223 on gophers - > richardson ground squirrels

fed007

fed007

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223 is officially a varmint round... and my only varmint gun to date.

I have a question about ricochets with this round.

Say I am shooting at a gopher 100-150 yards out with winchester 55 grain Ball ammo. The gopher is sitting on its mound enjoying the sunshine, and I manage to miss the gopher altogether.

How much energy would be sapped from the projectile by hitting the ground? How far is it likely to travel? The round is obviously striking the ground at a fairly shallow angle... so I would expect it to bounce.

What can be expected? I intend to always be sure of my target and beyond, but this knowledge is important for me to know the likely range a ground ricochet'd 223 may travel.

Anyone have an Idea?


F7
 
yes thx, I realize there are more suitable rounds - such as hollow points or frangible tips...

I'd prefer to use up my 1500 rounds of Whinchester 55 grain.

any guess on what would happen with those?

F7
 
A friend of mine was in a similar position a couple of years ago and ended up trying FMJ on gophers. Unfortunately, the experience was less than satisfactory. On one session, I watched him hit several gophers only to watch them crawl or scramble away. One was literally hit three times before the gopher died. :eek:

I'd estimate that somewhere around a third of the FMJ rounds seemed to pop right through the animals, with no substantial damage. Based on that experience, he abandoned the idea of using non-expanding rounds on gophers. My guess is that their bodies are just too small for that type of bullet. It's like the bullet was already through the animal before it "upset". Sort of like hitting them with a knitting needle.

Having seen non-expanding bullets used on gophers, I can't recommend the practice. Use a frangible bullet designed for varmints.
 
Ricochet potential with ball is a lot higher than with light hollow or ballistic tip ammo. Is it worth the potential of a ricochet causing an injury or property damage for which you'll be held legally and civilly accountable?

Wounding potential with ball is a lot higher than with light hollow or ballistic tip ammo. Even though they are just gophers the ethical thing to do is use ammo that dispatches them quickly and cleanly.

Practice with your ball ammo at the range and use the frangible ammunition on live animals or where there are any ricochet concerns.
 
223 Ball ammo has 2 uses ,at the range and in a war, have fun with it at the range then reload the brass with any one of at least 20 different and properly suited bullets. You could pull the bullets and reload a sp 55 grain, but that is false economy just buy some winchester whitebox and call it good, and you still have 1500 range rounds left. Here is what it should look like with a proper bullet. http://www.dogbegone.com/sample.htm
 
my guess would be that a FMJ could go a long damn ways after skipping off the ground, and in a very unpredictable fashion.

Stick with Hollowpoints
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thx guys - I will just throw those frangible rounds on the old gold card :)

Ball ammo will be only for the range. Besides I really like the more dramtic effects of spontaneons gopher destruction.

I always buy 1000 at a time to get the best deal but frangibles seem to come broken out it cases of 500 and are more expensive. I think P+D had some for $280 for 500?

you guys know a good place in Edmonchuck to get these? My fear is always running out of ammo which works against me when I hit the range... " oh I have lots of ammo - keep shootin!"

That said - Which is better ? the VMax tip or a hollowpoint? a round that breaks up on impact best is probably what I would be most comfortable shooting.

thx again for your input guys - the extra cost for me to fork out for some purpose built bullets will provide a safer and more satisfying hunt.

F7
 
I've used V-Max's with good results - also Nosler Ballistic Tips. Last Sunday I tried some 50 grain Hornady SPSX's in the .223 (with a less-than-max load of BLC-2) and had very good results (lots of "air" and explosive tissue destruction on the gophers).
 
fed007 said:
you guys know a good place in Edmonchuck to get these?
F7
Click to expand...

WallyMart for WWB 45gr JHP. Little bit more expensive than FMJ, but the bullets literally explode on impact (with gopher or otherwise.) Also, for terminal "performance" a 45gr pill at ~3600f/s causes a lot of "gopher-gore":D
 
fwiw, those 45 gr. W-W JHP chrony @ 3350 fps out of my 22" m700 LVSF (1:12)
I took a few apart, and the bullets weigh 45.6 grains and powder charge is 26.0 grains (W748? - it was ball powder)

very accurate though, for the price

​
 
agilent_one said:
WallyMart for WWB 45gr JHP. Little bit more expensive than FMJ, but the bullets literally explode on impact (with gopher or otherwise.) Also, for terminal "performance" a 45gr pill at ~3600f/s causes a lot of "gopher-gore":D
Click to expand...

I will second you on this. they do a little less if not the same amount of carnage as the hornady vmax, and similarly loaded rounds.

Did you shoot them when there was still snow on the ground? If not you gotta try it next spring, Its crazy! Theres gore in a good 6-10 foot radius which shows up really well on the snow.

I remember seeing the .22-250 rounds rated at 4000 fps. I doubt they are moving that fast, but we will have to chrony them to find out.

Sounds like I have a new project.
 
powder burner said:
I remember seeing the .22-250 rounds rated at 4000 fps. I doubt they are moving that fast, but we will have to chrony them to find out.
Click to expand...

I tried the 45gr out of my Savage 22" barrel .22-250 and they broke the advertised 4000fps on my Chrony. They averaged 4010fps if I remember correctly. I was pleasently surprised.
 
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