1911 won't fire with new Wilson Combat grip safety

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SaskatchShooter

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Hi everyone. I recently got some parts from Brownells and have fitted everyhibg to my Norinco 1911. The problem I'm having is that when I go to install the grip safety, when I install the thumb safety to hold the beavertail in, the gun will no longer fire. If I don't have the thumb safety in, I can fire the gun normally and everything works.

I understand that these parts require some fitting and I've had to work with the barrel bushing and trigger that I installed even though they say they are "drop in". Has anyone gone through this before and able to provide me with some info and what could be the problem? I can't seem to figure what is contacting or what part of the beavertail is causing the problem.

Thanks for any help.
 
The grip safety has an 'arm' that protrudes forward, there is a notch/cutout on the underside of this arm. This notch is where the rear portion of the trigger goes when the trigger is pulled.

The grip safety pivots. When at rest, the arm drops down and prevents the trigger from moving far enough to the rear to fire the gun. When the grip safety is pressed inwards the arm rises and the notch provides room for the triiger to move rearward and fire the gun.
 
Dicking with safeties and triggers is NOT something that should be attempted by ANYONE who apparently has NO CONCEPT of how the 1911 functions! Be aware that improperly installed or operating safety systems not only puts the shooter at risk BUT also the shooters around them.
And don't claim "If I don't have the thumb safety in, I can fire the gun normally and everything works!" No!!!! A 1911 without a properly functioning thumb safety is neither a properly functioning gun NOR a safe gun to be using!!!!

The best info ANYONEcan give you is: Quit DICKING with the gun - take it to a knowlegable/experienced person to get that gun functioning properly before we read about YOU and your malfunctioning gun in the papers!!!!!
 
I will less enthusiastically support SuperTed's position. ;)

Don't live fire or live round cycle a firearm that you know isn't 100%. Having said that, if you have properly marked dummies or better yet "snap caps" and are interested in home gun smithing I say go for it! Be sure you know what you're doing and how to do it, and if you're unsure ask {which is what I believe he's doing, so good on you.}. Now, if you're gun malfunctions and I'm in the shooting stall next to you and I happen to catch the round, understand that I have 1.3 seconds before my blood psi drops to the point where I pass out. Also understand that I too have a firearm in hand and can empty said firearm on target in 1.3 seconds...:) {joke, relax}
 
Thanks for the responses Lodi and Plinker777. No I definitely did not actually fire a live round through a gun that wasn't completely functional and sorry if I phrased it badly.

If anyone else is interested, another member sent me a helpful video that explains the problem that I seemed to be having. Message me and I can send you the link.
 
superted said:
Dicking with safeties and triggers is NOT something that should be attempted by ANYONE who apparently has NO CONCEPT of how the 1911 functions! Be aware that improperly installed or operating safety systems not only puts the shooter at risk BUT also the shooters around them.
And don't claim "If I don't have the thumb safety in, I can fire the gun normally and everything works!" No!!!! A 1911 without a properly functioning thumb safety is neither a properly functioning gun NOR a safe gun to be using!!!!

The best info ANYONEcan give you is: Quit DICKING with the gun - take it to a knowlegable/experienced person to get that gun functioning properly before we read about YOU and your malfunctioning gun in the papers!!!!!
Click to expand...

Do you think Samuel Colt or John Moses Browning had some godly person to take their firearms to when they were trying to tinker, invent and figure things out? Or how about someone more modern like Ronnie Barrett when he experimented building his first semi auto 50 BMG?

Tinkering is what paves the future for more developments in firearms and you shouldn't jump on people for doing it.
 
The fact is that you are both correct:

Guns are dangerous machines and in the hands of an unskilled machinist, become significantly more dangerous. That said, they are relatively unsophisticated machines and if you have the patience, equipment and mechanical aptitude, there is no reason you cannot safely fix your own machines be they cars, lawn mowers or 1911's.

Bottom line is that if you're starting out in working on firearms, it is best to work with someone more experienecd or have them check over your work after the fact.

As for Samuel Colt or JMB, I'll paraphrase Lloyd Bentsen's response to Dan Quayle: You are not Samuel Colt or JMB.

FF

mildcustom2 said:
Do you think Samuel Colt or John Moses Browning had some godly person to take their firearms to when they were trying to tinker, invent and figure things out? Or how about someone more modern like Ronnie Barrett when he experimented building his first semi auto 50 BMG?

Tinkering is what paves the future for more developments in firearms and you shouldn't jump on people for doing it.
Click to expand...

superted said:
Dicking with safeties and triggers is NOT something that should be attempted by ANYONE who apparently has NO CONCEPT of how the 1911 functions! Be aware that improperly installed or operating safety systems not only puts the shooter at risk BUT also the shooters around them.
And don't claim "If I don't have the thumb safety in, I can fire the gun normally and everything works!" No!!!! A 1911 without a properly functioning thumb safety is neither a properly functioning gun NOR a safe gun to be using!!!!

The best info ANYONEcan give you is: Quit DICKING with the gun - take it to a knowlegable/experienced person to get that gun functioning properly before we read about YOU and your malfunctioning gun in the papers!!!!!
Click to expand...
 
For future reference, NO fire control components on a 1911 are truly drop in/no gunsmithing needed, unless you get really really lucky. You MIGHT be able to get a drop in barrel, but even then, your giving up precision to achieve that. There is a ton of good information out there on fitting parts, but when you start playing with trigger/saftey or hammer/sear for the first few times, it's always a good idea to have a gunsmith check your work after. It won't cost much, and you might get a few free pointers for next time to boot!
 
To put my original post into perspective - my "criticism" was not designed to discourage ANYONE from "TINKERING " with their 1911 BUT to recognize the CRITICAL mechanisms of the gun that should be addressed only by those VERY FAMILIAR with their proper and safe operation - the trigger/hammer/sear/disconnector/thumb and grip safeties being the most critical!

Re: the grip safety: as an IPSC Range Officer - several times I saw an AD caused by an improperly fitted grip safety that did come off safe until the grip was depressed to its MAXIMUM. In each case the shooter thought there was some kind of malfunction, changed their grip slightly with the finger still on the trigger and the gun discharged " accidently". Although the gun was still safely pointed downrange it was an AD and the shooter(s) were DQ'd. Proper installation requires only SLIGHT depression of the grip safety and a "stout" spring tension to hold it in the "safe" position.

Re: the "helpful video". Yes the " gentleman" was successful in making it "fit" but I take umbridge with someone posting such videos and making the statement at 4:10 "allows the trigger to come back to engage the sear" ..... !!!!! NO! The trigger NEVER engages the SEAR! The trigger bow presses on the disconnector and the DISCONNECTOR presses on the sear!!!

If anyone wants to "tinker" with their 1911 -start off properly : get BOOKS on the subject and READ READ READ! Books are carefully written, proof read for content, spelling and credibility and the author's "credentials" clearly stated. UTube vids DON'T CUT IT!!!!!

My recommendation is the Jerry Kuhnhausen book "The Colt .45 Automatic - A Shop Manual". If it doesn't tell you what and how to do it - then you don't need to know it! AND YES I know it costs $35 + but anyone baulking at the price compared to the knowlege contained therein really doesn't deserve much sympathy! GET THE BOOK!!! READ READ READ. Recently I was confounded by a problem with a 1911 and after thrashing around for TOO LONG finally solved the problem. A week later -on a "smoke break" -pulled out "The Jerry book" and started browsing from back to front and THERE amongst his "miscellaneous" comments was the FIX the problem I'd thrashed with for days!!! PROOF old dogs CAN STILL be taught new tricks!!

To conclude: these comments are NOT DESIGNED to discourage anyone but rather to ENCOURAGE and IMPLORE them to get started properly by READING READING READING and studying studying and learning from RELIABLE KNOWLEDGABLE resources!!!
 
superted said:
To put my original post into perspective - my "criticism" was not designed to discourage ANYONE from "TINKERING " with their 1911 BUT to recognize the CRITICAL mechanisms of the gun that should be addressed only by those VERY FAMILIAR with their proper and safe operation - the trigger/hammer/sear/disconnector/thumb and grip safeties being the most critical!

Re: the grip safety: as an IPSC Range Officer - several times I saw an AD caused by an improperly fitted grip safety that did come off safe until the grip was depressed to its MAXIMUM. In each case the shooter thought there was some kind of malfunction, changed their grip slightly with the finger still on the trigger and the gun discharged " accidently". Although the gun was still safely pointed downrange it was an AD and the shooter(s) were DQ'd. Proper installation requires only SLIGHT depression of the grip safety and a "stout" spring tension to hold it in the "safe" position.

Re: the "helpful video". Yes the " gentleman" was successful in making it "fit" but I take umbridge with someone posting such videos and making the statement at 4:10 "allows the trigger to come back to engage the sear" ..... !!!!! NO! The trigger NEVER engages the SEAR! The trigger bow presses on the disconnector and the DISCONNECTOR presses on the sear!!!

If anyone wants to "tinker" with their 1911 -start off properly : get BOOKS on the subject and READ READ READ! Books are carefully written, proof read for content, spelling and credibility and the author's "credentials" clearly stated. UTube vids DON'T CUT IT!!!!!

My recommendation is the Jerry Kuhnhausen book "The Colt .45 Automatic - A Shop Manual". If it doesn't tell you what and how to do it - then you don't need to know it! AND YES I know it costs $35 + but anyone baulking at the price compared to the knowlege contained therein really doesn't deserve much sympathy! GET THE BOOK!!! READ READ READ. Recently I was confounded by a problem with a 1911 and after thrashing around for TOO LONG finally solved the problem. A week later -on a "smoke break" -pulled out "The Jerry book" and started browsing from back to front and THERE amongst his "miscellaneous" comments was the FIX the problem I'd thrashed with for days!!! PROOF old dogs CAN STILL be taught new tricks!!

To conclude: these comments are NOT DESIGNED to discourage anyone but rather to ENCOURAGE and IMPLORE them to get started properly by READING READING READING and studying studying and learning from RELIABLE KNOWLEDGABLE resources!!!
Click to expand...

It's funny to see someone rant about the trigger not engaging the sear but the disconnector (which then engages the sear), and in the same rant, describe an ND caused by shooter error as an AD caused by a grip safety.

The grip safety didn't cause ####. The shooter fired the gun. If you're looking for a secondary cause, find out why the RO wad letting someone finger #### their gun while trying to diagnose something.
 
superted said:
To put my original post into perspective - my "criticism" was not designed to discourage ANYONE from "TINKERING " with their 1911 BUT to recognize the CRITICAL mechanisms of the gun that should be addressed only by those VERY FAMILIAR with their proper and safe operation - the trigger/hammer/sear/disconnector/thumb and grip safeties being the most critical!

Re: the grip safety: as an IPSC Range Officer - several times I saw an AD caused by an improperly fitted grip safety that did come off safe until the grip was depressed to its MAXIMUM. In each case the shooter thought there was some kind of malfunction, changed their grip slightly with the finger still on the trigger and the gun discharged " accidently". Although the gun was still safely pointed downrange it was an AD and the shooter(s) were DQ'd. Proper installation requires only SLIGHT depression of the grip safety and a "stout" spring tension to hold it in the "safe" position.

Re: the "helpful video". Yes the " gentleman" was successful in making it "fit" but I take umbridge with someone posting such videos and making the statement at 4:10 "allows the trigger to come back to engage the sear" ..... !!!!! NO! The trigger NEVER engages the SEAR! The trigger bow presses on the disconnector and the DISCONNECTOR presses on the sear!!!

If anyone wants to "tinker" with their 1911 -start off properly : get BOOKS on the subject and READ READ READ! Books are carefully written, proof read for content, spelling and credibility and the author's "credentials" clearly stated. UTube vids DON'T CUT IT!!!!!

My recommendation is the Jerry Kuhnhausen book "The Colt .45 Automatic - A Shop Manual". If it doesn't tell you what and how to do it - then you don't need to know it! AND YES I know it costs $35 + but anyone baulking at the price compared to the knowlege contained therein really doesn't deserve much sympathy! GET THE BOOK!!! READ READ READ. Recently I was confounded by a problem with a 1911 and after thrashing around for TOO LONG finally solved the problem. A week later -on a "smoke break" -pulled out "The Jerry book" and started browsing from back to front and THERE amongst his "miscellaneous" comments was the FIX the problem I'd thrashed with for days!!! PROOF old dogs CAN STILL be taught new tricks!!

To conclude: these comments are NOT DESIGNED to discourage anyone but rather to ENCOURAGE and IMPLORE them to get started properly by READING READING READING and studying studying and learning from RELIABLE KNOWLEDGABLE resources!!!
Click to expand...

ok, ok, ALRIGHT ALREADY! :)
 
misanthropist said:
It's funny to see someone rant about the trigger not engaging the sear but the disconnector (which then engages the sear), and in the same rant, describe an ND caused by shooter error as an AD caused by a grip safety.

The grip safety didn't cause ####. The shooter fired the gun. If you're looking for a secondary cause, find out why the RO wad letting someone finger #### their gun while trying to diagnose something.
Click to expand...

I chuckled too;)
 
That video was pretty good.. As for playing with your trigger and your safety... Good on ya.. Most guys that attempt to figure out their guns already have a basic understanding of how things work.. No harm in trying it and figuring it out!... Now If y'all can't change a tire on your truck... Then maybe Amateur gunsmithing is not your thing.. But if you choose to and make a mistake! So long as it's not a shooting mistake causing injury.. Or worst! I'm confident that some1 on GNs will be able to help ya out.. :)
 
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