.308 projectile seating question

R

roadcarver

CGN frequent flyer
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
26   0   0
Location
Ontario
Hi, finally got around to reload .308 for my Savage 10TR.

1. I used 5 range pick up brass, all Winchester branded brass.
2. Did a full length re-sizing using Lee die with a Classic Turret press
3. Trimmed to length using the Lee gauge cutter, deburred and chamfer the case mouth
3. I tested the empty brass and chambered it in my .308 and the bolt closed and ejected without issues

Load data:
1. 43gr CFE 223
2. Speer 180gr with soft point
3. Hodgdon data recommended the COL to 2.800 inches
4. The factory cartridge that I had measured was at 2.780, I set my COL to 2.785

What I noticed is that after I seated the projectile, the vertical hash mark (not sure what you call that) on the projectile is still visible above the case mouth. I compared the length of the factory round visually and via the caliper, both are the same.

The only difference is that the hash marks are still visible above the case mouth maybe within a millimeter.

Is this normal?

Thanks for any insight.
 
COAL is an entirely worthless measurement.

The problem is that every bullet has a slightly different shape. The important dimension is measured to the bullet ogive or where the bullet meets the rifling. This requires a special tool called a bullet comparator.

Try and measure the length of the marks on the bullet and then seat the bullet that much deeper. This will get you in the ballpark for proper bullet seat depth.
 
By "hash mark" I am guessing you mean the cannelure. This is supposedly where the neck is crimped to the bullet. It doesn't matter if the cannelure is showing or not. The published COAL is irrelevant for your gun. There are many ways to evaluate the right seating depth for your rifle. Google is your friend.
 
Agree that COL is different for each rifle, do yourself a favour and buy a COL gauge, mine is the Hornady Lock and Load. Also a comparator set, between them you can get your ogive reading and seat accordingly. My guess is you will seat to roughly 2.850, mine are all around there, with some jump left to lands.
 
as said the "hash mark" is called a cannelure which is designed to have the case mouth crimp onto/into. if you were loading for a semiauto i would suggest seating it to the cannelure and a light to moderate crimp. But since you have a bolt gun then i would take a freshly sized case (no powder/primer) and barely seat a bullet into it, just enough so it won't fall out and is straight. then put the dummy round into the chamber and close the bolt. remove the dummy round and you now have the max OAL of your gun and that specific bullet. using a OAL gauge (bought or home made) you can now measure off the ogive of the bullet to get a proper OAL reading. Once you have all that info you can mess around with various seating depths assuming your looking for the best accuracy you can get. if it's just plinking rounds then just seat it at the cannelure and call it a day.
 
There is a problem with the advice previously given;
"take a freshly sized case (no powder/primer) and barely seat a bullet into it, just enough so it won't fall out and is straight. then put the dummy round into the chamber and close the bolt. remove the dummy round and you now have the max OAL of your gun"
Probably not the best advice as you would push the bullet deep into your rifling leade increasing your OAL. On removing the dummy round you may pull the bullet out of your brass some before you fully remove the bullet from the rifling also increasing your OAL.
Personally I drop a new bullet into the chamber and lightly push it into the rifling until it stays. I measure from the muzzle the difference from the bullet tip to the bolt face and subtract .010" for a ten thou bullet jump to the lands. Of course it must fit in the mag and on some guns that is the limiting factor unless you single load the rounds. With .308 Win the typical medium action mag will need 2.800" OAL to fit the magazine. YMMV

270 totheend
 
270 totheend said:
There is a problem with the advice previously given;
"take a freshly sized case (no powder/primer) and barely seat a bullet into it, just enough so it won't fall out and is straight. then put the dummy round into the chamber and close the bolt. remove the dummy round and you now have the max OAL of your gun"
Probably not the best advice as you would push the bullet deep into your rifling leade increasing your OAL. On removing the dummy round you may pull the bullet out of your brass some before you fully remove the bullet from the rifling also increasing your OAL.
Click to expand...
I've yet to have a bullet get stuck and if it does then i just it won't be very hard to knock out at all.

270 totheend said:
Personally I drop a new bullet into the chamber and lightly push it into the rifling until it stays. I measure from the muzzle the difference from the bullet tip to the bolt face and subtract .010" for a ten thou bullet jump to the lands. Of course it must fit in the mag and on some guns that is the limiting factor unless you single load the rounds. With .308 Win the typical medium action mag will need 2.800" OAL to fit the magazine. YMMV

270 totheend
Click to expand...

Bullets aren't the same length (typically) so if you happened to put in a shorter bullet from box of bullets and used that to find your OAL then the longer ones would be right at the lands or possibly jammed into them.
 
Spawn-Inc said:
I've yet to have a bullet get stuck and if it does then i just it won't be very hard to knock out at all.



Bullets aren't the same length (typically) so if you happened to put in a shorter bullet from box of bullets and used that to find your OAL then the longer ones would be right at the lands or possibly jammed into them.
Click to expand...

not if you seated them to the same OAL
 
If a picture is worth a thousand words then a video is worth a million.
He is an old guy and rambles on a bit but seems quite thourough from my brief viewing.
 
I would ask if someone could check their speer manual for you and see what speer says to set the col at .I don't have one sorry but a quick look at my hornady it says to load a 180 sp bullets at 2.740 also states that the starting load for cfe 223 is 37.2 grns so I would start their work up a load first, max in hornady manual is 44.6 grns .5 grns at a time .
 
I'm doing this for plinking, that's the main reason. I want to ensure that I do this right so that no over pressuring is created.

Thanks for all the advice, all very helpful. The Speer Bullet is called "Grand Slam".

This morning, what I did was drop a bullet into the rifling and used a brass rod to just push it in so that it sticks. I had a another rod that I measured the length from the tip of the barrel to the bolt face, and one with just the bullet tip.

I was able to get a measurement of 2.7500 inches. I'll make the overall length slightly less as suggested by 270totheend to about .010 to give the bullet some running space before it hits the rifling.

The Hornady Loader video was also very informative, learned a lot from that video.
 
litledab said:
I would ask if someone could check their speer manual for you and see what speer says to set the col at .I don't have one sorry but a quick look at my hornady it says to load a 180 sp bullets at 2.740 also states that the starting load for cfe 223 is 37.2 grns so I would start their work up a load first, max in hornady manual is 44.6 grns .5 grns at a time .
Click to expand...

Since when did Speer, or any other manufacturer learn the length of the chamber in YOUR rifle?
 
I guess it must just be the 10 tr which I have that has been between 20 and 10 thou jump just by using the manufactures col The manufacture will always play on the safe side and use the sammi specs as will the gun manufactures
 
litledab said:
I guess it must just be the 10 tr which I have that has been between 20 and 10 thou jump just by using the manufactures col The manufacture will always play on the safe side and use the sammi specs as will the gun manufactures
Click to expand...

I have been reloading for two rifles, a Tikka and a Savage Edge, both in the same calibre, 7mm-08.
The throat on the Tikka is about .040" longer than is the Savage.
With the bullets I was using I could seat in the crimping groove for the Tikka, but before they would go into the Savage and the bolt lock down, they had to be seated so much deeper that the cannalure was completely covered by the neck of the case.
This is why we always say that the COAL as shown in any manual is completely useless.
 
H4831 said:
I have been reloading for two rifles, a Tikka and a Savage Edge, both in the same calibre, 7mm-08.
The throat on the Tikka is about .040" longer than is the Savage.
With the bullets I was using I could seat in the crimping groove for the Tikka, but before they would go into the Savage and the bolt lock down, they had to be seated so much deeper that the cannalure was completely covered by the neck of the case.
This is why we always say that the COAL as shown in any manual is completely useless.
Click to expand...

Thanks, this pretty much sums up what I have learned to date reloading for my bolt action. When I change projectiles down the road, I'll repeat the measurement process.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom