240 weatherby vs 25-06 rem

All with a 25'06(100gr.)

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bearkilr said:
Who gives a sh*t about Berger? We're talking hunting here.

The 257 Wby wins hands down. The 25/06 is anemic in comparison and the 240 is a nearly obsolete caliber for the girly men who can't handle the 257. :D
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Ill go with my coyote rifle the 240wby mag... 55g pill @ 4070' is far from obsolete.I hunt big game with my 300 wby mag deluxe....no muzzle break :)
 
JJ-65 said:
[QUOTE) The 25 outruns the 240 in energy, trajectory, accuracy, and bullet selection.

Laugh2 There is a reason the 25 cals are never see in serious competition, hint: it's not a lack of accuracy that excludes them.
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Okay, how many 240 Wbys are shot in serious competition, or in any competition? The 240 and the 25-06 are the subject of this thread.

Man, wake up! ;)

Ted
 
Why not? said:
Okay, how many 240 Wbys are shot in serious competition, or in any competition? The 240 and the 25-06 are the subject of this thread.

Man, wake up! ;)

Ted
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Your absalutely right, the OP asked about the 240 wby and the 25-06. Both are great cartridges, low recoil, very accurate, flat shooting, versatile (varmit/big game), lots of factory ammo, etc.

I heard that Weatherby is coming out this year with the Vanguard chambered in the 240 weatherby. It will cost less for the vanguard than the Mark V. All OP's should look into it. It's the fastest .244 on the market.:cheers:
 
Yoteboy said:
Who cares about the 257 wby. The original question was/is about the .240 WBY vs the .25-06. The .257 has nothing to do with any of this. Why don't you just completely hijack it and start comparing .338 Lapua to a .22-250.
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Weatherby cartridges have specific characteristics which separates them from, standard cartridges. Therefore if you are comparing a 6mm to a .257, the .257 Weatherby belongs in the discussion since the 6mm that interests the OP is also a Weatherby cartridge. Had he wanted a comparison between a 6mm-284 or a 6mm-06 vs .25/06, neither Weatherby might have been mentioned.

IMHO, the 6mms are at their best on game up to 100 pounds, like those nice speed goats pictured. Can larger game be taken with them? Sure, but it wouldn't be my first choice. I would prefer a .25/06 IMHO once game weight exceeded 100 pounds.
 
Boomer said:
Weatherby cartridges have specific characteristics which separates them from, standard cartridges. Therefore if you are comparing a 6mm to a .257, the .257 Weatherby belongs in the discussion since the 6mm that interests the OP is also a Weatherby cartridge. Had he wanted a comparison between a 6mm-284 or a 6mm-06 vs .25/06, neither Weatherby might have been mentioned.
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Another ,for some, important side note is that 257 Wby brass can be formed from 7mm Rem Mag, 264 WinMag, and the like. 240 Wby brass can't be formed from any other case. I also quite often see 257 ammunition for pretty cheap, sometimes less than brass alone. Also, Hornady now loads for the 257. Just a few more things to consider.

Yoteboy said:
Who cares about the 257 wby. The original question was/is about the .240 WBY vs the .25-06. The .257 has nothing to do with any of this. Why don't you just completely hijack it and start comparing .338 Lapua to a .22-250.
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I mention the 257 as it's the one that should be compared to the 25/06, not the 240 Wby. Compare the 240 to the 243 Win,6mm/06 or 6mm Rem.
 
I owned a 25-06 once. It underwhelms me, not sure why i can`t warm up to it but i`d not get another. As for the 240 wby, never had one but wouldn`t mind playing with one for a few awhile. Barrel life has got to be an issue. Just my 2 pennies worth.
 
Why not? said:
Okay, how many 240 Wbys are shot in serious competition, or in any competition? The 240 and the 25-06 are the subject of this thread.

Man, wake up! ;)

Ted
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Even the lowley .243 win flinging a high bc bullet outclasses any .25 cal bullet out there at distance, never mind the .240 Weatherby.

Try it some time and get back to me. It will be a wake up call 4 U.:rolleyes:
 
Two articles from Chuck Hawks.

The .240 Weatherby Magnum

By Chuck Hawks

The .240 Weatherby Magnum was introduced in 1968, and it was the last Weatherby caliber introduced while Roy Weatherby was alive. The .240 Weatherby case is unique. It is a standard length and diameter cartridge with a .473" rim diameter, the same as a 30-06, and it will work through any standard length action. Like all Weatherby cartridges, it is a belted case with a double radius shoulder. It is a very cute magnum cartridge, with a powder capacity much like that of the 6mm-06 or 6mm-284 wildcats. Norma manufactures Weatherby brand ammunition. The .240 has a SAAMI maximum average pressure of 53,500 cup.

The .240 Weatherby is the highest velocity commercially produced 6mm cartridge. It will drive a 100 grain bullet about 150 fps faster than the 6mm Remington or .243 WSSM from a 26" barrel, less from a 24" barrel. Of course, if the 6mm is measured in a 24" barrel and the .240 in a 26" barrel, which is the case with factory load ballistics, the difference goes up to about 300 fps.

.240 Weatherby factory ammunition is offered only by Weatherby. Bullet weights of 87, 90, 95, and 100 grains are currently offered. The .240 case is unique and cannot be formed from any other existing case, which has somewhat limited the cartridge's popularity with reloaders.

Current Weatherby figures claim a muzzle velocity of 3406 fps for a 100 grain spitzer bullet from a 26" test barrel. At 100 yards the velocity is given as 3136 fps and the energy as 2183 ft. lbs. And at 400 yards the velocity is still 2415 fps and the remaining energy an impressive 1294 ft. lbs.

The trajectory of that load (using a Nosler Partition bullet) is as follows: +2.8" at 100 yards, +3.5" at 200 yards, 0 at 300 yards, and -8.4" at 400 yards. That will do for deer to about 350 yards, and qualifies the .240 Weatherby as a true ultra-long range rifle.

Handloaders have a huge selection of bullets from which to choose, since the .240 Weatherby uses regular 6mm bullets. Bullet weights range from 55-115 grains. But the most popular bullets are those weighing from 70 to 105 grains.

For hunting weight bullets, slow burning rifle powders are most efficient in the .240 Mag. H4831, H450, IMR 4831, AA 3100, W760, and RL-22 are reasonable choices.

Here are some specifications of interest to .240 reloaders: bullet diameter .243", maximum COL 3.10", maximum case length 2.50", MAP 53,500 cup.

I took the following two loads from the Speer Reloading Manual No. 13. The good folks at Speer chronographed their loads in a Weatherby Mark V hunting rifle with a 24" barrel, using Weatherby brass and CCI 250 primers.

With the Speer 80 grain varmint bullet in front of 50.0 grains of IMR 4831 powder the MV was 3327 fps. In front of 54.0 grains of IMR 4831 the velocity rose to 3583 fps.

Using a 100-105 grain Speer bullet and 45.0 grains of W760 powder the MV was 2922 fps. A maximum charge of 49.0 grains of W760 gave the same bullets a MV of 3206 fps.

The fifth edition of the Nosler Reloading Guide shows that with their 95-100 grain bullets 49.0 grains of RL-22 powder achieves a MV of 3082 fps. A maximum load of 53.0 grains of RL-22 can drive the same bullets to a MV of 3352 fps. Weatherby cases and Federal 210M primers were used in these loads, which were chronographed in a 24" Weatherby barrel.

I own a lovely .240 Weatherby Mark V Deluxe rifle with a 26" barrel. I load the 100 grain Sierra GameKing SBT bullet in front of 50.0 grains of RL-22 powder for a MV of approximately 3,150 fps, using CCI 250 primers and Weatherby cases. In my rifle, this load has proven to be safe, accurate and adequately flat shooting, without excessive barrel wear.
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Why the .25-06 Remington?

By Glenn Harmaning

Why choose the .25-06 Remington? It doesn't seem to get much press these days because every possible bit of print and ink seem to be going to sing the praises of the Winchester Short Magnums or an ultra "something or other." The Winchester .25 Super Short Magnum was supposed to duplicate the .25-06, but only Browning now makes a rifle for it. In contrast, all of the major gun manufacturers offer .25-06 rifles. For example, when Kimber introduced their new long action Model 8400, the standard cartridges they chose to offer it in are .25-06 Remington, .270 Winchester, and .30-06 Springfield.

I never did understand the reasoning behind the .25 WSSM when we already have a proven cartridge in the .25-06 that is made even more versatile by recent advances in bullets and powder. (The whole WSM/WSSM line merely duplicates existing, better balanced cartridges. -Ed.) The major American and foreign ammunition makers produce a total of 17 different loads in .25-06.

The .25-06 is one of the classic commercialized wildcats that has stood the test of time. So it must have something going for it. I want to share some of the benefits of this effective and highly useful cartridge. Chuck Hawks has written a couple of good, objective articles on the .25-06 as well as a comparison with the 270 Winchester. Make sure to check those out (on the Rifle Cartridge Page) as well.

The .25-06 was designed as a "dual-purpose" cartridge and is suitable for all CXP1and CXP2 game, which account for the vast majority of all game hunted in the United States. As the term implies, one rifle/cartridge combination designed to cover a variety of hunting and shooting situations.

To say that a cartridge is "suitable" for a specific game species means that it will humanely take the indicated game under the conditions in which the species is reasonably hunted. The .25-06 is suitable for all CXP2 game. From the woods to the canyons, from the mountains to the plains, the .25-06 will take deer, sheep, goats, caribou, and antelope wherever they may be found. Realistically, what more does a hunter need?

The .25-06 has been around long enough to benefit from the newest premium bullet designs such as the Barnes-X, Swift A-frame, Nosler Partition, Remington Core-Lokt Ultra Bonded, and Woodleigh Weldcore. With these bullets, the .25-06 moves into the CXP3 game category, becoming adequate for hunting elk, zebra, and other large animals.

Premium bullets enable the .25 to take any game for which the 130 grain 270 Winchester load is suitable. Jack O'Connor, the Dean of American gun writers, felt that the .270 130 grain was perfectly adequate for elk, and he killed a slew of them with that load.

The late Bob Milek, a well-respected editor, was a fan of the .25 and killed many elk with it while he and his family lived in Wyoming. At the time of his writings the Nosler Partition was the only premium bullet available to the majority of shooters. The first elk I ever killed (a big cow) was with the 117grain Nosler partition. It hit the point of the shoulder at 125 yards; the animal stumbled, fell, and never got up.

Another instance was in the 1973, also in Idaho, when hunting with a neighbor family in the Salmon River country. There were four of us hunting some timber and breaks on one side of a wooded canyon that I estimated to be about 1/4 mile across. At the break of dawn, the father took his 14 year old son, who was on his second hunting trip, to the other side of the canyon to see if the herd we had seen the previous day had moved into that area. The older brother and I went off by ourselves to hunt for elk in some dark timber bordering the area they were hunting. The 14 year old hunter was well versed in rifle shooting by his dad and was shooting a Ruger 10/22 before he could ride a bike. He was carrying a Remington 700 BDL in .25-06 loaded with 120 grain Remington Core-Lokt factory loads. His dad had shot an elk the two days before and today was the last day of the season. We had agreed that if the opportunity presented itself the son could shoot his elk and one other animal for his family. (This was legal in Idaho in those days.)

I had not seen an elk close enough to shoot thus far. His older sibling and I had been stalking through deadfall surrounded by tall pine trees for less than 30 minutes when shots broke the high mountain stillness. They were irregularly spaced, the first shot, then a few seconds later then two more shots. They had come from the area where the dad and his son were hunting.

We abandoned our hunt and hiked out of the timber along the side of the canyon until we could make contact with the Dad and his teenage son. Arriving at the scene, we found two dead elk, a two point and a cow. Three shots from the .25-06 and two dead elk.

The father and his son had come upon 7 elk in a small basin not over 300 yards from our camp. (I wish the older bro' and myself had gone with them that morning!) The 14 year old had shot the cow, which had dropped practically where she stood. The young bull had seen it happen and milled around nervously, giving the young hunter time to shoot once and then again to anchor him very near to the dead cow. By the time we arrived on the scene the rest of the herd was long gone. Since that day, I had no doubts that a .25-06 with a heavier bullet was an "adequate" elk cartridge! I bought my first .25-06 after that hunt, a Ruger M77.

The worst that can be said about the .25-06 is that it realistically needs a 24" barrel to reach its full potential. I've had 22" barreled .25-06 rifles and the muzzle blast was pretty severe, but it still outperformed a 257 Roberts +P.

The slower powders provide optimum ballistics in the .25-06. I still use H4831, the original powder that brought the .25-06 into its own. I have tried virtually all bullet weights in the .25-06. I have settled on four bullets and loads to take maximum advantage of the cartridge's excellent versatility.

The first is my predator/varmint load. This is the 87-grain Hornady Spire point pushed at 3512 fps behind 59.0 grains of H4831. This is the bullet that my Weatherby Mark V shoots the best for explosive power on varmints and predators.

The next load uses a pelt saving for coyotes in prime fur season. It is a Barnes solid 90 grain loaded to 3000 fps with 48 grains of IMR 4350. It is an accurate load that hits hard, but usually doesn't tumble even on bone and pokes little 1/4" holes in the hide that are easy to fix.

As an aside, I should note that this is the only 90 grain load that I use. I'm sure that 90-100 grain bullets are sufficient for most any CXP2 game, since a maximum 100 grain load in the .25-06 essentially duplicates the .240 Weatherby Magnum, a potent deer cartridge in its own right. I have just thought that if I were going to shoot 90-100 grain bullets, I would be better off with a 6mm Remington, 243 Winchester, or .240 Weatherby.

The .25-06 with 115-120 grain bullets put it into an entirely different category. In fact, a Remington ammunition survey done some years ago showed the 120 grain Core-Lokt load was the best selling of the three .25-06 loads they make. This is where the .25-06 treads close on the heels of the 130 grain bullet in the .270 Winchester.

My next around load, the one that I shoot the most, is the 117 grain Sierra Pro-hunter bullet at a MV of 3094 fps with 53.5 grains of H4831. It has been an instant killer on every deer I've shot or seen shot with it. Some may think the bullet is a bit too fragile, but deer are thin-sided animals even for quartering shots; penetration is more than sufficient. All the energy of this bullet is expended in the animal. I've never needed to track any deer shot with this load.

My last load is used when I need to raise my 25.06 into the CXP3 category and hunt elk-sized animals. I know the capabilities of the Nosler Partitions. The 115-grain partition or its 120 grain big brother would be an excellent choice if you need deep penetration on large animals. However, my choice for the best bone-breaking and deep penetrating bullet is the 115-grain Barnes-X at 3100 fps with 55 grains of RL-22. This bullet will not break up and gets to the vitals from any angle on an elk. Don't take my word for it. Try them on your next hunt. The X-bullet is one lethal projectile. And, if you play with the seating depth and keep your bore clean, Barnes X-Bullets will be as accurate as any other bullet you can shoot.

The number one factor in killing any animal is bullet placement. Even before today's premium bullets and loads, the .25-06 had cleanly taken elk. With bullets like the Barnes Triple Shock, the traditional Nosler Partition, and Swift A-Frame, there is no reason whatsoever a good .25-06 rifle should stay at home during elk season. Take it, use it, and bring home an elk!

Recoil in rifles of equal weight is 5 ft. lbs. less than the .270 Winchester shooting a 130 grain bullet. In a 6.75 pound rifle, the .25-06 recoils like a .270 in an 8 pound rifle. This means that you can have a light mountain/stalking rifle in .25-06 that will be within the recoil tolerance of the average shooter. The .270 creates a wider wound channel and has more energy, but we've already established that the .25-06 is an adequate caliber for elk. So, why have more of what you don't need? Instead, why not shoot a rifle with which it is easier to secure good bullet placement?

There are so many cartridge choices for shooters today that it sometimes seems that the latest trend-setting rounds must somehow provide new levels of lethality. Objectively, of course, that is silly. The .25-06 was a fine cartridge at its inception. It was made perfect with the arrival of the slow burning powders, and since its SAAMI standardization in 1969, it has not left the shooting scene. It truly can fit each CXP1 through CXP3 game need in a way that very few, if any, other cartridges can equal. Try a .25-06. You won't be disappointed!
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JJ-65 said:
Even the lowley .243 win flinging a high bc bullet outclasses any .25 cal bullet out there at distance, never mind the .240 Weatherby.

Try it some time and get back to me. It will be a wake up call 4 U.:rolleyes:
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You are absolutely right. It's not about cartridges or even muzzle velocity guys, long range is all about bullets. Unfortunately many (most) 6mm's aren't twisted fast enough to take advantage of VLD type bullets. Edited to add: to be fair most 25s aren't either. In either bore a 10 twist isn't fast enough.

10 years ago this wasn't the case, but today for true long range shooting, the 6mm's have it all over the 25's when it comes to drop and drift.

Yesterday I was shooting with a buddy at gongs in excess of 600 yards. I was shooting a 25 cal 90 grain Blitzking at 3400 fps, that is a very pointy 25 cal bullet with a BC right at .4. My partner a 243 with a 105 VLD slightly under 3000 fps. Both zeroed at 200 yards for coyotes, his rifle shot as flat as mine at those distances. Look at those numbers again and think about it...

I love my present 25-284, but when the barrel gets burned up it will be rebarreled as an 8 or 9 twist 243AI.
 
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thanks gents for bringing the thread back to the topic, to the previous fellas 257 weatherby is not an option, I respect the gun for it's capabilities as a couple of my friends have them, but I just don't want one. I'm the guy who uses a 204 to out shoot my buds with 22-250s.they went and got 7mm mags I tracked down an old school 8x57 mauser hand loaded it to proper specs and happily out shoot them.(I practice way more than my friends and usually do better but not always. lol)
 
I've also felt that the .24's are a little too big on coyotes (if you are saving the furs), and the bullet weight a little light for deer. It's kind of specialized. I would think it'd be a good size for pronghorns or 500 yard coyotes.

.25 caliber bullets are getting closer to what is ideal for deer.

I'd say ideally .204 or .224 for coyotes, and .264 and up for deer. The in between sizes are not my personal best choices.
 
According to this page the 25-06 has slightly more case capacity, measured in grains of water.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/rifle_case_capacity.htm

.240 Weatherby (Wby.): 63.1 grains
.25-06 Remington (W-W): 65.0 grains
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The .240 Weatherby would be very similar in performance to the 6mm/06 wildcat.

You could always neck an 8mm Mauser case down to .243 caliber ;)
8x57JS Mauser (W-W): 62.7 grains
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Myself, of the two I would take the 240WBY. as we are talking long range rifles lets take the ballistics at at least 300yds with 100gn bullets :

240WBY=2642fps -1550ftlb
25-06 =2287fps -1161ftlp

That kind of says it all for me right there. But then nothing about the 25-06 really appeals to me, thus I don't have much experience with it. There may be other factors you have to consider like what rifle you are buying and what it's available in, and availability of ammo. But cartridge to cartridge, it's an easy choice for me.

That said I feel both rounds are underachieving little cousins to better rounds. If it's an 06 cartridge you want I do believe the 270Win is superior and is even more readily available in both rifle selection and ammo availability. And as for the WBY, well the 257 bee is amazing and out classes all the above IMHO:

257WBY 100gn @300yds= 2750fps - 1680ftlb
257WBY 120gn = 2570fps - 1760ftlb
270Win 100gn = 2225fps - 1099ftlb
270Win 130gn = 2388fps - 1646ftlb

but that's getting back off topic
 
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Mauser8 said:
thanks gents for bringing the thread back to the topic, to the previous fellas 257 weatherby is not an option, I respect the gun for it's capabilities as a couple of my friends have them, but I just don't want one. I'm the guy who uses a 204 to out shoot my buds with 22-250s.they went and got 7mm mags I tracked down an old school 8x57 mauser hand loaded it to proper specs and happily out shoot them.(I practice way more than my friends and usually do better but not always. lol)
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This most unfortunate that you arbitrarily rule out the 257 Wby, you are missing out on one of the best small bore long range killing cartridges ever developed.
Of your 2 options the 25-06 would have the edge definately as a big game cartridge, as Why Not? said.
To those detractors of Why Not ?'s (Ted's) opinion, I have this to say, he has hunted and harvested more game with more calibers than most of you. He has guided professionally here in the Yukon for many years and seen countless more head of game harvested with countless more calibers. His opinions do not come from articles or charts but from actually going out there and taking game in his 60 years experience in hunting.

Next we're going to hear about some girl shooting an elk at 7 or 800 yds with a 243.............AGAIN. What they don't show is how many did she wound before they got that 1 shot kill on film?
 
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