1939 BSA stripped out screw

tadam05

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Hi Fellas,

I need some help or suggestions on what to do with a stripped out nosecap screw. I purchased a 1939 BSA SMLE quite a while ago, and recently decided to pull the old girl apart, to give her a thorough cleaning. Upon doing so, I see that the longer horizontal bolt on the nose cap has been stripped out. I was able to get the bolt out, figuring I could just replace it with a new one, but there are no threads left in the nosecap at all(new bolt just falls into place). It is an all numbers matching gun, including the nosecap, and I would like to keep it that way. So, what are my options? Any help is very much appreciated!

Tim.
 
weld, drill, tap and refinish? i imagine in the field these would have a new nosecap brought up and re stamped, but unstamped nose caps arent around anymore. you could replace the cap and keep the original with the gun.
 
Heli-coil.

Can you post a picture of the piece? I'm not a lee enfield expert so I can't visualize the part you're talking about.

Regardless, a heli-coil is the ultimate repair for a stripped out thread. You may have to special order a british thread version.

Once you purchase the correct coils and installer, you drill out the hole to the specified size, tap it with the helicoil tool, turn in the helicoil with the installer, snap off the tang, and you have a new thread in the ORIGINAL size.

It is also usually stronger than the parent metal, being made of stainless steel, and having more engagement with the surrounding material than the original threads.

I use heli-coils all the time in aluminum parts. They are usable in steel as well.
 
Hi Fellas,

I need some help or suggestions on what to do with a stripped out nosecap screw. I purchased a 1939 BSA SMLE quite a while ago, and recently decided to pull the old girl apart, to give her a thorough cleaning. Upon doing so, I see that the longer horizontal bolt on the nose cap has been stripped out. I was able to get the bolt out, figuring I could just replace it with a new one, but there are no threads left in the nosecap at all(new bolt just falls into place). It is an all numbers matching gun, including the nosecap, and I would like to keep it that way. So, what are my options? Any help is very much appreciated!

Tim.
I would suggest welding the hole(MIG or TIG welding),drill and tap.
Joce
 
The only problem with welding and re tapping is you will find it hard to find a tap with the pitch and thread of the British bolt.Also even if you weld from the inside you will discolour the nose cap.I would look for a common slotted round head machine screw with the same contour that is just slightly larger than the original and tap for that.Blue the new screw and you can hardly tell anything was done.
 
Damn you guys are helpful! I think I'm going to go with mr.e moose's recommendation. Seems to be the lesser of the evils required to fix the old Enfield. Thanks a bunch, CGN members!
 
Another way (if you are as cheap as I am and really want to preserve the thing without refinishing) would be to remove the Nosecap, clean it thoroughly and put a spot of JB Weld or something similar into the hole in which the thread is stripped. Keep it out until the JB Weld BEGINS setting up, pop it back onto the rifle, GREASE the new bolt, especially the threads, and assemble.

With any luck, you will "take up the slack" without permanently gluing the Screw to the Nosecap. This is why you wait until the stuff is setting-up before you assemble.

Do it carefully and it should work.

That screw is .1875 diameter by 33 threads per inch. Thread angle likely is 55 degrees. You are NOT likely to run into a tap and die set on this side of the Great Puddle.

Good luck.
 
John Sukey is right, of course. John is ALWAYS right; you can take that to the bank.

Screwy things really do happen when you get into older Enfield-designed rifles.

REALLY screwy.

Enfield was the FIRST factory of any kind in the world to have 100% standardised screw threads WITH tolerances so TIGHT that the parts were guaranteed to be interchangeable. Previously to this, parts were made with a fair amount of slop so that they would go together with a minimum of hand-fitting.

The culprit in all of this was Sir Joseph Whtworth, who was NOT a gunsmith; he was a maker of specialised tools and measuring instruments. When he was appointed the Master at Enfield, Enfield already had a good rifle, the Pattern of 1853 .577`muzzle-loader. This was to become one of the common rifles in both the Union AND the Confederate armies during the Civil War. Whitworth's job was to tighten up manufacturing tolerances in order to make the rifles 100% machine-made and 100% interchangeable. He accomplished this to such a degree that the finished product was re-Sealed as the Pattern of 1858; these were the new, modern rifles which became the iron-barreled Snider-Enfields Mark I, I*, II and II** only a few years later. This is why Pattern 1858 rifles are much less common than the older 1853; the 1853 model was surplussed to make rack room for the newer rifles, thus were not at hand when the Snider conversion program started in late 1865. The new-made steel-barreled Mark III is properly referred to as a "Snider Rifle", not as a "Snider-Enfield".

In the process of tightening things up, Whitworth continued the use of some very old screw-threads but, whenever possible, changed things over to his preferred rounded 55-degree type. Once problems at Enfield were solved, Whitworth went on to design and standardise his two most famous systems, the coarse BSW threads and the fine BSF threads. These all have his 55-degree V with rounded tops and bottoms. The Bolt, Stock, Butt of the SMLE rifle, for example, is a BSW thread. But a FEW old threads continued in use on the SMLE rifle until the end of production and still are being made today in India and Pakistan, both of which manufacture all parts for the SMLE with the single exception of the Body...... and Ishapore even continues to make Bodies for their 8x50R Sporting Rifle on a Lee action.

Whitworth-designed threads became the world standard for a time and spin-offs from the Whitworth standard still are in common use. American NC threads, for example, follow the same pitch as Whitworth calculated for his BSW threads, but use the easily-cut American 60-degree sharp V threads rather than the stronger, less liable to stress-fracture Whitworth type. Bicycles and motorcycles used the CEI thread system (those d*mned English "26" threads), which is based (loosely) on Whitworth's BSF system.

The Number 4 Rifle is based almost entirely on 47-1/2-degree BA (British Association) threads which are halfway to a metric standard and interchange with nothing else.

But no matter how you look at things, they are still SCREWED, one way or another!

Yeah, I know: Whitworth was a screwy guy!
 
The thread is 26 1/2 tpi for the nose cap. Have the hole touched up with mig and give me a PM. I have the 26 1/2 tpi Enfield tap, and also the die. As an alternative, make a new oversize screw. You have NO idea the number of stripped nose cap threads that are around and just the friction of the wood is holding them in. British BA taps are close for the number of threads you need so it will not matter. Just mig or tig the edge of the hole and get a BA tap. Brain fart does not allow me to remember the number but think it is BA3 or 2. Smellie...how do we remember to do up our fly after inhaling all the smoke from German powder :)##
PS:One of the reasons Enfield had a hard time in parallel manufacturing with interchangeability with others was the Enfield inch standard was incorrect. Enfields standard was actually incorrect....it had an error.

For closer to a 26tpi tap than BA use British bicycle thread or British Brass thread. One or the other has the 26 tpi
 
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