223 reloads not chambering fully

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laurencen

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recently I picked up a pile of reloading materials and many reloaded ammo, have several hundred of various calibres but in particular 900 of 223.

as usual inspected the outsides and O/A length and all seemed well, even pulled a dozen at random to check powder charge, I have to assume his labeling was correct and load, projectile checked out so assume the powder was correct.

tried a few in the rifle and they do not chamber by just a touch, got me stumped until I measured the case length, they are 0.020 over the manual max length, I believe this is the issue.

given the quantity there is some merit to pulling the bullet, salvage powder and resize brass, what are your thoughts on removing the primer knockout pin and leaving the primer in for this process?
 
laurencen said:
recently I picked up a pile of reloading materials and many reloaded ammo, have several hundred of various calibres but in particular 900 of 223.

as usual inspected the outsides and O/A length and all seemed well, even pulled a dozen at random to check powder charge, I have to assume his labeling was correct and load, projectile checked out so assume the powder was correct.

tried a few in the rifle and they do not chamber by just a touch, got me stumped until I measured the case length, they are 0.020 over the manual max length, I believe this is the issue.

given the quantity there is some merit to pulling the bullet, salvage powder and resize brass, what are your thoughts on removing the primer knockout pin and leaving the primer in for this process?
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This ^^^
 
I'd be very highly hesitant to use anyone elses reloads. They may be perfect but if there is a bad round in there you have no real legal recourse.
The brass being .020" oversized could be the issue as that's quite a bit but it could also be the shoulder. If the brass was neck sized or partially-resized for a specific rifle, and yours has a tighter chamber, they wont fit. If it is the brass it could just be that the rifle they where loaded for had a more generous chamber that allowed for it.

Salvaging the components is an idea. I'd carefully test some loads with a chronograph to verify that the powder is what it says it is against expected velocities for that powder (as well as a visual inspection to make sure it looks identical first). Some will likely tell you to toss it but they may have more disposable income than you or I. Primers and cases are likely usable.

I'd trim an empty case and see if it chambers. If it doesn't, you indeed need to bump the shoulders back. If that's the case I would likely remove the decapping pin to keep from having to reseat all the primers.
 
If the powder loads are found to be safe, what stops the OP from lubing up the rounds and running them through the seating die (with decapper pin removed)? If the case shoulder is long by 20 thou, there should be enough room in the case to allow the shoulder to be compressed by this small amount.

Perhaps the OP can try this with a single round and see if the resize round is in spec and chambers. And
 
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Pr589 said:
If the powder loads are found to be safe, what stops the OP from lubing up the rounds and running them through the seating die (with decapod get pin removed)? If the case shoulder is long by 20 thou, there should be enough room in the case to allow the shoulder to be compressed by this small amount.

Perhaps the OP can try this with a single round and see if the resize round is in spec and chambers. And
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i believe that would resize the bullet to much if i understand what your purposing.
 
Pr589 said:
If the powder loads are found to be safe, what stops the OP from lubing up the rounds and running them through the seating die (with decapod get pin removed)? If the case shoulder is long by 20 thou, there should be enough room in the case to allow the shoulder to be compressed by this small amount.

Perhaps the OP can try this with a single round and see if the resize round is in spec and chambers. And
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bad advice, if you try and shove .020" of brass into the case you will crumple it. Not only that, but you can't run a loaded round into a sizing die, it won't fit with a bullet. The die makes the neck very small, then the expander opens it back up to seat a bullet.
 
Pr589 said:
If the powder loads are found to be safe, what stops the OP from lubing up the rounds and running them through the seating die (with decapod get pin removed)? If the case shoulder is long by 20 thou, there should be enough room in the case to allow the shoulder to be compressed by this small amount.

Perhaps the OP can try this with a single round and see if the resize round is in spec and chambers. And
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If you put a live round into a FL seating die, you pretty much have a hand grenade 12" from your face if something sets off the primer.
 
Hitzy said:
If you put a live round into a FL seating die, you pretty much have a hand grenade 12" from your face if something sets off the primer.
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not if the decapping rod is removed (which is would be) you just have a snub nose single shot. also grenade's don't generally go off on their own.
 
Spawn-Inc said:
not if the decapping rod is removed (which is would be) you just have a snub nose single shot. also grenade's don't generally go off on their own.
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What will happen is the live round will get stuck in the FL die as the bullet in the neck will jam it tighter then a ducks arse. Then Dawin will think up some way to try and get it out....
Pretty sure that post sizing live rifle rounds is covered in every reloading manual.
 
thus far I have pulled half dozen apart, did push the primer out, resized, trimmed used new primer, used said powder( the weight and handbook does check out for the powder he recorded, I have a couple pounds of his leftover powder, visually it looks the same as the containers)seated the bullet and all fired no issue, have to get a chronograph next couple days and see how it looks.

regarding the shoulder, pushing it back deforms the case, I did take powder out to try this, it seems a waste dumping primers and powder, I should add I know thid fellow well and trust his information re powder used, unfortunately he is no longer with us to ask why he did not trim the cases.
 
You can buy a Redding body die that you can use to resize loaded ammo safely. However if the casing is already .020" long you need to pull the bullets, (reclaim the powder and bullet) resize (remove the decapping pin to save the primer) trim, re-throw the powder and reseat the bullet.
 
Could be the original owner just neck sized his 1x fired brass?

I wouldn't be shooting nobody's reloads and especially that from a stranger. Pull 'em all and resize.

If you pop the primers carefully, ain't nothing wrong with reusing 'em. I've done it lots with no probs and all went bang.
 
Hitzy said:
What will happen is the live round will get stuck in the FL die as the bullet in the neck will jam it tighter then a ducks arse. Then Dawin will think up some way to try and get it out....
Pretty sure that post sizing live rifle rounds is covered in every reloading manual.
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for sure which is why i wouldn't try it because i know it won't work properly, but it's not going to blow up unless you set off the primer.
 
There's way too much downside and not enough upside to messing with this, but..............

.020" in unlikely to cause pressure problems because chambers are usually cut on the generous side in this area. Besides, pressure problems from long brass will occur long before chambering problems or there wouldn't be any pressure problems. Chamber neck dimensions can be measured if you cared to get or make the tool. Chamber casts will also work, but after you mess with all this they still aren't going to fit. You will have determined if it's the cause though. Something else you can do is pull one, FL size it and see if it chambers. If it chambers you could load it with s lighter charge and fire it. If you can stick a bullet into the fired neck then there wasn't a piching problem due to the long case. Still doesn't get them into the gun.

You can't size loaded ammo in a FL die. For reasons alresdy pointed out, it doesn't work. If you got a .223 body die and sized the loaded ammo you definitely wouldn't be the first guy who ever did it. Lots of guys doing it, I may or may not have done a few hundred myself, but I've done lots of dumb things. Redding doesn't advise it for what that's worth. This is a case of not enough pay-off for way to much consequence. Slim odds times 900 equals fatter odds, and in the meantime with the bullet pointing somewhere near your head and the primer pointing somewhere near your nuts you might develope a flinch. Not worth it. As an aside, if you did decide to size loaded ammo lube the #### out of them, because a stuck loaded case is also an interesting exercise in risk/ benefit analysis.

Best course of action is to pull it all down , resize and trim the brass (in that order). There is no reason to not take out the decapping pin to save the primers, and there is a risk involved in decapping live primers even if the chances of setting one off are slim. Remember slim chance x 900 x PAYP = not a great idea.


*PAYP= pointed at your pecker.

If you do go with taking the pin out make sure you lube heavily unless you want to want to stick a case and decide whether drilling a live primer is good idea.
 
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The issue is most likely too long headspace on the cases and not the untrimmed neck length. Typically a chamber has quite a lot of wiggle room to allow for extra neck length before it will cause any issues. Also the neck would have to be grossly over length in order for it to cause chambering problems.

If you can get he boot to close without too much effort then it is safe to fire those loaded rounds. If the boot won't close or takes excessive effort to close then your only choice is to pull bullets and resize the brass. There is no reason the original primers can't be resused.
 
Suputin said:
The issue is most likely too long headspace on the cases and not the untrimmed neck length. Typically a chamber has quite a lot of wiggle room to allow for extra neck length before it will cause any issues. Also the neck would have to be grossly over length in order for it to cause chambering problems.

If you can get he boot to close without too much effort then it is safe to fire those loaded rounds. If the boot won't close or takes excessive effort to close then your only choice is to pull bullets and resize the brass. There is no reason the original primers can't be resused.
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its for a AR15, it holds the bolt off just enough to not lock up, if I try the round in a plain barrel it will not seat inside, as I said I pulled a few bullets, emptied powder it still will not seat, resize and trim it seats fine, just got 850 more to do, looks like I can leave primers in place to do this job

thanks for the feedback
 
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