20 gauge SxS vs O/U

catnthehatt said:
Absolutely , it seems however that when guns like the Stoegers are mentioned they tend to get bashed by some - not that I am insinuating you were!:)
i also agree with you comments about the 311 and Fox.
just because a gun says AYA or Grulla does not mean it is an upper end gun , but if it fits well chances are a person will hit with it better than if the gun does not fit .
That was the point I was trying to make .
Cat
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I agree Cat. But in this thread, no one was bashing a Stoeger. The comment about it swinging like a plank was just an opinion based on the experience had by some. Yes, fit is the most important factor in ones ability to shoot a gun well. That being said, I had a stunning Browning XT that fit to perfection and I shot it well at trap. I tried shooting it in a game of skeet once and it too swung like a plank. I then shot a round with another fella who must have been twice my size and he shot the XT like it was a 5lbs gun. Moral of the story here for me is that description should not have resulted in the tirade that followed
 
I have no dog in this fight but do believe people could make a slight effort in choosing language that is not designed to offend others. Is "ground swatting" "swings like a plank" or "junk" really needed to describe another person's property, property that may in fact be every bit they could afford.

My late father purchased for me a Brazilian O/U 20 built on a 12 gauge frame with checkering so rough it would pull threads on your clothing. The gun was heavy and awkward but I shot it well enough and used it for many years. I did part with it after the old man passed and I hope it is as well loved now as it was when I owned it. The young fellow that purchased it was very happy to have it. I was worried he wouldn't make it out of town with his vehicle but he seemed equally as proud of the car so who am I to judge.

A young fellow that hunts with my son presented to me his new autoloader for inspection and I assume approval as it was nearly 2 grand. In my hands it felt like a tool designed to search for land mines. It was like 8-10 pounds and the majority of it was some how moved forward in to the forearm. I told him it felt very solid and would probably last for many years. I did tell him it was not just right for me and went on to tell him what I like in a shotgun. I let him handle and shoulder my shotgun and there was really no reason go any further with the conversation.

I know people get hurt for anything in this politically correct world but some of us have become internet experts at irking another person without crossing the line that gets a timeout or banning. Truth be damned, I am not going to tell anyone I meet that their wife is too heavy but would be okay if one were drunk, their dog is really ugly but kind of looks like a Labrador in low light, or their gun swings like a plank but would be okay if you are ground swatting chickens. It is simply language designed to irritate and offend. It holds no purpose other than to inflate the ego of the high horseman.
 
MK2750, those are very good points. Would be nice if we all approached a conversation on the net the way we do in person....usually with a bit of empathy for the person we are speaking to, be they friend or stranger.

This wouldn’t be the only place on the net that civil discourse can be hard to come by. I’ve come to believe, and more and more experts are beginning to talk about this, that communication on social media and Internet forums encourages incivility by removing the personal contact, which usually has the effect of moderating our speech and behaviour. Either because we can see the hurt we cause or we don’t want a black eye.
 
I likewise have no dog in this fight.

My first "upland gun" was a single shot H&R 20 gauge that cost me 70 bucks brand new (better to be hunting with what you can afford then waiting to buy a "good gun" some years in the future).

I finally bought my "I Want" upland gun last year, an O/U 20 (Fausti Class).

I spent a lot of time deciding what I was going to spend my money on and did consider a number of S/S's as well.

In the end, "for me", I just found the (sight picture) better looking out above an O/U - more natural for me I guess. Looking out over the S/S I saw nothing but barrels.

That was the deciding factor for me.
 
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You can choose whatever wording you like, but ground swatting is a very common term among hunters, and it isn't necessarily a negative thing, although some people take it that way. Some people also find the term "road hunter" to be negative but it is a very common method of hunting, and if it is done legally, I have no issue with it just as I have o issue with ground swatting grouse. As far as swinging like a plank,that is pretty much what some guns feel like to me, it is by no means personal. I could have posted that the balance felt very awkward to me, but some people would likely be offended with that wording as well. As for referring to someone else's gun as junk, I haven't done that, and the reason that the person who used that description did use that word, likely has a lot to do with the fact that he was referring to my shotguns, and it was more of a personal dig, than an attack on the actual shotgun. If I posted that I shoot a Krieghoff or a Perazzi, he would likely refer to them as junk as well, for the same reason.
As far as the elitist nonsense is concerned, I actually own a Huglu 20 gauge SxS which I use when I hunt in the rain. It isn't made to the same standards as my other SxS shotguns, but it is a very serviceable hunting gun. My waterfowl gun is an SX-3, which certainly isn't a high end shotgun, but I sold my A400, and my SBE2 and kept the SX-3, because I shoot that shotgun better, even though it is a much lower priced gun.
 
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canvasback said:
Would be nice if we all approached a conversation on the net the way we do in person....usually with a bit of empathy for the person we are speaking to, be they friend or stranger. This wouldn’t be the only place on the net that civil discourse can be hard to come by. I’ve come to believe, and more and more experts are beginning to talk about this, that communication on social media and Internet forums encourages incivility by removing the personal contact, which usually has the effect of moderating our speech and behaviour. Either because we can see the hurt we cause or we don’t want a black eye.
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So true. It is certainly not contributing to functional debate and it is entrenching biases. Look no further than any forum where politics is discussed. Depressing state of affairs.
 
stubblejumper said:
Prophet River usually has a good selection. I require a lot of drop at comb myself and Grulla fits me well with the standard dimensions. My go to 28 gauge SxS is an AYA number two that Prophet River ordered for me to my stock dimensions. I am acrually thinking of selling my matching 20 gauge AYA, because I am almost always shooting my 28 or 16 gauge. If you are looking for a lower end SxS, Prophet River handles Huglu as well, and they have quite a bit of drop at comb
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Wow they do have a lot of nice stuff. I'd be tempted by your 20 but sadly out of my range unless I can liquidate a few other toys. Unfortunately for me these days, the price of guns is double in my house because it also means the equivalent in shoes, handbags, or jewelry for my wife.
 
stubblejumper said:
As far as the elitist nonsense is concerned, I actually own a Huglu 20 gauge SxS which I use when I hunt in the rain.
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And there you have it.

I know you really don't get it. That's why I don't bother arguing with you very much anymore. You and I agree 99% of the time but you insist on using language that is offensive. Do you really think adding the "I use when I hunt in the rain" was necessary. What did it add to the statement apart from telling the owners of a Huglu that their gun is second rate in your eyes?

That's a really nice jacket you have there. I have the same one I use when changing the oil in the truck. The polyester just allows you to slide right under. Do you think this is a compliment or an insult?

Anyway, continue on and Happy New Year to you, sincerely. We have been down this road before and it is just an exercise in frustration for both of us.
 
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MK2750 said:
And there you have it.

I know you really don't get it. That's why I don't bother arguing with you very much anymore. You and I agree 99% of the time but you insist on using language that is offensive. Do you really think adding the "I use when I hunt in the rain" was necessary. What did it add to the statement apart from telling the owners of a Huglu that their gun is second rate in your eyes?

That's a really nice jacket you have there. I have the same one I use when changing the oil in the truck. The polyester just allows you to slide right under. Do you think this is a compliment or an insult?

Anyway, continue on and Happy New Year to you, sincerely. We have been down this road before and it is just an exercise in frustration for both of us.
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The fact that I hunt with the Huglu at all, is proof that I have confidence in that shotgun. It is a much less expensive gun, but I shoot it well, and I still trust that gun enough to depend on it to hunt with. If I don't trust a firearm, or if I feel uncomfortable shooting it, I won't own it.
 
This thread will get interesting when the likker gets flowing.
Yes, most of us agree 99% of the time and we have more in common than not. Look, everyone's feedback is 100% so we're not all knobs.
Rman shoots in Asics shoes, for instance. Me too. Love 'em.
My first duck hunt was as a teen and with my best friend and his dad. After the hunt the dad examined my gun which was a Lefever Nitro Special. My father bought it from the widow of his best friend growing up because he wanted the memory then he loaned it to me for the shoot. I was named after his deceased friend.
Buddy squints at it and says, "what's that say? Leftover Special? hahahaha". Since then I thought everyone that lorded up his vintage 870 was an ######.
 
MK2750 said:
My late father purchased for me a Brazilian O/U 20 built on a 12 gauge frame with checkering so rough it would pull threads on your clothing. The gun was heavy and awkward but I shot it well enough and used it for many years.
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Sounds like a Boito. My first doublegun was a Boito SxS .410 (on a 20 ga. frame), my springboard into the wonderful world of doubles :)
 
MK2750 said:
And there you have it.

I know you really don't get it. That's why I don't bother arguing with you very much anymore. You and I agree 99% of the time but you insist on using language that is offensive. Do you really think adding the "I use when I hunt in the rain" was necessary. What did it add to the statement apart from telling the owners of a Huglu that their gun is second rate in your eyes?

That's a really nice jacket you have there. I have the same one I use when changing the oil in the truck. The polyester just allows you to slide right under. Do you think this is a compliment or an insult?

Anyway, continue on and Happy New Year to you, sincerely. We have been down this road before and it is just an exercise in frustration for both of us.
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Good grief. I think its time for people to grow up and start to accept reality for what it is. This way of thinking reminds me of when my sister decided it would be a good idea to lecture me on why it was inappropriate to use the word retarded when referring to the ignition timing on my car. :confused:
 
When a question is posed that asks opinions about guns, it should hardly be surprising that you get "opinions".
My opinion is exactly what it is.
Your opinion may vary.
That you (anyone out there in cyberspace), have a different opinion, is not justification for abuse or nastiness.

I like guns that are graceful and have good handling characteristics. They are certainly not all expensive guns, but it gets hard to find graceful guns in the lowest end of the marketplace.

Happy New Year to all those on this site who share their knowledge so freely, with kindness and respect.
 
Stubble jumper - what do you think of the Huglu 20 gauge you have. There’s one on the EE for about $1000. Is that good value? I’ve been reading about the problems with the Huglu warranty center in Ontario and my hesitation is about getting any work done if there’s a problem. Anything I need to know about with respect to the Huglu (ie barrel regulation, shoddy workmanship)? Thanks
 
London22 said:
Stubble jumper - what do you think of the Huglu 20 gauge you have. There’s one on the EE for about $1000. Is that good value? I’ve been reading about the problems with the Huglu warranty center in Ontario and my hesitation is about getting any work done if there’s a problem. Anything I need to know about with respect to the Huglu (ie barrel regulation, shoddy workmanship)? Thanks
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I have personally owned five different CZ/Huglus, including their hammer Classic 12 bore down to two 28 gauge mini Bobwhites and had no failures with any of them.
Regulation was good as were the triggers.
The only negatives I have are the finish-- which can be re-done easily, and the swedging for the chokes, which is more of an aesthetics thing than anything.
Cat
 
London22 said:
Stubble jumper - what do you think of the Huglu 20 gauge you have. There’s one on the EE for about $1000. Is that good value? I’ve been reading about the problems with the Huglu warranty center in Ontario and my hesitation is about getting any work done if there’s a problem. Anything I need to know about with respect to the Huglu (ie barrel regulation, shoddy workmanship)? Thanks
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I have had two CZ Ringnecks and one CZ Grouse. No issues and I think they are quite good value for your money.
 
London22 said:
Stubble jumper - what do you think of the Huglu 20 gauge you have. There’s one on the EE for about $1000. Is that good value? I’ve been reading about the problems with the Huglu warranty center in Ontario and my hesitation is about getting any work done if there’s a problem. Anything I need to know about with respect to the Huglu (ie barrel regulation, shoddy workmanship)? Thanks
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I have only had mine for a few months, but my initial impression is that the triggers are a bit heavy, but other than that it looks very good for a gun in the price range. Mine with an English stock and two triggers was about $1000 new from Prophet River. Two people that I hunt with have the CZ versions, and no issues with them either.
 
Getting back to the OP. Shotguns need to fit you well. The shot needs to hit where you want it to. Since you mentioned you are a lefty finding one with the proper cast will be difficult. A neutral cast easier to find but still not very prevalent. I know you want a double gun but there are cheaper and very reliable semi autos that have adjustable stocks to accommodate lefties. The satisfaction of actually hitting with a well fitted gun overrules the aesthetics of the gun. I own 20,16,12 doubles in SxS, O/U and semis. All good quality guns and my goto gun is a Browning Citori Feather Lightning in 20g. With invectors I can choke to different covers so it's pretty close to a jack of all trades, not many SxS guns offer that. My point is don't get too wrapped up into what others feel is the right choice. Much like the magic wands in Harry Potter the right gun will choose you.
 
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