45-70 reload hangfire

Ganderite said:
Most manuals list magnum primers with ball powders because ball powder is harder to ignite.

The problem is exacerbated in large bore rifles, because the volume increases dramatically as the bullet starts to move. Increased volume is decreased pressure - and it takes pressure to get ignition.

I have had the click-bang feeling a number of times with ball powder.

Two things you can do:

Use a magnum primer or a stnd Wincheter primer. This will speed up ignition.

Use a firmer crimp. This will increase ignition pressure.

There is a difference in primers. (Second primer is a Winchester.)
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in the past all different main primers available for rifle were shown on different pictures. it was interesting.
 
are you cleaning your brass with walnut media? I've had problems with bits of it getting stuck in the flash hole when I tumble after resizing. Was a pain to check & clear each case so I started running a universal deprimer in station 1 on m Dillon 550.
 
medvedqc said:
in the past all different main primers available for rifle were shown on different pictures. it was interesting.
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I could do it again, but the point is that the Winchester and the magnum primers are much hotter. I use Winchesters as my standard primer in all ball powder loads and my reduced charge cast bullet loads. No more click-bangs.

I once loaded 1000 rounds of 223, 55 gr bullet with H335 and standard primers. About 1:10 would not fire. I did not want to pull 1000 rounds, so I ran them all through the press with a Lee Factory die and gave them a firm crimp. That solved the problem. Used hot primers after that lesson.
 
So I see Winchester makes standard large rifle and magnum large rifle primers. Would either work? I might be able to source some some standard WLR. I also have some CCI No. 34’s which I might try on a few. I’ll also double check the crimp, I’m using copper plated bullets so didn’t want to go too strong in the crimp.
 
Winchester used to use ball powder in their factory ammo, so their standard primer was made hot for ball powder in ordinary (not magnum) cases. If you can get Winchester primers, that would work well. Or CCI or Fed magnums.
 
Ganderite said:
I could do it again, but the point is that the Winchester and the magnum primers are much hotter. I use Winchesters as my standard primer in all ball powder loads and my reduced charge cast bullet loads. No more click-bangs.

I once loaded 1000 rounds of 223, 55 gr bullet with H335 and standard primers. About 1:10 would not fire. I did not want to pull 1000 rounds, so I ran them all through the press with a Lee Factory die and gave them a firm crimp. That solved the problem. Used hot primers after that lesson.
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lucky you for the primers ... i got only cci and federal regular and magnum in both.
 
Paul_1982 said:
So I see Winchester makes standard large rifle and magnum large rifle primers. Would either work? I might be able to source some some standard WLR. I also have some CCI No. 34’s which I might try on a few. I’ll also double check the crimp, I’m using copper plated bullets so didn’t want to go too strong in the crimp.
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CCI 34 is intended for military use with free floating firing pins in self loaders, so have a bit harder cup not to slam fire.
You might end up with light strikes with those.
 
That ball powder is harder to ignite and doesn't alway burn well at lower than full pressure loads. Some combination of 1 or more of these: more crimp, different powder, bigger charge of the same powder - will fix it.
 
jethunter said:
That ball powder is harder to ignite and doesn't alway burn well at lower than full pressure loads. Some combination of 1 or more of these: more crimp, different powder, bigger charge of the same powder - will fix it.
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or heavier bullet.

The worst combo I have ever used was a light bullet, light charge, no crimp and stand primer.. 100% Click---bang. 150 gr bullets in a 8x57
 
Update for those who care:

I used a bit more crimp and there were no more hang fires. I also used magnum primers and that’s going to be the proper fit.

H335 creates quite a fireball too lol
 
Only ever had that happen loading for a .444, never for a .45-70. Given the load data you say you used it sure sounds like a couple of bad primers. 57 grains of any suitable powder is pretty much filling the case sufficiently, like 90+% assuming your coal is within spec. Pull them apart, weigh the charge weight (might find your solution right there, it happens) and look at the struck primers. 10 to 1 they didn’t light up
 
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