- Location
- Calgary, AB
I love the ###y venturi shoulder, so my vote goes to the Weatherby. And I prefer my magnums to have belts 
300 Rum or 300 Wby
- Thread starter thumper1
- Start date
Oh now you've done it! There is a decided "cave man no need brake" culture here that are sure to let you know they're here they're queer.........
Believe me I've taken ehough crap from them for both of us!
Whether or not you choose to use a brake depends on whether you prefer to wear hearing protection while hunting,or to put up with more recoil.I tried a brake on the 300WBY,but it came off when I found that I needed double hearing protection to shoot it comfortably.If you can't deal with the recoil,and are prepared to hunt with hearing protection,a brake may be your only way to accurately shoot the big magnums.
My 300 RUM is basically a LR paper puncher (I wanted to see what I could do with heavy 30 cal bullets from 700 meters on out). I have other rifles for hunting, including ones that kick much, much harder then the RUM (ask anyone who has shared the range with my toys and myself). The brake makes it easier to shoot and see what I am doing, and I wear electric muffs while I'm shooting it. Out of the numerous rifles I own (and there are a few of them), the only other one that has a brake came with it, and that's a BLR in 358 Win (weird, but it was there when I bought it). That doesn't bother me much either, my manhood is pretty secure. As to shooting in the field without hearing protection, yes I do that. Of course, I've been around heavy machinery for 45 years or so, so my hearing isn't all that good anyway. I would advise younger shooters to protect their hearing whenever possible though, it sucks once it's gone. - dan
I have been shooting for over 40 years,and have hunted for over 35 years,and I have undergone hearing tests every two years at work for 30 years now.As of my last hearing test,my hearing is still normal for my age.A coworker used to be able to say the same,until firing a single shot with a braked 300wm while hunting,several years ago..His ears rang for hours,and his next hearing test showed a measurable decrease in his hearing ability,that has never returned.I always were hearing protection at work,and at the range,but I have never worn hearing protection while hunting.I did fire one shot from a braked 7mm rifle while hunting,and my ears rang for several minutes,but I was lucky,as no measurable hearing damage occurred.I did try a brake on my 300wby,but I only used it for load development,and then took it off to sight in and hunt.Even then,I wore double hearing protection when using the brake.I never bothered installing a brake on either of my 300RUM rifles.
I'd always opt for a brake and more hearing protection for shooting at the range, and no brake and no hearing protection for hunting. Vais brakes are supposed to result in only small noise increases due to the design. Also I believe there are some brakes which can be "closed"? Remember seeing that somewhere.
Best piece of range equipment I ever bought though was a good set of earplugs for when the guy next to you uncorks his braked .30-.378.
As for the original question, I'm partial to Weatherby mags, so make mine a .300 Wby! If that's not enough, skip the RUM and go .30-.378.
Best piece of range equipment I ever bought though was a good set of earplugs for when the guy next to you uncorks his braked .30-.378.
As for the original question, I'm partial to Weatherby mags, so make mine a .300 Wby! If that's not enough, skip the RUM and go .30-.378.
Have a look at loading manuals. Both big 30's reach the same velocity levels. The 30-378 just has to burn a heck of a lot more powder to get there. I hunt with the brake on my RUM. And I always have foam plugs in my jacket pockets. In my stands the shots are long and I have plenty of time to plug the holes in my head before shooting. I also have 2 sets of electronic muffs for my wife and I.
*edited* to add links to dispell the MYTH of the mighty 30-378. The RUM is more efficient with less barrel errosion, see notes on the Wby.
http://www.accuratereloading.com/30378wmag.html
http://www.accuratereloading.com/300rum.html
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I also carry foam and the eclectrotronic muffs while sitting. Sometimes long shots. Sometimes very long shots. One time the buck walked right behind me and I did not see him until I shot out at 500 yards! Having said that I cringe at the thought of shooting a RUM or Wetherby.
Northman999
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Southern Yukon
Of the two cartridges listed, I would go with the 300 RUM if I wanted more horsepower than the 300 win mag. The 300 Weatherby's claim to fame was being the baddest kid on the block, but that is history now. While a fine cartridge, it's now a middle-of-the-pack member of a highly crowded field of cartridges. The way I see it, a fellow should either go with the most common and affordable (300 win mag) or the king of the hill for that caliber (30-378).
I've fired my braked RUM without hearing protection while hunting. As the shooter it's tolerable if there is nothing for the soundwave to reflect back from. Because of my job I get an auditory test every 2nd year paid for by work. My baseline test, first one, was in 1989. Since then my hearing is at about 98% of what it was then. I'm told I've lost a tiny bit of the highest ranges. And total loss of the range of my wife's voice when she wants to put me to work!
I wear muffs/plugs in the shop at work as needed, diesel HD shop, and plugs in my motorcycle helmet to kill wind noise. Basically I know and will admit that I've been nothing but lucky with my hearing over the years. And out hunting I never shoot until EVERYONE around me has their ears covered.
Bigger boiler room, with the correct powder, will always get more velocity, all else being equal. It's simple physics. I've seen 30-378 rifles that push 180 gr Noslers at 3500 fps, and I know my (and a friend's) RUM will not do that. doesn't mean that there isn't one out there that won't, but none of the ones I've experienced so far. There are other big 30's as well, the Lazzeroni and the old A-Square hotrod, the 300 Pegasus, that will equal those velocities as well. I also had a chance to fire a 30-416 Rigby Improved some years back, and it chronographed 180 gr bullets (I forget the make though) just under 3600 fps, from a 32" bbl if memory serves. FWIW - dan
Riflesmith
CGN Regular
- Location
- On The Line
I swore years ago I would never own a .30 cal rifle of any kind. The reason being that in just about any form it is too good for almost anything. Meaning I could only justify so many rifles. Well I cracked I built a sako AV in .300 ultra mag with a break and cap and a .300 Wsm on a borden. Also with a break. I love shooting but hate recoil. Certain amounts of recoil.
First of all the .30 cal with todays great bullets at any velocity and most huntable/shootable ranges is just about perfect. I have a .338 I built and find it my most unused rifle now. If I need power and range I pick up one of my .30's and if I need more power I use a .375 h&h. The s**ttty thing of that is my .338 is ridiculously accurate. However I use my .30's for long range whitetail/mule deer here on the prairie or my .300 wsm for hard hunts up high.
I have a real thing however for history with cartirdges and one thing the .300 weatherby has is history. If you are a sheep hunter you know that most of the pioneering sheep hunters used a .300 weatherby and it is great. My .300 rum is around 10 lbs and the short mag is 7 with scope. Each has its place and use. With good bullets used in each i doubt you will notice the difference. Pick one and have at er'
IMHO the whole discussion of breaks comes down to two things stock fit and practice. If your gun fits your PROPERLY and you use it it shouldn't be too much to handle. However if it doesn't fit and you don't practice it is not fun. I have breaks on my short mag .300 and my ultra mag .300. I use the breaks at the range for load development and take them off for hunting. Conversly my two .375 h&h's don't have breaks and neither do both my .500 nitro 3"''s. Stock fit and practice. Take this for what it is.....just my opinion.
First of all the .30 cal with todays great bullets at any velocity and most huntable/shootable ranges is just about perfect. I have a .338 I built and find it my most unused rifle now. If I need power and range I pick up one of my .30's and if I need more power I use a .375 h&h. The s**ttty thing of that is my .338 is ridiculously accurate. However I use my .30's for long range whitetail/mule deer here on the prairie or my .300 wsm for hard hunts up high.
I have a real thing however for history with cartirdges and one thing the .300 weatherby has is history. If you are a sheep hunter you know that most of the pioneering sheep hunters used a .300 weatherby and it is great. My .300 rum is around 10 lbs and the short mag is 7 with scope. Each has its place and use. With good bullets used in each i doubt you will notice the difference. Pick one and have at er'
IMHO the whole discussion of breaks comes down to two things stock fit and practice. If your gun fits your PROPERLY and you use it it shouldn't be too much to handle. However if it doesn't fit and you don't practice it is not fun. I have breaks on my short mag .300 and my ultra mag .300. I use the breaks at the range for load development and take them off for hunting. Conversly my two .375 h&h's don't have breaks and neither do both my .500 nitro 3"''s. Stock fit and practice. Take this for what it is.....just my opinion.
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One would assume so. But the 30-378 is a barrel burner even worse than the RUM. That's saying something. And I'm starting to believe that given a certain barrel length and bore you eventually reach a point of diminishing returns. I refer to my Hornady manual because it lists all 3. The 300Wby, 300RUM, and 30-378Wby. With identical bullets the RUM and 30-378 are exactly equal with the 26" barrels they list. The 300Wby in a 26" barrel listed, is within 100fps of both big-boys except for the 220gr bullet where it falls to 200fps behind. Now that's what they publish with liabilities in mind of course. The chaps on Accuratereloading.com push the envelope sometimes more than a little. But their velocities in the big 30's can be matched on other sources. I forgot to link their loads/velocities for the 300Wby and will now. Please note the accuracy results they list for each load as they developed them for all 3 30's.
http://www.accuratereloading.com/300wmag.html
Wow they never got the numbers claimed by Hornady!
Oddly enough, I was in the Hornady test tunnel in Nebraska when they were doing the load testing for the 30-378. The gun they used (a Wby Accumark, with a brake, now that's loud indoors) is but a single example. Could have a slow barrel, etc. I tend to treat all loading manuals as simply a guide, not a bible.
What we always run into with each generation of "overbore" cartridges, is that we don't have the correct burning rate of pwders for those large cases. Then new powders come along, and suddenly those "barrel burning" cartridges become the norm. Look at the 280 Ross, the original 7 Mags, early 300 H&H loadings, etc. We just haven't reached that point with the big 30's yet (lack of demand maybe?). I do agree that diminishing returns is a fact with larger cases, but that is true of all cases. There is no straight progression of x amount of powder equals y amount of velocity, sadly. The burning rate of the powder has to be figured in as well. The other factor that plays against large magnums is that you really do need more barrel length to make them shine, and who wants to hunt with a 30+ inch long barrel? For the range it works ok, but not that great for a high elevation mountain hunt or working your way through northern pine stands. We haven't reached the point yet where small efficient cases can equal their big brothers. Perhaps some of the liquid slurry/blended powder developments being experimented with will change that, I'll be interested to see where we are in 5 or 10 years. FWIW - dan
What we always run into with each generation of "overbore" cartridges, is that we don't have the correct burning rate of pwders for those large cases. Then new powders come along, and suddenly those "barrel burning" cartridges become the norm. Look at the 280 Ross, the original 7 Mags, early 300 H&H loadings, etc. We just haven't reached that point with the big 30's yet (lack of demand maybe?). I do agree that diminishing returns is a fact with larger cases, but that is true of all cases. There is no straight progression of x amount of powder equals y amount of velocity, sadly. The burning rate of the powder has to be figured in as well. The other factor that plays against large magnums is that you really do need more barrel length to make them shine, and who wants to hunt with a 30+ inch long barrel? For the range it works ok, but not that great for a high elevation mountain hunt or working your way through northern pine stands. We haven't reached the point yet where small efficient cases can equal their big brothers. Perhaps some of the liquid slurry/blended powder developments being experimented with will change that, I'll be interested to see where we are in 5 or 10 years. FWIW - dan
I agree with everything you said, except (possibly) that, because in one sense it's true, but in the way that most people take it, it's patently untrue.
At equal pressures, a 300 RUM will gain quite a bit more MV for every extra inch of barrel than will a 30/06 (so it "shines" more with every inch added), but its MV will still far surpass a 30/06 with an 20" barrel, just like it will with a 32". Some say that "300 RUM with 20" barrel = 30/06", which is nonsense.
Another dogma is that slower powders "need" more barrel length to "get a complete burn" - that's also nonsense. They might lose more MV per inch of barrel reduction, but that's because slower powders produce more MV per inch of barrel. All powders are completely consumed within inches of the chamber, but all produce expanding gasses that can accelerate a bullet far beyond the muzzle of any barrel of a practical length.
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True Andy, I didn't explain that very well. If you think of your barrel as the cylinder of a car engine, and the longer barrel giving you more "stroke" for burning gas expansion, maybe that analogy will work better. - dan
Riflesmith
CGN Regular
- Location
- On The Line
X-Fan is there a cure for this .30 cal sickness? With this caliber and Triple shock bullets look out!
