300 WM Vanguard, 212 ELD-X , three powders, time to look at gun?

chrismc said:
Yeah i was going to suggest to look at scope/rings/bases.
My 325 wsm originally shot like that , upon inspection a base screw had loosened - after dealing with that, the rifle grouped.
The 178-78 target looks the best of the lot - maybe try repeating it 0.3 grains up and down and see what happens
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I got this.................

 
Following for interest... I've had 3 Vanguards and every one shot like a demon... this one is baffling. My 300WM Vanguard S2 REALLY liked 180 grain Barnes Vor-TX for factory ammo, other 180 stuff not so much...
 
Kelly Timoffee said:
178 ELD and 180 Gamekings.
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I read MP's post about twist rates. He's correct to a point.

If you read any of PO Ackley's comments or Towsend Whelan's or even those of Hatcher on twist rates and the tests done to find the best rate of twist, the 1-10 twist rate is about the best compromise they could find for THIRTY CALIBER bores. It was found they stabilized bullet weights of most lengths well from 135 to 220+ grains. No, as you know, it isn't ideal for all shapes and weights. For instance for folks shooting 100 to 135 grain bullets, 1-15 twist rates seem to be optimal. Some even shoot 150 grain bullets, with flat based bullets well in matches.

150 grain to 180 grain bullets will stabilize well with 1-12 twist rates and 180 grain -220 grain will stabilize well with 1-10 twist rates.

It's only when you start using VLD and ULD monolithic style bullets that things start to go awry.

A very good friend of mine in Monatana fought in the Viet Nam War. He did two tours there. Never fired a shot under stressful conditions and his only injury was to the side of his thumb. He embarrassing admits that he was wearing cotton gloves while doing a job on a receiver in a drill press. He laughingly refers to himself as the ultimate REMF. He worked in the Battalion Armory and other than for pleasure, never left the base.

His job was to make sniper rifles, that went awry, shoot well again. He told me he worked on everything from Garands to Springfields, Remingtons and Winchesters. There were also a few exotics there for test issue in the field.

His favorite rifles to work on were Winchester Model 70s, chambered in 308Win and 300 Winchester Magnum. Some snipers had preferences as to which rifles worked best for them. It didn't matter if it was just psychological, if they were good at their job, they were catered to.

The mod 70 is close enough in design to the S2 to make this relevant.

The bullet of choice for the snipers using the 300WM was the Sierra 200 grain boat tail, spitzer. He wouldn't comment on the tips.

The rate of twist in all of the Model 70 rifles he worked on was 1-10. He told me their standard was 3/4 moa at all ranges. Of course not all of the rifles could meet that standard but were still issued if only a bit out of spec.

The S2 is basically a Howa and in the 300 Win Mag has a 1-10 twist rate, which has been proven to be excellent for cup and core bullets up to 220 grain.

The S2 was reported to be a better choice over the Tikka T3, mainly because of loose bolt handle issues.

Like it or not, even the best of the best will produce the odd lemon.

KT, from your posts, you don't give up easily and check all of the obvious options to correct a problem. That bore looks OK to me. That bit of gilding at the muzzle is IMHO not an issue and if it is, not a barrel or rifle I would keep. Chatter marks from the broach aren't uncommon and although they promote fouling, they seldom are bad enough to stop any rifle from shooting acceptably for at least 20 shots when no more than 2-3 shots are fired between cooling periods.
 
had this problem with 212 eldx in a r700 300 RUM and 162 eldx in a tikka 7mm rm same looking groups every time with multiple powders, seating depths, primers, and casings, i switched to berger 210gn for 300 RUM and 168gn for the 7mm rm and instantly got good groups.#boycotthornady
 
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