Hey guys, I'm considering installing a Wilson combat full length guide rod in the ruger sr1911. Does anyone have any first hand experience with these? I've read lots of opinions on the pro and cons of them but I was really hoping to seek out some people who have used them and are willing to offer up some advice. Thanks for your time.
1911 full length guide rod
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canucklehead
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It looks cool. Pretty much the only benefit. Depends on the type, but it can make takedown a little trickier/longer or take an additional tool. Ive owned 1911's with both, but only because some came with the FLGR - I wouldn't personally spend extra money on it.
Some guys say it tames recoil, improves accuracy, etc. I don't think any of that is even close to proven. If it was REALLY a proven upgrade that had benefits, ALL of the 1911 makers would be using them.
It's more a personalization thing to me... but I don't think you'll see any REAL benefits.
Some guys say it tames recoil, improves accuracy, etc. I don't think any of that is even close to proven. If it was REALLY a proven upgrade that had benefits, ALL of the 1911 makers would be using them.
It's more a personalization thing to me... but I don't think you'll see any REAL benefits.
Wilson makes very good products so if you want a full length guide rod in your gun you can buy with confidence. Do you need one? No. The 1911 pistol was designed without a full length rod and has worked just fine that way for over a hundred years.
However, in IPSC we use full length rods pretty much exclusively in our competition guns. Admittedly, many of the guys who use them have no idea what purpose they serve because they don't get too deeply into the nitty-gritty of race gun tuning. They just buy the gun and go shoot it. The ones who are always tinkering though, looking for that extra little competitive edge, know that they can be used to help adjust balance of the gun to preference. Different materials and designs like steel, polymer, tungsten, as well as aluminum, mercury filled, Recoil Masters, etc., all yield slightly different results. Putting the extra weight of a steel or tungsten guide rod up front in a gun adds some recoil dampening effect but also adds recoil dwell (added inertia and momentum), which is something that can be tuned to personal taste by playing with materials. They also help smooth out the cycle somewhat, though most shooters wouldn't be able to tell the difference...especially on a standard-sprung .45. They are a must-have for most compensated guns due to take-down requirements.
However, in IPSC we use full length rods pretty much exclusively in our competition guns. Admittedly, many of the guys who use them have no idea what purpose they serve because they don't get too deeply into the nitty-gritty of race gun tuning. They just buy the gun and go shoot it. The ones who are always tinkering though, looking for that extra little competitive edge, know that they can be used to help adjust balance of the gun to preference. Different materials and designs like steel, polymer, tungsten, as well as aluminum, mercury filled, Recoil Masters, etc., all yield slightly different results. Putting the extra weight of a steel or tungsten guide rod up front in a gun adds some recoil dampening effect but also adds recoil dwell (added inertia and momentum), which is something that can be tuned to personal taste by playing with materials. They also help smooth out the cycle somewhat, though most shooters wouldn't be able to tell the difference...especially on a standard-sprung .45. They are a must-have for most compensated guns due to take-down requirements.
My Norc 1911 has the FLGR, as do all of them (I think). Makes no difference to the function really and makes no difference in field stripping aside from the spring plug being a bit harder to push down on with the open end.
Mark
Mark
A bushing wrench makes that much easier. The other method is to drill a small hole in the rod to put a capture pin in it. You retract the slide past slide-lock, pin it, and capture the spring and reverse plug in a compressed state. Then everything comes apart nice and easy.
Keep the short guide rod; FLGRs serve no useful purpose on a 1911. Between the recoil spring plug and the short guide rod, the recoil spring is for all intents and purposes fully guided as installed in the gun.
The Springfield Armory custom shop builds the Professional model for the FBI to meet an accuracy standard of 1.5" groups at 25 yards. These pistols have a standard guide rod.
The Springfield Armory custom shop builds the Professional model for the FBI to meet an accuracy standard of 1.5" groups at 25 yards. These pistols have a standard guide rod.
My STI Spartan .45 has a FLGR and, as others have noted, it does make it a bit harder to take apart. On mine, the cap it slides through has a sharp edge which is a bit hard on the fingers when you're trying to put it back together. Maybe someone makes a FLGR cap/tube with a "melted" or smoother opening. I'd be up for one of those.
I can understand the "tinker factor" that relliott talks about above but that is probably only relevant to serious competition shooters. As I recall from posts on 1911forum.com the consensus seems to be, "God (ie JMB!) didn't use it, so it's not necessary." So my advice would be, if it floats your boat, go for it; it certainly won't do any harm.
Stuart
I can understand the "tinker factor" that relliott talks about above but that is probably only relevant to serious competition shooters. As I recall from posts on 1911forum.com the consensus seems to be, "God (ie JMB!) didn't use it, so it's not necessary." So my advice would be, if it floats your boat, go for it; it certainly won't do any harm.
Stuart
I like them. I find they tighten up the gun which in turn helps with shot to shot consistancy. Spring compression is smoother and it acts as a 3rd bearing surface for the slide/frame fit.
That said, you would probably have to ransom test it to see any improvement
That said, you would probably have to ransom test it to see any improvement
heavenIsAlie
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the standard setup is better on a duty gun simply because if the gun jams up you can smash the recoil spring part of the slide on a hard surface to work the slide and clear it. with a FLG you cant do that
I like the FLG simply because when i take the top end off it keeps it all together for me when all i want to work on is the frame
I've spent money to get GI-type guide rods before, so I could get rid of FLGRs.
I wouldn't necessarily chuck a FLGR every time, but in general I would prefer the standard type, and I would definitely never spend money to get a FLGR.
I wouldn't necessarily chuck a FLGR every time, but in general I would prefer the standard type, and I would definitely never spend money to get a FLGR.
Just a note: Guide rods, full length or standard, have absolutely no effect on mechanical accuracy. That is a function of barrel and slide fit.
On the comment above re. duty guns: this would be absolutely true if there were any 1911's being used as issued sidearms anymore. At least, I am not aware of any in North America. Further, IPSC rules forbid whacking the gun on any hard surface to clear malfunctions so it's not a practical concern there either. The flgr is a competition part, primarily useful in sports where speed of shot to shot recovery is an issue. It's merely one possible venue for micro-tuning the balance and recoil arc of your firearm.
On the recoil spring weight question (post #11): No, spring weight is not a consideration with a flgr. Use what works best with your load.
On the comment above re. duty guns: this would be absolutely true if there were any 1911's being used as issued sidearms anymore. At least, I am not aware of any in North America. Further, IPSC rules forbid whacking the gun on any hard surface to clear malfunctions so it's not a practical concern there either. The flgr is a competition part, primarily useful in sports where speed of shot to shot recovery is an issue. It's merely one possible venue for micro-tuning the balance and recoil arc of your firearm.
On the recoil spring weight question (post #11): No, spring weight is not a consideration with a flgr. Use what works best with your load.
There are still a bunch of organizations that issue 1911s - in fact I would guess that even a very brief look at this forum would reveal a thread about the Colt gun that the Marines just ordered - but obviously it's much less common than it used to be.
Still, there are a bunch of outfits that do issue them. Some guys within the FBI HRT still (rather famously) use them, as do some of the LAPD SWAT guys. Those are probably the most well-known examples.
Granted Glocks are in heavy use by almost every major group that is famous for its 1911s, from the HRT to CAG to LAPD SWAT...but the point is they are still issue guns, although not for very many people any more.
Still, there are a bunch of outfits that do issue them. Some guys within the FBI HRT still (rather famously) use them, as do some of the LAPD SWAT guys. Those are probably the most well-known examples.
Granted Glocks are in heavy use by almost every major group that is famous for its 1911s, from the HRT to CAG to LAPD SWAT...but the point is they are still issue guns, although not for very many people any more.
Yeah, I guess I'm thinking standard issue rather than special groups like SWAT etc. Those guys get a lot more training than your typical beat cop.
