308 load

B

Big k

Regular
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
Hi guys
I am new to reloading. I am having a huge accuracy issue. My rifle is a Remington 700 target tactical. It's usually about 1" to 1 1/2" moa with factory ammo.



I just tried reloading my first batch of 308 last weekend. I went to the range on Saturday. I was shooting 8 inch groups of a bench rest at 100 yards. Of coarse this is ridiculous. I checked my scope mounts and my rifle. I tried factory ammo and back to 1 inch groups. So it is definitely my reloading.

I am using imr 4064 powder (44 gr.) and hornady GMX bullets 165 grain
I weigh each load carefully. I even measure each round (2.810 inches)

I was hoping some of the reloading gurus might have an idea as to what I could be doing wrong. I would like to try a different batch next weekend

Any ideas would help. Thanks in advance
 
All sorts of possibilities.

Try rolling some of your reloads on a flat surface and see how much the projectiles seem to move back and forth as it rolls. That's runnout.

Try the same thing with some factory cartridges.

http: //www.reloadersnest.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3139
 
Don't worry about run out yet.

First is to work up some loads with increasing powder charges.

Go to the IMR website and they will give you a start point.

Go up in .5 gr increments , stick with one COAL and keep your brass prep consistent.

You will observe patterns grow and shrink and grow etc......................

You will be finding the rifles "sweet spot".

Keep it simple and report back here with results and questions.Chronograph your loads if available.
 
Have you done any development loads? Or did you just make a bunch with 44gr and that's it? Do you have a Hornady reloading manual? Any manual?
If you go on the Hodgedon website you should be able to find a max and min charge weight for a 165gr bullet. Start at the min and make 3-5 rounds with that charge then increase the charge by 0.5gr and make 3-5 more and leep going till you get close to the max. When testing take your time and make sure the rifle is supported very well and test each batch of loads checking for signs of pressure as you move up to the hotter ones. You will probably see the groups start fairly wide (not 8 inches though) and they will get tighter then open up again then tighten again. These two spots of tighter groups are you high and low velocity node. Take your upper node load and load both sides of it 0.2gr more and 0.2gr less as well as your good load again. Test those and pick the best one.
Once you find that you can play with your seating depth a little to see if it makes it better or worse. To do your depth start with the bullet loaded out quite far and just slide it into the chamber and see if it will go in all the way, if it hits the lands it will stop before it goes in far enough to be able to close the bolt. Remove it and seat it a little deeper and repeat till it will go into the chamber fully and record that measurement. I usually seat it a little deeper after I find the length where it just touches the lands just to give it a tiny jump and to ensure you don't have the odd one touching the lands. Then just work your way shorter and shorter in 5 round batches till you find the length that shoots the best.

You can't just pick a random load from wherever and expect it to work great in your rifle. Handloading is a slow process to get the perfect load for your rifle but once you find it then it will all be worth it.

Good luck
 
Do you think runout would cause 8 inch Moa? I just rolled some reloads. The projectile does not seam to move at least that I can see without using tools.
I was thinking maybe 2.810" is not correct for the hornady GMX bullet. My book doesn't show this type of bullet.

I will definitely try different amounts of powder too.
 
I would be trying a different bullet to start with, say a Hornady interlock 165 with 4064 with a starting weight of 42 gr and work up. It is possible you rifle just does not like GMX bullets.
 
cr5 said:
Have you done any development loads? Or did you just make a bunch with 44gr and that's it? Do you have a Hornady reloading manual? Any manual?
If you go on the Hodgedon website you should be able to find a max and min charge weight for a 165gr bullet. Start at the min and make 3-5 rounds with that charge then increase the charge by 0.5gr and make 3-5 more and leep going till you get close to the max. When testing take your time and make sure the rifle is supported very well and test each batch of loads checking for signs of pressure as you move up to the hotter ones. You will probably see the groups start fairly wide (not 8 inches though) and they will get tighter then open up again then tighten again. These two spots of tighter groups are you high and low velocity node. Take your upper node load and load both sides of it 0.2gr more and 0.2gr less as well as your good load again. Test those and pick the best one.
Once you find that you can play with your seating depth a little to see if it makes it better or worse. To do your depth start with the bullet loaded out quite far and just slide it into the chamber and see if it will go in all the way, if it hits the lands it will stop before it goes in far enough to be able to close the bolt. Remove it and seat it a little deeper and repeat till it will go into the chamber fully and record that measurement. I usually seat it a little deeper after I find the length where it just touches the lands just to give it a tiny jump and to ensure you don't have the odd one touching the lands. Then just work your way shorter and shorter in 5 round batches till you find the length that shoots the best.

You can't just pick a random load from wherever and expect it to work great in your rifle. Handloading is a slow process to get the perfect load for your rifle but once you find it then it will all be worth it.

Good luck
Click to expand...

Yes I do have a reloading guide. It is the Nosler reloading book. I tried a few different loads all within the min max. All were crap.

That is some great advise though thank you. I will definitely try that.
 
twosmokinspades said:
I would be trying a different bullet to start with, say a Hornady interlock 165 with 4064 with a starting weight of 42 gr and work up. It is possible you rifle just does not like GMX bullets.
Click to expand...

I was thinking that as well. I have some sst bullets in 308. I will try those too
 
Seen on the Remington web page that u have a 11" 1/4 twist barrel.. i could be wrong and don't know about the GMX bullet but if i remember correctly its none lead bullet... I'm thinking that your bullet is to long for your twist and will not stabilize. try a lead based bullet like a sierra math king or something like that and watch magic happen
 
You were told right.
The only thing I'd suggest is starting over. Work your loads up, I'd go .3gr increments. Load 3 of each and watch the pattern change. If nothing else, do it to learn cause and effect. You'll start to see smaller groups, probably in the hotter loads. Don't be afraid of compressing powder.
.5gr increments will work, but you could miss something.
 
8" group seems like a pretty big spread even for a bad hand loads. You shot the factory ammo immediately after? If so, then we can probably rule out hardware issues.

Like others have said, build loads from min to max with 0.5gr increments keeping an eye out for pressure signs closer you get to max. Once you get close, you can work around that load data in finer increments.

Time to try a different bullet and powder combos like Varget, H4895, Benchmark, Hornady AMAX or HPBT Match or Sierra Matchkings etc. etc.
 
Monometal bullets like the Hornady GMX and Barnes TSX can perform quite differently in rifles compared to regular bullets. I didn't see if you posted how far off the rifling you are, but a recommendation from Barnes with these types of bullets is to start by seating 0.050" off the lands and test from there. Maybe you can try this if the other suggestions here don't work. Just a thought anyways.
 
my best load with the 308 is 150 gr speer bullets 45 gr 4064 mine will not shoot 165gr as well as 150s try touching the lands then seat a couple of thousands less then another 4 thousands less start at min charge then work up after you find the magic seating depth ,,,
 
OK I was able to purchase some Speer bullets 168 grain match and 165 grain boat tail. I will try to work up loads for both in increments of .5 grain stating with the minimum. I will shoot on Saturday. Hopefully changing the bullet brand may make a difference. I was thinking maybe the bullets did not stabilize. 8 inch groups is pretty bad of a bench. The rifle should be a tack driver.

FWIW I did not check the how far off the riffling the bullet sits. I just loaded to the lenght in the book (for that type of bullet). I will check the spacing tonight and minus .05" off the lands. Thanks for all of your valuable suggestions. I will post on the weekend with the result.


BTW, I was under the impression that reloading is cheaper. I have spent over $1000 and havent even scratched the suface of proper equiptment and components. It is very addictive. Also, I find it very relaxing. I am sure once I get more familliar with what my rifles like, it will be even better.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom