does not wish to hunt a particular animal within the Alberta Draw system, then simply do not apply. By being successful after the draw, then state you will not hunt this specie kinda defeats the purpose. By doing that, one simply prevents another hunter from an opportunity obtaining a tag via the Draw system.

I have heard about "Special Non Hunting Groups" doing the exact same thing to limit success rates from legitimate hunters. All one needs is a WIN Card, and way you go.

I believe that was my post you are referring to. My intentions for the draw is for the sole purpose of conserving wildlife, in the area where I hunt mule deer. There is "no intent" on my part to prevent other fellow hunters from being selected in the draw. Animal numbers have dropped in the last 8 years and I would like to see them come back to a healthy number. Hence the draw I have been scouting and noted that the deer are coming back in greater numbers. Therefore since you live in Alberta, I will invite you to accompany me on the first day of the hunt where I can harvest the doe and give it to you. My intents to not use tag is most unselfish and only thinking of the future of wildlife and opportunity for other hunters.

 

[brybenn]

I see both sides of this argument and in a small way I'm guilty of the same however it's with bucks not does. I'm not sure how it works out west but in Ontario tags are allotted based on numbers as a control measure in that it uses hunting as a conversation tool. He bought a tag which adds money to the cause if you believe the ministry uses it appropriately. Yes another hunter may not get a tag now but whether or not he shoots a doe no other hunter would have got that tag. Who knows he may change his mind while out hunting when a nice doe pops up. I've wasted many buck tags because I was waiting for larger more mature bucks. Often passing up many deer to end the season with a tag in my pocket still. I usually fill my antlerless tags the first day I'm out so I have meat on the freezer so I'm selective on what bucks I shoot. Also holding onto a tag I can hunt all season allowing me to take other hunters out and helping them to get a shot at a deer I'd passed up. There are many reasons why we hunt


In Ontario a few years back my area one hunter could buy 5 tags and I know for a fact peta ppl were buying all the tags they could stating $45 to save a deer was worth it. Now my area is down 2 tags and there are many many deer around. Just the other day I clipped on in my driveway while watching 2 big bucks in the field

 

[stubblejumper]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a WIN card is proof you've taken a hunter training course or equivalent.

You are wrong. All that you need to enter a draw is the WIN number that you are issued to purchase a fishing license. No course or test is required.

 

[AbLonewolf]

I believe that was my post you are referring to. My intentions for the draw is for the sole purpose of conserving wildlife, in the area where I hunt mule deer. There is "no intent" on my part to prevent other fellow hunters from being selected in the draw. Animal numbers have dropped in the last 8 years and I would like to see them come back to a healthy number. Hence the draw I have been scouting and noted that the deer are coming back in greater numbers. Therefore since you live in Alberta, I will invite you to accompany me on the first day of the hunt where I can harvest the doe and give it to you. My intents to not use tag is most unselfish and only thinking of the future of wildlife and opportunity for other hunters.

No need to explain yourself again. As I stated in my OP, I am not slamming you as a person. I am simply expressing my personal opinion and interested with others.

And BTW, TYVM for the invite, but will pass. I got drawn for Bull Moose, and will get General Tags for Whitetail Buck and Bull Elk, and planning on hunting hard to fill them.

 

[trevj]

I believe that was my post you are referring to. My intentions for the draw is for the sole purpose of conserving wildlife, in the area where I hunt mule deer. There is "no intent" on my part to prevent other fellow hunters from being selected in the draw. Animal numbers have dropped in the last 8 years and I would like to see them come back to a healthy number. Hence the draw I have been scouting and noted that the deer are coming back in greater numbers. Therefore since you live in Alberta, I will invite you to accompany me on the first day of the hunt where I can harvest the doe and give it to you. My intents to not use tag is most unselfish and only thinking of the future of wildlife and opportunity for other hunters.

Have you ever sat in with the Wildlife Biologist when they go around to the different zones explaining their rationale and the numbers that they believe are correct for your area?
I did, for the Cold Lake area. It was very informative.

At that time they figured the deer populations wee over double the density that they wanted to see, and were opening up opportunities accordingly.

Better off donating cash to any of the conservation organizations directly, IMO. Well, except maybe DU. They probably don't need another Mercedes in the parking lot.

I figure you can do what feels good to you, but in the end, all it amounts to is eventually they up the number of tags drawn to get the harvest numbers where they want them, so, other than a cash donation...

Around Cold Lake the Mulie numbers were pretty good, and the limiting factor for harvest was access (on private land) not numbers.

Cheers
Trev

 

[mmattockx]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a WIN card is proof you've taken a hunter training course or equivalent. Would seem to cut the PETA guys out of the loop. Guess I can understand a legitimate reason for not being able to hunt on a drawn tag, but just spoiling the ballot, so to speak, is unfair to everyone else who applied.

Grizz

Up to this year you have not needed proof of a hunter safety course to apply for draws and/or a hunting license. As of 2014, all new draw applicants will need to provide the certificate number for their hunter course before they can get tags or apply for licenses.

You are wrong. All that you need to enter a draw is the WIN number that you are issued to purchase a fishing license. No course or test is required.

As noted above, new hunters will need to provide proof of a course next year.


Mark

 

[track]

Have you ever sat in with the Wildlife Biologist when they go around to the different zones explaining their rationale and the numbers that they believe are correct for your area?
I did, for the Cold Lake area. It was very informative.

At that time they figured the deer populations wee over double the density that they wanted to see, and were opening up opportunities accordingly.

Better off donating cash to any of the conservation organizations directly, IMO. Well, except maybe DU. They probably don't need another Mercedes in the parking lot.

I figure you can do what feels good to you, but in the end, all it amounts to is eventually they up the number of tags drawn to get the harvest numbers where they want them, so, other than a cash donation...

Around Cold Lake the Mulie numbers were pretty good, and the limiting factor for harvest was access (on private land) not numbers.

Cheers
Trev

For the past three years I have only spoken with Kim Morton from Lethbridge who informed me about the mule deer situation in the zone where I hunt, which is seldom because of the limited license draws. He advised that there are many reasons for the decline in ungulates, such as, winter kill, predators, road kill, rifle hunters, natural causes, special landowner tags, outfitter tags, poachers and recently bow hunters have been taken more animals than combined rifle hunters. He had a formula that he used to figure out, animal population minus dead animals divided by something, plus something = amount of tags issued.
I know that biologist hands are tied where local interest groups and politics prevent him from preforming his job.

 

[AbLonewolf]

For the past three years I have only spoken with Kim Morton from Lethbridge who informed me about the mule deer situation in the zone where I hunt, which is seldom because of the limited license draws. He advised that there are many reasons for the decline in ungulates, such as, winter kill, predators, road kill, rifle hunters, natural causes, special landowner tags, outfitter tags, poachers and recently bow hunters have been taken more animals than combined rifle hunters. He had a formula that he used to figure out, animal population minus dead animals divided by something, plus something = amount of tags issued.
I know that biologist hands are tied where local interest groups and politics prevent him from preforming his job.

Ok sir. Obviously, appears as though you may have " connections"...as to the theories et al...which is ok.

But the bottom line is...why tie up a tag when someone else can use it? Why can you simply admit the fact that perhaps, you should have skipped applying the draw so someone else can have a chance? Just saying...

 

[rem338win]

Because he is an elitist, it makes him feel better about himself and its perfectly
Legal. Arguing with him is a circular argument with little fact, in essense its pointless. He doesn't understand that most of us with feet on the ground there know that the doe population needs reduction is "his" area as mature buck to doe ratio is ridiculously out of wack.

 

[joe m]

As long as the person applying actually purchases the tag I have no problem with their decision to fill it or not. As was said, if the tag isn't used the number of tags will be adjusted the following year.

I remember my dad passing on some hunting advice his dad had given him. Never shoot the first animal you see because it might be the only one you see.