30-06 for Buffalo...Enough Gun or Not, and Other Questions.

Dogleg said:
100 yards with my M70 Alaskan, with Davie's load and Boomer's bullets. MOB for sure. The terminal performance with the H&H is fairly well documented, but KR still wants a report.


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Well you might just squeak by with those patterns, keep the 458 handy though just in case you get another of those fliers..............:)
 
Sometimes its maddening just how easy it is to get the big guns shooting, especially seeing as they tend to be used at very close ranges where the mechanical precision means SFA. Function and terminal performance are the only game in town.
 
c-fbmi said:
Hey DL, have you tried them Rhino bullets on paper? Will the standard 375 H&H twist rifling stabilize them? That's certainly heading into the extreme in 375 bullet weights, curious how far they would stay stabile, and what their terminal performance would be, being so close the envelope edge for stability, which my calculations say they must be.
I have always wondered how stability plays into terminal performance on heavy game and penetration, and how it works in conjunction with bullet construction and configuration. Bullet construction has been debated ad infinitum but bullet stability upon impact and through out it's penetration travel is a lot more theoretical and of great interest to me. Looking forward to your testing and reports.
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They're shorter than the 350gr Barnes (to my understanding), and likely not much different in OAL to the 300gr TSX simply due to the TSX's long nose and lighter copper composition. I imagine they'll fly pretty well and track true, the .375 has a relatively quick twist really at 1-12" as well, comparable to a .308 but a significantly larger bore.
 
I have seen 2 wood bison taken. The first was a 6 year old bull. He was hit in the boiler room with a 300 win 180 grain bullet, did not flinch, nothing... He stood there eyeing us up for 10 or so seconds, turned and started quartering away, he was hit in the heart/lungs again and same effect. Walked about 25 more yards and started to wobble, then fell over. I was amazed how it could soak up that much lead with no showing a hit. Bull was right around 100 yards.

My bull was a 2 year old. Probably about 50 yards with a 338-06 with 210 grain partitions. At the shot I thought I missed, trying to see what buff to put another round in and happened to see a brown spot in the snow. He had fallen and was nearly covered up in the snow.

I would say 30-06 is acceptable, but if you are somewhat recoil shy I would reccomend 338-06, 35 whelen, something along those lines...no matter what you choose for a rifle I would stay with a premium bullet: nosler partition, barnes, swift a frame, etc. Not the place for light frangible bullets like ballistic tips, bergers, etc.

We did some research after the hunt and they go into a semi hibernation during winter, so the heart and breathing rate is very slow, thus very hard to put down. If not hit just right.
 
BigBraz15 said:
I have seen 2 wood bison taken. The first was a 6 year old bull. He was hit in the boiler room with a 300 win 180 grain bullet, did not flinch, nothing... He stood there eyeing us up for 10 or so seconds, turned and started quartering away, he was hit in the heart/lungs again and same effect. Walked about 25 more yards and started to wobble, then fell over. I was amazed how it could soak up that much lead with no showing a hit. Bull was right around 100 yards.

My bull was a 2 year old. Probably about 50 yards with a 338-06 with 210 grain partitions. At the shot I thought I missed, trying to see what buff to put another round in and happened to see a brown spot in the snow. He had fallen and was nearly covered up in the snow.

I would say 30-06 is acceptable, but if you are somewhat recoil shy I would reccomend 338-06, 35 whelen, something along those lines...no matter what you choose for a rifle I would stay with a premium bullet: nosler partition, barnes, swift a frame, etc. Not the place for light frangible bullets like ballistic tips, bergers, etc.

We did some research after the hunt and they go into a semi hibernation during winter, so the heart and breathing rate is very slow, thus very hard to put down. If not hit just right.
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i dont know about hibernation semi or not but our bisons are climbing above the dall sheep and they move fast ...
 
BigBraz15 said:
I have seen 2 wood bison taken. The first was a 6 year old bull. He was hit in the boiler room with a 300 win 180 grain bullet, did not flinch, nothing... He stood there eyeing us up for 10 or so seconds, turned and started quartering away, he was hit in the heart/lungs again and same effect. Walked about 25 more yards and started to wobble, then fell over. I was amazed how it could soak up that much lead with no showing a hit. Bull was right around 100 yards.

My bull was a 2 year old. Probably about 50 yards with a 338-06 with 210 grain partitions. At the shot I thought I missed, trying to see what buff to put another round in and happened to see a brown spot in the snow. He had fallen and was nearly covered up in the snow.

I would say 30-06 is acceptable, but if you are somewhat recoil shy I would reccomend 338-06, 35 whelen, something along those lines...no matter what you choose for a rifle I would stay with a premium bullet: nosler partition, barnes, swift a frame, etc. Not the place for light frangible bullets like ballistic tips, bergers, etc.

We did some research after the hunt and they go into a semi hibernation during winter, so the heart and breathing rate is very slow, thus very hard to put down. If not hit just right.
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Good to hear more actual experience with them, they can be unbelievably tough. If you can handle more than .30-06, there's every reason to, if not, no shame in making a good call and sticking with the tried and true smaller rifle you know. A fellow's likely better off with a good .30-06 load and a rifle he knows as well, than a brand new .375 he doesn't know, or worse yet, is afraid of. The advice for shooting more gun on Bison fits only for those accustomed to it. This all said, if you can, can afford the gun, and the time and practice, by all means do so.

Here's an experience on following up the 7mm Mag wounded bull.

http://www.morrisonarms.com/2013/11/the-right-tool-for-an-unfortunate-job-a-double-rifle-a-wood-bison-bull/
 
The Outsider said:
Hardly,

the great Bison slaughter was during the 1870's, the 30-30 wasn't introduced until 1895.

The buffalo were mostly killed with large slow moving 40-50 cal, 330 - 500 grain bullets.

Rifles used were single shot Sharps model 1869's and 1874's, and Remington rolling blocks.

(just a little history lesson)
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I do believe that it were the black powder Sharps 45/70, 50/70 and the Hawken 54 that killed the buff on the great plains. Indians called the Sharps, "shoot today kill tomorrow gun". By the time the 45/110 and 45/120 were produced the buff were pretty much gone.
 
c-fbmi said:
There is another aspect of bison hunting I'd like to fill you in on............the fun is over after the loud bang........they are about as much fun to deal with, on the ground as an elephant!!!! Maybe I'm just getting old.............
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This no bullsh#t at all. Skinning them, especially for a shoulder mount, eats it, big time.
 
Been there, done that, stuffing my hands into a buffalo mid winter just to gain the feeling back while yanking and cutting at the leaden tarp they call a hide. Best part is dragging 200lb quarters through deep snow, a single quarter (we actually cut to fifths to get technical), weighs as much or more than your average deer. Good friend is dead set to go out just west of Wood Buffalo and hunt again this winter- I suspect he will decide once is enough. But hey, you can put a Pleistocene creature in your cap, and it's worth the effort, few in the world get to experience that.
 
Oh yes. Ardent reminded me of all the work... The big guy we ended up cutting into 7 pieces of meat, and it was all 2 guys could do to move them. Also the hide and head will be 10 times heavier than you ever thought. It took 4 of us to get the head and hide loaded. The smaller one was not nearly as bad, but still the size of a good moose or elk. Lots harder to handle with the big hump on the back. We cut and wrapped the meat ourselves... Not ever going to do that much meat again!
 
Hell, it was +18 when I shot mine and it was still bollocks. 10 hours to get the damn thing into man-portable chunks and loaded into the truck. As we backed the damn truck right up to the carcass!

My poor poor little half-ton. Buff in the back and a highboy with two ATVs behind. Felt like I was driving a locomotive with shopping cart wheels. Not much contact patch on the front end!

My taxidermist had to trim the cape in order to get it under the 100lb limit to ship it to the tannery.
 
One thing to keep in mind. We caped the big one out, then on the smaller one we just split up the front right to the jawm with all of the long hair on a wood bison it is really easy for the taxidermist to sew it up. Made our lives a lot easier.

I know a few guys that guide up by wood buffalo national park and they are quite successful. One of them uses a 270 win with 150 grain bullets and has no problems. I know others that want all they can get. Just depends on your comfort level.

The guy I trap with guides for wolves and his minimum caliber is 270.
 
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