45-70,444,450???
- Thread starter mjcurry
- Start date
the 444 is essentially a stretched 44 mag, and suffers from a lack of widely available heavy bullets (most are designed for the 44). Don't load anything lighter than the 265, and really, look for something in the 300+ range. Anything a 450 can do, a 45-70 can also do if you reload - they're basically the same cartridge. Bullet availability is great for both. With the heavier bullets comes heavier recoil though. My money is on the 45-70 -- easier to get components for, and a lot more components available for 'playing' with too. 350gr bullets can be loaded to ~2200fps in a reasonably strong firearm, and a bit more in the really strong ones for a ~200 yard range. That's as light a bullet as I'd go for moose/elk/brownies. Or, if you'd prefer, there are 500-600 grain bullets that you can load in the 1500 fps range as well.
Really, either is a perfectly acceptable choice with proper loads, and can take anything on the continent with ease.
Really, either is a perfectly acceptable choice with proper loads, and can take anything on the continent with ease.
- Location
- AB foothills
The 444 is the only one I wouldnt buy out of your choices...
I own two Marlin 45-70's and they are a blast
I own two Marlin 45-70's and they are a blast
45/70 by a wide margin if you reload, and yes the heavier you reload it the more it will kick, with the heavier bullets you will stop before the upper pressure limits due to recoil......480 gr. cast bullet(LBT) at 1900 fps.....444 w/265gr. bullet...do the math.......you can load down the 45/70 as well by using 330-350grain bullets but for when it really counts the 480 Wide Flat Nose Gas Check cast hard from M.T. Chambers trumps 'em all!
45-70 - No question at all.
The 45-70 can match .450 velocities if you handload, plus brass is plentiful and cheap, and will be around another 100 years (unless the liberals screw us over).
The bullet selection is WAY better in .45 than .44
The 45-70 can match .450 velocities if you handload, plus brass is plentiful and cheap, and will be around another 100 years (unless the liberals screw us over).
The bullet selection is WAY better in .45 than .44
Gatehouse said:If you reload, the 45/70 is my choice. the 450 if you do not.
the end all do all advice on these rifles. I love my .450 and reload for it, but if I knew I was going to get into reloading when I was buying it I would have bought the .45-70.
the .444 does nothing the .45-70/450 can't do better.
The .450 was brought out so non handloaders could get the medium level .45/70 loads out of the Marlins that handloaders were using without the worry of them ending up in a Springfield or rolling block. The .450 has slightly less capacity than the .45/70 and a unique belt size so it is not easy to make the brass from other magnum cases with a standard belt. If you handload the .45/70 is more common for brass and will do everything the .450 will plus a tiny bit in the Marlin. The .444 is the little brother of both. But .444 and .450 high performance loads are more available to the guy buying factory ammo because there are no old guns in these rounds. Handloader advantage to the .45/70, factory loads shooters will have an advantage in the other two. They are all very capable rounds with good ammo. There are some lightweight bolts made in the .450 and in the Ruger #1 or #3, the .45/70 will compete with the .458win.
45-70 all the way. Sure, it can kick, but nothing that a decent butt pad can't help. As a case in point, I was shooting factory 405 grainers out of my Marlin 95 and then shot the same load out of my shorter, and lighter, Guide Gun. The Guide Gun's butt pad removed a pretty significant amount of recoil. I wouldn't have believed this if someone had told me but I did this "test" myself.
Other CGNers raise some good points about reloading and bullet selection and this is also true. Just my two cents worth.
Other CGNers raise some good points about reloading and bullet selection and this is also true. Just my two cents worth.
- Location
- Calgary, AB
None of you guys have seen a .444 shooting 350gr cast bullets
It will do anything the other two will, and burn less powder. Factory 240gr and 265gr loads are tame compared to what this cartridge can really do.
.444 Marlin Heavy Cast Bullet Load Development
Check out some of these loads > here
It will do anything the other two will, and burn less powder. Factory 240gr and 265gr loads are tame compared to what this cartridge can really do.
.444 Marlin Heavy Cast Bullet Load Development
Check out some of these loads > here
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- Location
- calgary, AB
My "little" .444 marlin is a blast to shoot! The guide gun with ported barrel has less recoil then my 30-06! Plus with ghost sights it is more accurate then my friends 45/70 that is scoped (to 100yds). Both are marlin guide guns.
- Location
- Calgary, AB
savage17hmr said:
I just bought a 444P Outfitter, and a Bushnell red dot scope will be going on it. Then it's party time
i have a #3 in 45/70. it's very accurate to probably 150 yards. i only have reciever sights on it .
with federal 300s it's not TOOOOO bad in the recoil department for a 6 lb rifle.
catnthehat was good enough to stick a decellerator recoil pad on it and it tamed it a lot. but it's not the gun for extended range sessions. ouch!
i had a marlin in 45/70 that was much easier on me, but was silly enough to sell it.
45/70's very easy to reload, shoots cast or jacketed. i was always interested in the 444 tho.
i can't see the point of the 450 but then that's me. they are all big thumpers, capable of taking anything on this continent.
also small game if you use a bit of unique and a 457 round ball.
heck , i even have shot loads for mine using card wads.
could the 45/70 be the fabled "all round cartridge"??
naaaah! i don't think so.
that'd be the 45/110 that i have in a sharps replica ... better case capacity for shot loads.
with federal 300s it's not TOOOOO bad in the recoil department for a 6 lb rifle.
catnthehat was good enough to stick a decellerator recoil pad on it and it tamed it a lot. but it's not the gun for extended range sessions. ouch!
i had a marlin in 45/70 that was much easier on me, but was silly enough to sell it.
45/70's very easy to reload, shoots cast or jacketed. i was always interested in the 444 tho.
i can't see the point of the 450 but then that's me. they are all big thumpers, capable of taking anything on this continent.
also small game if you use a bit of unique and a 457 round ball.
heck , i even have shot loads for mine using card wads.
could the 45/70 be the fabled "all round cartridge"??
naaaah! i don't think so.
that'd be the 45/110 that i have in a sharps replica ... better case capacity for shot loads.
- Location
- Ft. Mac. Alberta
hornhead said:i have a #3 in 45/70. it's very accurate to probably 150 yards. i only have reciever sights on it .
with federal 300s it's not TOOOOO bad in the recoil department for a 6 lb rifle.
catnthehat was good enough to stick a decellerator recoil pad on it and it tamed it a lot. but it's not the gun for extended range sessions. ouch!
i had a marlin in 45/70 that was much easier on me, but was silly enough to sell it.
45/70's very easy to reload, shoots cast or jacketed. i was always interested in the 444 tho.
i can't see the point of the 450 but then that's me. they are all big thumpers, capable of taking anything on this continent.
also small game if you use a bit of unique and a 457 round ball.
heck , i even have shot loads for mine using card wads.
could the 45/70 be the fabled "all round cartridge"??
naaaah! i don't think so.
that'd be the 45/110 that i have in a sharps replica ... better case capacity for shot loads.
Whatcha tryin' ta do, Horned one, sell that but kickin' cannon??!!
It IS a nicee rrifle actually, but I prefer my 45/70 with the 500 grainers and the custom sight!
Cat
