What is the "Military Surplus" forum for?

mr.e moose

mr.e moose

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I had always thought that the Milsurp forum was for the people that appreciated the history of what each and every weapon symbolized in our past.Many members here have been a great help over the years and there is a wealth of knowledge to be found here.
This is not a place to discuss the modification of even the cheapest military rifle to "Tacticool".Many of the members here remember the days of cheap (to today's prices)military surplus.It was not cheap back then when your wage was less than $5.00 a hour.People that sporterized rifles back then did so because it was cheaper to do that than buy a new hunting rifle.The war was over and there were millions of them for sale.Does it make sense to buy a full wood Enfield for $600.00 when you could buy a Steven's for less?
It also should not be a venue to solicit information about worth of a particular weapon unless you are at least up front about it.I have restored many of the ugliest sporterized rifles to factory specification but are they factory?You will never see me claim that,and I would never sell one without disclosing the fact.
My last comment will be on the thread about smellie and the free evaluation service.Why did that thread get locked down?A bunch of people expressing their gratitude to smellie for his information over the years?He along with a host of other contributing members have made this part of the forum a must read.Quality not quantity should be the norm.Tagged and LOL just bog down a thread and waste my time and others but that is okay,Thank you for all the information that you have offered over the years i= a locked thread?
 
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I have to agree with much of what you have expressed. And, I was surprised to find that thread "locked" as I have seen a lot more threads that had a lot more reasons for locking, and were not.

SMELLIE and I have had many conversations over countless gallons of coffee, about these people who are a bit deceitful in asking for information, and especially "What is it worth." Then, finding the same "prized possession and addition to the Collection" advertised on the EE a few days later, and, of course, using the very same information that was given out under the impression that it was a genuine Milsurp afficado that asked in the first place.

The downside to saying "Pee on it --let the illegitimate offspring find out for themselves" is that there are a greater number of genuine people who would like more information on their particular firearm. Unfortunately, it is discouraging when the "few" spoil it for the "many," but it is still worth it for us to answer a lot of the questions and help people out. I do know, however, both SMELLIE and I are being a lot more "selective" in replying and posting to some of the obvious threads.
 
And a big thanks to you Buffdog!!You are one of the contributors to this forum.If it was not for your posts and others like you I would not frequent these pages.
 
mr.e moose said:
I had always thought that the Milsurp forum was for the people that appreciated the history of what each and every weapon symbolized in our past.
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^ that right there is what the mislurp forum is best defined as in my own opinion which counts for absolutely nothing.

It is also one of the few places you get a lot of like minded people which are interested in old things that go boom, and the reasons why things work they way they do, and the people that made them work.

An added perk is all the older experienced people on here who have probably forgotten more then I will know.

that and everyone seems to hide in the sock closets with their rifles which I might do to have to shut up the lithgow singing Waltzing Matiltida, and the ross singing the Maple Leaf Forever off key....
 
mr.e moose said:
I had always thought that the Milsurp forum was for the people that appreciated the history of what each and every weapon symbolized in our past.Many members here have been a great help over the years and there is a wealth of knowledge to be found here.
This is not a place to discuss the modification of even the cheapest military rifle to "Tacticool".
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Just to be contrary I will disagree. It's nice that people on here want this forum to be a gentlemens lounge with elevated discourse and a pursuit of further knowledge, but it isn't ours to be making such sweeping statements, it's GTs and his minions.
This forum was not created to be a place of sober second thought, and a place of sterile, entrenched attitudes preached from up high to the unwashed masses. The nature of this forum is a democracy, with both sides represented, and since we know well that certain types will always freely admonish those who they feel have made an unforgivable transgression against the perceived collective, surely we can allow its original purpose of being a sub forum where any and all milsurp talk can take place.
After all this forum was created so milsurp owners could post freely without bogging down blackgun threads. It would be nice nice to see more thought provoking in depth posts, but if all someone wants to talk about is how to cut a SMLE down with a pipe cutter and nail file, then sell it on the EE for a million dollars, I for one would argue they were using the forum correctly, in poor taste, but correctly.
 
Great post Dosing.

Other forum sub genres have similar complaints, and preconceptions. But I guess they are a little better at weeding through those topics, and maybe don't hold their respective sub forum so close and personal to their hearts.

I know personally, that I heavily frequent at least 5 or 6 other sub forums on CGN in addition to this one. I think it's important to explore many forum dynamics so that you don't end up writhing in discontent over ideals regarding what and how your favourite or sole visted forum is being used or represented.

Its not our forum after all. If the mods see it being used in a fashion for which it was not intended, then maybe plead your case to them.
 
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Dosing said:
Just to be contrary I will disagree. It's nice that people on here want this forum to be a gentlemens lounge with elevated discourse and a pursuit of further knowledge, but it isn't ours to be making such sweeping statements, it's GTs and his minions.
This forum was not created to be a place of sober second thought, and a place of sterile, entrenched attitudes preached from up high to the unwashed masses. The nature of this forum is a democracy, with both sides represented, and since we know well that certain types will always freely admonish those who they feel have made an unforgivable transgression against the perceived collective, surely we can allow its original purpose of being a sub forum where any and all milsurp talk can take place.
After all this forum was created so milsurp owners could post freely without bogging down blackgun threads. It would be nice nice to see more thought provoking in depth posts, but if all someone wants to talk about is how to cut a SMLE down with a pipe cutter and nail file, then sell it on the EE for a million dollars, I for one would argue they were using the forum correctly, in poor taste, but correctly.
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I for one have no problem with someone that takes a poor unloved rifle that has been butchered and then creates a practical hunting rifle. I even like Lou's take on a No.4 that has been modified beyond redemption. I myself have a FN flash hider, along with a AK-47 shoulder thing that goes down. I just haven't been able to do the dirty deed yet. I have a abused Swiss Vetterli coming to me, perhaps I will do a Steampunked Tacticool with that.Bore out the flash hider to allow a .44 caliber slug to travel unimpeded,create a pistol grip that the AK folder will work with and maybe some Buck Rodger ray-gun rings around the barrel.Would I have a problem with that?Not in the slightest,the rifle is to far gone for a restoration unless you are mad as a hatter.The good, it will be a donor to my other matching Vetterli so I can use the bolt to convert it to centre fire.
 
Maybe, perhaps, the powers that be could see it done that a sub-forum called "Whats it worth?" could be created. Not a sticky, but its own sub-forum. then those who look to know what their property is worth may feel free to ask without feeling the need to "hide" if you will, and those who would give the estimated price would not feel obliged to do so unless they wanted to.
as for the showing off of unobtainium, tacticooling, restoration, building cool rifles from bubba`s disasters, advice seeking, and other various pursuits involving surplus rifles, I think this is the forum. very rarely does it happen when someone intentionally posts something to get the puritanical few going on rants and raves, and sometimes, the rifles are beyond restoring except maybe for parts. IE ; cut barrels. there are many great ideas and many people with so much knowledge here. if i didn`t want to learn, and they didn`t want to teach, this forum would not exist, or perhaps only existing as dosing suggested, an exclusive gentlemans club with very limited membership.

and for the record, the shift key works.

Jon
 
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All I'm going to say is this forum is for history and the preservation of it.

Now I have to admit that it's been a little stale around here lately but I think that due to weather more then anything. I for one have shot 3 times this winter vs. Several times a month.

Hopefully spring will happen soon as there's many pictures I want to take and threads that I need to post but it's just a matter of being able to go outside for longer then 2 mins at a time.

And I'll close with I'd like to thank the old-timers on this board that countinually post thought provoking and informative info for us young punks to read! CGN would be at a great loss without you all!

Please keep up the good work and don't let the idiots discourage you.
 
This forum get used alot more now for "help me identify this rifle I found in Grand dads barn or what have you with absolutely no fcuking interest in military history whatsover and then a few days later it ends up on the EE at grossly elevated price because we told them what a lucky chap they were to have found such a prize and we wish we were them and so on and so forth or they know the diff and just play the fcuking game for exposure.

Just go back through posts, and watch the EE. I find it rather funny that someone could actually believe we could know so much about firearms yet be so stupid to the workings and hollow words of a player. I've seen alot of players in my time on CGN, in all aspects from the individual forums to the EE.

She's definitely a money generator for some.

It's too bad that our passion and hobby is just another side business for some along with their lawn mower refurbishments and office cleaning, but it is a free country so I'll leave it at that!. I will say though that the more of a :jerkit: player you are, the less you'll get from me on the EE exponentially.
 
I see no harm in a thread that identifies a rifle, provides its history, and suggests a value - there's a lot of learning that can come from that.

Sporters however, belong in "Gunsmithing", "Hunting Arms" or somewhere else, except perhaps to identify its origin.

Best too I think, not to get too indignant over the notion of sporterizing a restoreable milsurp. It's their property and if the owner wants to spend $300 converting a $400 milsurp into a $300 hunting rifle, aside from providing fair warning to try to appeal to common sense, there's nothing productive that can come from angry rants, which are loved by the trolls.
 
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I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with regard to the sporters. I've done a couple of 'improvements' to rifles that were previously destroyed by someone with no business touching a rifle in any way. They were non restorable examples, and doing this to them has turned them into a rifle worth owning rather than a rifle worth scrapping. They won't ever be configured as they left the factory again, but they just could not be turned back into what they once were because of a lack of available parts etc. so they were turned into something use-able. I don't see anything wrong with that myself and I personally think its a good use for some of them if they still have a good bore, sound stock etc but have a hacked off barrel and stock, missing unobtainium etc.

Yes it is all about the collection and preservation of history but I also think it is about enjoying history as well.
 
buffdog said:
..... who are a bit deceitful in asking for information, and especially "What is it worth." Then, finding the same "prized possession and addition to the Collection" advertised on the EE a few days later, and, of course, using the very same information that was given out under the impression that it was a genuine Milsurp afficado that asked in the first place.
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Wait .... what?? Some people actually use the EE to SELL their milsurps??
 
I agree with many of your comments. Though distance makes it difficult for many of us to meet in any other way. I definitely have learned a ton from the milsurps section and SRF in the US. It's quite funny though, as a noob, my first rifles were a M/N and a SKS. Still enjoy these, however my interests have evolved since then. It seems I have a fondness for Mausers. The damn things keep multiplying.

Oh, and Buffdog, welcome to Ontario!!

I have made new friends from the milsurp forums and we get out and shoot our service rifles. I really also try not to get goaded into ridiculous threads by trolls and guys looking for price estimates. Anyone have any ideas to spruce things up after this long winter?? IE spring milsurp shoot/meet and greet?
 
Well, we are definitely planning another "Meet and Greet" out here, SAMSPLACCI. You are a bit far away but you would be welcome if you showed up.

Right now, we just don't have a date yet. Last year's was July 6 and it worked-out fine, so we are aiming for something similar.

It would be nice if these could be organised right across the country. Ideally, they could be set up on an AREA basis (this place is central to SW Manitoba and SE Saskatahachewan). Next shootin' town along the TCH would likely be Grenfell (100 miles) and some of us could make that. Then would be Pile O' Bones (which some idiot renamed "Regina")..... You get the idea: AREA shoots, close enough for overlap. Meet a LOT more Nutz that way, develop a stronger sense of COMMUNITY.

Hey, we ARE the BIGGEST SPORT IN CANADA by a gigantic margin. We even outnumber Synchronised Swimming and Aerobic Walking, fergawdssakes, not even to mention Skateboarding and Parkour! Actually, you can throw in Hockey, Football and Baseball, add them all up and we are STILL ahead. Our rate of Assault is about .00001% of that in Baseball, about a thousandth of that rate in Hockey..... and WE'RE the Bad Guys to the mass media! THAT MUST BE CHANGED! And this is a way to get that change started.

Organise one in YOUR area, invite some people, let others come, get people together, have some fun, burn some powder..... and make sure that your LOCAL newspaper knows about it. You will get a lower-key approach from your local paper, they might even send a Reporter with a BRAIN..... and, with a little help in phrasing*, you can expect a decent story.

Give it a try!



* Phrasing: some of them still believe anything with a pistol grip has to be an "AK-47" or a "semiautomatic machine-gun". They use buzz-phrases because they don't understand the real words. YOU can fix that!
 
Good advice and thanks for the invite Smellie! I am planning on going to Gibsonburgh Ohio in May for Schutzenfest. Seems some of the moderators on the SRF forum in the US have created a yearly event. I went to their fall shoot in 2012. Good times. Maybe I will have to roll out west to Manitoba in 2015 for your event!!!
 
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