2 questions about Buying 500- fps air pistol!

There are some extensive discussions on this topic on the Canadian Airgun Forum - in a nutshell, the story goes that the reason is because there are commonly available .177 pellets that can achieve the 4.2 fpe threshold at 500 fps.

Based on an online muzzle energy calculator, a 7.9 grain .177 pellet moving at 500 fps is darn close to the line, if not over. Definitely too close from a commercial liability standpoint for retailers to stop requesting a PAL.

Only my 0.02 there ....:)
 
The FPE rule was implemented to establish a limit when using ultra light non-lead pellets. Take an airgun shooting 495fps with normal (~7.9gr) pellets and throw in a prometheus pellet. The gun, legal at 495fps shooting the 7.9gr pellet, would then shoot over 500fps with the lighter pellets but still is not considered a firearm because of the lower energy. Both conditions must be met.
 
TERMINATOR101CA said:
I wonder if both these conditions have to be met for it to be considered a firearm, or just one would suffice . Legal interpretation , assuming that is exactly how the law is written , would suggest that both conditions have to be met for this to apply but who's willing to find out...........
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Yes, according to the factsheet posted by member idontknowjack,
RCMP is saying that BOTH conditions have to be met:



idontknowjack said:
Air pistols shooting over 500fps AND 4.2FPE are restricted firearms.

From the RCMP Airguns Fact Sheet...

1. Air guns that are firearms for purposes of both the Firearms Act and the Criminal Code.

These are air guns with both a high muzzle velocity (greater than 152.4 meters or 500 feet per second) and a high muzzle energy (greater than 5.7 joules or 4.2 foot-pounds). The “muzzle velocity” is the speed of a projectile at the instant it leaves the muzzle of a gun, normally expressed in metres per second or feet per second. The “muzzle energy” is the energy of a projectile at the instant it leaves the muzzle of a gun, expressed in joules or foot-pounds. Air guns need to meet both standards to be classified as firearms for purposes of the Firearms Act.

These high-powered air guns are subject to the same licence and registration requirements as a conventional firearm.

You are also required to store, transport, display and handle them safely in accordance with the regulations supporting the Firearms Act.

Usually, the manufacturer’s specifications are used to determine what muzzle velocity and muzzle energy an air gun was designed to have. This information may be available in the user’s manual or on the manufacturer’s web site. If the information is not available, individuals can call 1 800 731-4000 and ask to speak to a firearms technician to find out if the air gun is classified as a firearm for purposes of the Firearms Act.

High-powered air rifles are classified as non-restricted firearms. High-powered air pistols are classified as restricted if their barrel is longer than 105 mm or prohibited if their barrel length is 105 mm or less.
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If that is the truth, then I guess that in the case of the airgun pistols
classed as firearms, they also have to meet
the requirements for minimum barrel length and maximum mag capacity.
 
Dr.Lector said:
If that is the truth, then I guess that in the case of the airgun pistols classed as firearms, they also have to meet
the requirements for minimum barrel length and maximum mag capacity.
Click to expand...

Yes 12/6 prohibited applies if you don't make the minimum barrel length & exceed 500 fps (& the energy threshold).

Mag capacity would be difficult since none of them are truly semi-automatic, other than the CO2 operated blowback BB guns which, mechanically, would be difficult to extract 500 fps from (and very poor accuracy with BBs at that speed anyway so why - BBs also won't generate the fpe until even higher FPS)....interesting question there.
 
I wouldn't worry about buying a +500 pistol there aren't many available, the people who need to worry are those who chose to mod 2240s and the like.
 
NorthCoastBigBore said:
Yes 12/6 prohibited applies if you don't make the minimum barrel length & exceed 500 fps (& the energy threshold).

Mag capacity would be difficult since none of them are truly semi-automatic, other than the CO2 operated blowback BB guns which, mechanically, would be difficult to extract 500 fps from (and very poor accuracy with BBs at that speed anyway so why - BBs also won't generate the fpe until even higher FPS)....interesting question there.
Click to expand...
I don't have the law handy by, but as far as I remember,
the mag capacity restriction in CCC is for "handguns" period,
wheather they are revolvers, semi, single/double action, bolt, pump, whatever.
 
Dr.Lector said:
I don't have the law handy by, but as far as I remember,
the mag capacity restriction in CCC is for "handguns" period,
wheather they are revolvers, semi, single/double action, bolt, pump, whatever.
Click to expand...

It is actually "semi-automatic" handgun (see also RCMP bulletin No.72, but that is only an interpretation):

CCC Reg SOR 98-462:

3. (1) Any cartridge magazine

(b) that is capable of containing more than 10 cartridges of the type for which the magazine was originally designed and that is designed or manufactured for use in a semi-automatic handgun that is commonly available in Canada.

"semi-automatic" for the purposes of this regulation is also defined as (also SOR 98-462):


INTERPRETATION

1. In these Regulations, “semi-automatic”, in respect of a firearm, means a firearm that is equipped with a mechanism that, following the discharge of a cartridge, automatically operates to complete any part of the reloading cycle necessary to prepare for the discharge of the next cartridge.


- so if the airgun is a mechanically operated repeater, no mag restriction.

Ya I know it's a maze of confusion these laws :)

And I am happily open to correction on any of this


...and of course, as is also stated above, buying an "over the counter" restricted pellet pistol is unlikely. The culprit here would most likely be a modified pistol
 
Keep in mind, that if any BB or pellet gun is used in a way that is deemed illegal, it could be classified as a firearm in regards to that offense - doesn't matter how fast or slow it shoots. A friend of mine back in the day got into a little trouble (could have gone really bad for him) back in the day because of this.
 
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