100 Yard Bush gun Shoot Out: 44mag vs 30-30
- Thread starter Coolhand_Luke
- Start date
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
The problem with that comparison is that when you're dealing with a defensive firearm you are dealing with something that will be deployed at a range of feet, usually in the single digits. In situations like that you have a real need to make hole in the creature quickly. Often you have to do this work with the firearm in one hand which limits your choice of firearm. The 44 Mag is not the best round in the world for shooting grizzlies, but it is one of the best in the world for shooting grizzlies off of you. Lots of power in a handy package that can make holes you need when you need to make holes. But is the 44's popularity due to it's prowess or merely it's availability? Is it that much better than the 45 Colt? Both share big cases and big bullets. What the 44 has over the 45 is more guns are chambered for it.
Interestingly, Phil Shoemaker (Alaskan Master Guide) outfitted his daughter (also a guide) with a 357 Mag shooting 185gr bullets. He did this because the 357 showed excellent penetration and reasonable recoil. If it's good enough for Phil to send his daughter into the alders with it, it's good enough.
Northern Amateur
CGN frequent flyer
30-30 if I had to choose though I don't have any pistol cartridge lever actions. I like the 30-30 but for some reason I feel more confident with either a 35Rem (harder to find ammo), 444 (bagged a doe this year with that one-bang flop); 45-70 (bagged a doe with one two years ago-bang flop); 450 Marlin though kinda glad I didn't hit a deer with it as I was using Hornady ammo and the ballistics seem a tad high for a deer. I have not used my Win 1895 in 30-06 yet though anxious to try it out. The last two would be good for bear and/or moose though.
Lever guns IMHO have no equal when pushing bush.
Lever guns IMHO have no equal when pushing bush.
BigUglyMan, I think everything you say is completely valid. I'm not touting the .44 magnum as the be-all end-all of any aspect of the shooting sports. I'm just saying it's my choice as a bush gun, I will also hunt deer and bear with a .45-70, 12 gauge, sks and even a recurve bow. The OP asked about .44 mag, so that's what I commented on. There's a lot of capable calibers and firearms out there, part of the fun of it is that you can choose what you like.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
I was listening to a podcast about chasing mountain lions with hounds. I was thinking that a short handy 44 Mag could be a great rifle for that kind of hunt.
Well here they are how about this for handier =
Yeah I know you're talking 30-30/44 mag but there is so much better out there.
14" barreled 375JDJ 235gr @ 2050fps
14" barreled 45-70 350gr @ 1600fps
or my pip squeak 14" barreled 45 Colt that has more killing thump out to 150 yards than the 30-30.
Yeah I know you're talking 30-30/44 mag but there is so much better out there.
14" barreled 375JDJ 235gr @ 2050fps
14" barreled 45-70 350gr @ 1600fps
or my pip squeak 14" barreled 45 Colt that has more killing thump out to 150 yards than the 30-30.
Getting back to the OP's original question. I have used both the 30-30 and 44mag. on deer etc. If I had to choose just one it would be the 30-30 just for the plain fact I think it gives one more versatility for range. Personally I use a Ruger Carbine semi auto in 44mag as my bush gun because I really like the rifle. Short, light and fast handling. My best friend used a Savage pump in 30-30 for the same reason, I think he was buried with it. My opinion anyways, but you can't go to far wrong with either.
Excellent choices hoyt basically exactly what I posted above = my 14" barreled 375JDJ gives almost exactly the same ballistics/velocities as the 38/55 & 375 Win do in full length 20" plus barreled rifles.
I also recently purchased a 24" stainless T/C Encore barrel in 45-70 going to get it shortened to 18.6" so I can shoot my Marlin 1895GS 300gr - 550gr loads in a short light single shot thumper.
I also recently purchased a 24" stainless T/C Encore barrel in 45-70 going to get it shortened to 18.6" so I can shoot my Marlin 1895GS 300gr - 550gr loads in a short light single shot thumper.
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More killing power in a 45 colt than a 30/30 ?
Well here they are how about this for handier =
Yeah I know you're talking 30-30/44 mag but there is so much better out there.
14" barreled 375JDJ 235gr @ 2050fps
14" barreled 45-70 350gr @ 1600fps
or my pip squeak 14" barreled 45 Colt that has more killing thump out to 150 yards than the 30-30.
Yes with modern top loads the 45 Colt is better than a 30-30 out to 150 yards compared to a 44 mag that is better than a 30-30 out to only 100 yards.
It's only past 150 yards that the 30-30's higher BC's give it an advantage in trajectory and that is not taking into consideration the heavyweight bullets momentum.
Read up on John Linebaugh and Ross Seyfried 45 Colt articles.
It's only past 150 yards that the 30-30's higher BC's give it an advantage in trajectory and that is not taking into consideration the heavyweight bullets momentum.
Read up on John Linebaugh and Ross Seyfried 45 Colt articles.
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I actually had your option C, a JM stamped Marlin Cowboy in 38-55. A really nice rifle but unfortunately my supply of Barnes 255 gr jacketed bullets dried up and it was languishing as a safe queen. I had to send it to a better home last year. But I agree, a great cartridge/rifle combo.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I'd be inclined to pick the .30/30, as I never got the logic of putting pistol cartridges in a rifle. If I'm going to carry a rifle, I want it to be chambered for a rifle cartridge. Put a 125 gr spitzer in the .30/30's chamber, (load the magazine with blunt nosed bullets if it makes you feel better) and backed with a load that will spit it out at 2600, and you have an honest 200 yard rifle. A .44 isn't ideal for shooting game at 200 yards, and pointy .44 bullets are rather uncommon.
If the .44 lever action has any advantage its that you can carry more rounds in it's tube magazine, a point that is not without merit. Besides, the advantage of the traditional lever gun isn't the cartridges it was chambered for, its that the rifles were thin enough to make them great to carrying. The "modern" lever actions, the Savage 99, the Winchester 88, the Browning BLR, and the SAKO Finnwolf were all chambered for more capable cartridges, but no one cared because they didn't carry as nice as a 94 or a 336. In situations where the .30/30 is enough, more doesn't help very much, because more means more weight, more length, and more girth. If you need more cartridge in a rifle that is nearly as friendly to carry, get a Remington 760/7600 in .30/06.
If the .44 lever action has any advantage its that you can carry more rounds in it's tube magazine, a point that is not without merit. Besides, the advantage of the traditional lever gun isn't the cartridges it was chambered for, its that the rifles were thin enough to make them great to carrying. The "modern" lever actions, the Savage 99, the Winchester 88, the Browning BLR, and the SAKO Finnwolf were all chambered for more capable cartridges, but no one cared because they didn't carry as nice as a 94 or a 336. In situations where the .30/30 is enough, more doesn't help very much, because more means more weight, more length, and more girth. If you need more cartridge in a rifle that is nearly as friendly to carry, get a Remington 760/7600 in .30/06.
