30-30 Crimp issue - Hornady Dies

[sulisa]

Good morning,

I've been reloading for years, using Lee dies. My 30-30 is my first calibre with Hornady Dies. Every once in a while, I get a buckling of the case mouth, with the bullet seater. I am attempting a light crimp. Most (let's say 75%) of the cases come out just fine.

The buckled case still chambers, but it's an annoyance, and doubtless will decrease the life of the brass.

Could something be hanging up inside the die? IF it was mis-adjusted, I would expect all cases to come out the same (the mark of a good-quality die).

This is the seating die with the ridiculously long threaded rod.

Here's a pic of an affected case:

 

[bcsteve]

Did you trim your brass first so they're all equal length?

 

[Evanguy]

Are your cases all trimmed the same length?

 

[Windknot]

Try a Lee Factory Crimp die instead. Not sensitive to case length either, and cheap to buy.

I’m not a huge fan of Hornady rifle dies.

 

[Potashminer]

My first guess is unequal length of cases - as mentioned in above posts - even "new from the bag" sometimes need trimming.

If you are used to Lee dies, then Hornady and RCBS set up differently - you likely want thickness of Loonie or similar space with shell holder all the way up and clearance to bottom of the seating die - or else it will finish seating and also crimp at same time - some people like that - I prefer to seat to depth in one step, then re-adjust the die body and do the crimping in a second, separate step. But, with few exceptions, I think all the "in the seating die" crimp set-ups, all presume that all the brass is nearly perfectly identical length - and "new from bag" are usually not.

 

[sulisa]

Great replies folks, thanks. Yes, all trimmed with the Lee case trimmer (manual style) - I could absolutely picture a longer case neck getting jammed up like that.

I have a Lee crimp die for my 308 - it would be a pity to have to take it out of adjustment to go between 308 and 30-30, but I might just give that a try, and pull the Hornady die up, to avoid crimping.

Spent twice at much for a Hornady die, because it was "there", and they even suspended the free bullets offer... no shell holder either, so I don't see any monetary or quality value in this die set, over the Lee. And as Potashminer says, "If you're used to Lee dies..."... The only cool thing about this seating die is that inner piece that helps guide-up the bullet - handy if the bullet doesn't stay-put on the case, like a boattail.

 

[Potashminer]

I am not sure which Lee case trimmer that you are using - I use the one with the case length gauge that works with the spinner on an electric drill - what I found going through a bag of "new" brass - many do not get touched. Some get slightly peeled part way around the case mouth. Some actually get shortened. Is not all "to the same length" - means all are at or less than that case gauge length - I do not normally crimp centerfire bullets - but I think the cases need to all be "same" to each other, not just at or below a particular length.

 

[fingers284]

My 30-30 Hornady dies are the same, they dont have the "roll crimp" initiator at the case mouth end so an over length case just butts up against the end of the die chamber and gets crunched instead of folding in the way all my RCBS seating dies do.

 

[bigedp51]

Seat the bullet and then crimp, if you seat and crimp in the same operation the case mouth can bulge like your photo.

This means the case mouth will bulge because the bullet is pressing down on the crimped case neck.

 

[lyman54]

I use a separate roll crimp for lead cast 45 Colt cartridge and a taper crimp if using a 45 ACP bullet copper plated with no grease grooves in the revolver. I would buy a separate Lee crimp die to eliminate the problem. Brass isn't getting any cheaper. I like the taper crimp myself.

 

[9.3mauser]

Are your cases all trimmed the same length?

this^

Try a Lee Factory Crimp die instead. Not sensitive to case length either, and cheap to buy.

I’m not a huge fan of Hornady rifle dies.

... and this^

I have a Lee crimp die for my 308 - it would be a pity to have to take it out of adjustment to go between 308 and 30-30, but I might just give that a try, and pull the Hornady die up, to avoid crimping.

^ You won't have to worry about it because Lee crimp dies are cartridge specific. Your .308 die won't work with a .30-30.

 

[Potashminer]

I wondered about the cartridge interchangeability thing - I could not get one for 9.3x57, so instead bought one for 9.3x62 and intend to cut off on bottom - once I figure out the dimensions to work. Was my thinking to be able to use shims or blocking on the shell holder, to make the conversion back to use on 9.3x62 - but pretty much hostage to case diameter and perhaps neck length, I think?

 

[DBeato]

Seat the bullet and then crimp, if you seat and crimp in the same operation the case mouth can bulge like your photo.

This means the case mouth will bulge because the bullet is pressing down on the crimped case neck.

this was my solution.

 

[sulisa]

Such a great wealth of knowledge in this group, hundreds of years of combined experience

I do have the drill-mounted Lee trimmer for some calibres, but I also find they don't cut consistently. For a small batch of trimming, like this, I use the Lee trimmer and lock stud, with the 30-30 parts. Harder on the hands (I do it all by hand), but very consistent.

I'm going to back-off the Hdy crimp, and find a Lee crimp. Eventually, I think I'll ditch the Hdy set completely, as a "live and learn".

 

[Potashminer]

Looking on the reloading die shelf here - is multiple - so Lee Pace Setter, Lee Ultimate, Lee "Reloading Dies", many green RCBS, yellow-ish Lyman, orange-ish Lyman, Bonanza "Bench Rest", Hornady "custom grade" - I find is enough difference, I have to re-read the pamphlet instructions each time to set up - is not a big deal - but I am not aware of any of them that can not do a "good enough job" of reloading cartridges for me. And all get used on the same RCBS RockChucker press - so each die gets re-set up each time I load that cartridge - some think is an advantage of "turrets" - I do not - I prefer to know how to set up those dies - each time.

I can not say that I have trouble to get trim to same with the drill trimmer - mostly why I replaced from the hand crank lathe types that I got so cranky trying to re-set to precise length last time - after 4 or 6 cartridges in between - not sure it really mattered - but the "re-setting" amount of fussing bugged me - why I went to the case gauge length things - is nothing different since last time.

 

[shoot_to_kill]

I used to use the hornady dies for 3030. I would seat my bullets in a separate step. To setup the seating die to crimp i would back the seating stem way out ir remive it if i recall. I think it is just the tapered shoulder in the die that rolls the case mouth inwards. I would put a bullet in the press. Move handle down and leave it there holding bullet at the top. I would then screw down the seating die until the shoulder made contact with case mouth.
At this point you can just test in 1/4 turns until the crimp looks like you want it.
When youre running the cases youll get a feel for it and if one offers up more resistance, set it aside and adjust dies like above for it later on.
Hope this helps. Its been about 6 years since i loaded 3030

 

[Garand]

x2 on a separate lee crimp die! Always seat and crimp separately, better quality ammunition.


90822 Factory Crimp Die 30/30 $19.50 w ww.rustywood.ca

 

[emerson]

Try a Lee Factory Crimp die instead. Not sensitive to case length either, and cheap to buy.

I’m not a huge fan of Hornady rifle dies.

This. I use Lee Factory Crimp dies. Work well.