What bullets are you using in a 1 in 8" twist?I just purchased a Sako Varmint Stainless Laminate,and am wondering if it is even worth trying bullets less than 60gr,or if I should just start with the 68gr Hornady match and 69gr matchking.
1 in 8" twist 223,bullets
- Thread starter stubblejumper
- Start date
- Location
- Whitehorse, Yukon
Your 1-8" twist will stabilize up to and including the 80gr Sierra MK. No problem with bullets as light as 50gr as well.
Have had a few rifles in the same twist in both Rem 223 and 22/250 AI.
RC
Have had a few rifles in the same twist in both Rem 223 and 22/250 AI.
RC
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
The further you want to shoot, the better heavier bullets will work for you.
My personal favorite are the 80gr Amx and Berger VLD.
The 8 twist can work with any bullet on the market except the 90's.
Jerry
My personal favorite are the 80gr Amx and Berger VLD.
The 8 twist can work with any bullet on the market except the 90's.
Jerry
I had zero luck with the 75 hornadys'.
When I had a 1-9 tw Colt i had a 69gr hornady load that was just stupid accuate.
When I had the 1-8 RRA the Federal Match (factory ammo) was unbeatable 77 gr sierras in them, not sure of powder.
M.
When I had a 1-9 tw Colt i had a 69gr hornady load that was just stupid accuate.
When I had the 1-8 RRA the Federal Match (factory ammo) was unbeatable 77 gr sierras in them, not sure of powder.
M.
I tested the gun today with 50gr,68gr,and 69gr bullets.It hates the 68gr Hornady match,but it likes the 50 gr v-max and n-133 averaging under .400" for all three groups.The 69gr matchking groups were poor with varget,but with Benchmark,four shots went into .23" with a flier .8" away.I am going to fine tune the v-max load,and try the 69gr matchking load again to see if the flier was a fluke.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
I finalized one load for the rifle this morning,that being the 50gr v-max in front of 25gr of n-133.Shooting at 5 degrees C,in rain and sleet,and with the wind varying from 20kph to 35kph,my five shot groups went from .400" to .460".Given the conditions this morning,the load certainly has the potential to do better.
I tested the 69gr load again yesterday afternoon,and it is averaging five shots into about 5/8" under good shooting conditions.
I have some 55gr ballistic tips to test,but so far the 50gr max/n-133 load looks like a winner.The rifle just doesn't seem to know that it isn't supposed to shoot so well with 50gr bullets.
I tested the 69gr load again yesterday afternoon,and it is averaging five shots into about 5/8" under good shooting conditions.
I have some 55gr ballistic tips to test,but so far the 50gr max/n-133 load looks like a winner.The rifle just doesn't seem to know that it isn't supposed to shoot so well with 50gr bullets.
My loads
Hornady 68gr HPBT COL 2.260 with 26gr of Varget
Sierra Match 69gr HPBT COL 2.235 with 26gr of Varget
The only way I was able to group with Varget was to jack up the loads
Shot with my Ar-15 1:9 twist 20" front rest sand bags on stock
This was Today at 200M. Sadly, I had only 5 rounds of each. Wasted 2 dialing in
Hornady
Sierra
I dont know how to mesure it and I am not sure I have tools to mesure it.
how do I mesure it ?
Sierra load was from one of my books with 2.235 specified COL
Hornady load was taken from loaddata.com with no COL specified. I mesured the length difference between Sierra 69gr and hornady 68gr. Honady is way longer so to dont compress the load even more with HOrnady bullets I when for the Max SAMMI COL 2.260
I had no sign of high pressure with the 2 loads.
Since my rifle is a AR I cannot run OAL more then 2.270 or it wont fit my mags
I fired rounds from 2.270 to 2.235 with mild powder charge and noticed no accuracy improvement. Only thing that seems to help is a nice Strong crimp. Not that the bullet back off while entering the chamber with a light crimp, (I checked) it just like strong crimp.
how do I mesure it ?
Sierra load was from one of my books with 2.235 specified COL
Hornady load was taken from loaddata.com with no COL specified. I mesured the length difference between Sierra 69gr and hornady 68gr. Honady is way longer so to dont compress the load even more with HOrnady bullets I when for the Max SAMMI COL 2.260
I had no sign of high pressure with the 2 loads.
Since my rifle is a AR I cannot run OAL more then 2.270 or it wont fit my mags
I fired rounds from 2.270 to 2.235 with mild powder charge and noticed no accuracy improvement. Only thing that seems to help is a nice Strong crimp. Not that the bullet back off while entering the chamber with a light crimp, (I checked) it just like strong crimp.
There are several ways to measure this.One easy way is to seat a bullet in an empty case much longer than normal,then see if the bolt will close fully.If it won't close easily,keep seating the bullet shorter until it barely closes.Of course this method works better with a bolt action where it is easy to gently close the bolt until you feel resistance.
Sounds like you have a sweet rifle. Sako makes nice stuff, I have 2 of them.
Being a long range guy myself, I dont know why you would want to use bullets lighter than 69 grains if you have the 8" twist.
For years my standard magazine length load for 223 was 748 powder and 69 grain Sierra Match Kings. Your barrel will shoot the 80 grainers well too, but you will probably need to load them one at a time, because the ideal seating depth will be too long to mag feed. (Jam the lands with VLDs)
Heavy Bergers and Sierras are both great, but my experience with AMAX was not so good. They arent bad, just not as good as Berger or Sierra.
Avoid getting caught up the a quest for flat trajectory. Wind is the real problem, not trajectory. I'm looking at a nice little plaque on the wall for a match I shot with a 223 and 80 gr SMKs (with 25.5 gr Varget) where I put 117 out of 120 shots into a 2.5" circle at 300 yards over a 2 day event prone from a bipod. The plaque tells me 80 grainers are the way to go.
Being a long range guy myself, I dont know why you would want to use bullets lighter than 69 grains if you have the 8" twist.
For years my standard magazine length load for 223 was 748 powder and 69 grain Sierra Match Kings. Your barrel will shoot the 80 grainers well too, but you will probably need to load them one at a time, because the ideal seating depth will be too long to mag feed. (Jam the lands with VLDs)
Heavy Bergers and Sierras are both great, but my experience with AMAX was not so good. They arent bad, just not as good as Berger or Sierra.
Avoid getting caught up the a quest for flat trajectory. Wind is the real problem, not trajectory. I'm looking at a nice little plaque on the wall for a match I shot with a 223 and 80 gr SMKs (with 25.5 gr Varget) where I put 117 out of 120 shots into a 2.5" circle at 300 yards over a 2 day event prone from a bipod. The plaque tells me 80 grainers are the way to go.
Varget
BTW
Varget is too slow for 69 grain bullets, works much better with 80s. Err on the side of faster rather than slower powder. It burns cleaner and over several rounds, will be more accurate because of it.
TAC, H335 and Win 748 are powders you want to try for 68-69 grain bullets
You should be ok with federal match primers, but will get more speed with Remington Bench Rest or CCI primers.
BTW
Varget is too slow for 69 grain bullets, works much better with 80s. Err on the side of faster rather than slower powder. It burns cleaner and over several rounds, will be more accurate because of it.
TAC, H335 and Win 748 are powders you want to try for 68-69 grain bullets
You should be ok with federal match primers, but will get more speed with Remington Bench Rest or CCI primers.
I have tried six different bullets,and to date,the 50gr v-max has been consistently the most accurate at lengths that fit the magazine.Since it consistently shoots sub 1/2" for five shots,I am going to stop testing,and just go with that bullet.Besides,the v-max has performed well on small game in the past,and I trust it more than match bullets for use on game.
accurate close only
Bud,
the 50 graineres are so light, they are no good for long range. They arent even flat shooting. I did a quick check for you on this using RCBS.LOAD and a 50 grain bullet starting at 3100 fps drops 9.3 inches at 300 yards and has a wind drift of 6.6" at 10 mph cross wind.
The 69 grain SMK has 3.65 inches of wind drift and only 7.72 inches of drop starting at only 3000 fps.
The 80 grain SMK at MV 2900 drop 7.39" with a drift of only 2.58"
Not to mention the heavier bullets carry more teminal energy.
Slightly better accuracy at 100 yards cannot compensate for that kind of balistic improvement at hunting distances.
With an 8 inch twist, the 69 and 80 grain MKs are a heck of a good hunting bullet. Ground hogs explode and these bullets will drop deer in thier tracks.
The bullet manufacturers have recently started recomending many match bullets for hunting.
Bud,
the 50 graineres are so light, they are no good for long range. They arent even flat shooting. I did a quick check for you on this using RCBS.LOAD and a 50 grain bullet starting at 3100 fps drops 9.3 inches at 300 yards and has a wind drift of 6.6" at 10 mph cross wind.
The 69 grain SMK has 3.65 inches of wind drift and only 7.72 inches of drop starting at only 3000 fps.
The 80 grain SMK at MV 2900 drop 7.39" with a drift of only 2.58"
Not to mention the heavier bullets carry more teminal energy.
Slightly better accuracy at 100 yards cannot compensate for that kind of balistic improvement at hunting distances.
With an 8 inch twist, the 69 and 80 grain MKs are a heck of a good hunting bullet. Ground hogs explode and these bullets will drop deer in thier tracks.
The bullet manufacturers have recently started recomending many match bullets for hunting.
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I'm currently going through the same process on a 1-8" Gaillard barrelled .223. So far 80 grain Bergers, and 69 and 80 SMKs are all looking good at 200 yards with Varget and Lapua cases. I honestly think 100 yard load development is a waste of time, you'd think that those 1 hole groups meant something but they don't seem to.
69ers were looking best when I ran out of them. and fit in the magazine too. 75 A-maxs shot OK at starting loads and went downhill after that. The 69smk shot well throughout the powder range and topped out 26 grains. The Sierra and Berger 80s seem to like it at 25. 25.3 was getting too hot, but actually shot better with the 80 smk.
69ers were looking best when I ran out of them.
and fit in the magazine too. 75 A-maxs shot OK at starting loads and went downhill after that. The 69smk shot well throughout the powder range and topped out 26 grains. The Sierra and Berger 80s seem to like it at 25. 25.3 was getting too hot, but actually shot better with the 80 smk.canucklehead
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Calgary, AB
I'm using 55gr VMAX with my 1:8" Tikka, and get .6" or less groups at 100 pretty easily. Best load is 0.46" at 100.
I use either H335 or AA2230 (when I can stock up). Winchester brass and CCI or Win Primers.
I use either H335 or AA2230 (when I can stock up). Winchester brass and CCI or Win Primers.
