45 Cowboy Special
- Thread starter 89diesel
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Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Sounds like a .45 Auto Rim, by another name, loaded light (.45 Short Colt is all it is, revisited). .45 Auto Rim has a strong following and is a great cartridge, I imagine it's a good little cartridge.
From what I understand it is a shortened .45 Colt casing with an inside taper, and has a much thinner case wall at the neck. Reduces blow back significantly.
You use .45 ACP/AR dies. Adirondack Jack sells a modified carrier for 1866, and 1873 uberti rifles. The bolt has to be modified as well, and there are instructions for that.
Double Tap sells the brass in Canada, but has no stock, and does not know when they will. Adirondack Jack will not sell the brass to Canadians because it is to much of of a hassle (from the US Gov.) to do so. I had contacted both him, and Double Tap about this Brass.
I think it would be great to be able to get this brass. I am starting to shoot Black Powder for CAS, and blow back is an issue with my .45 Colt chambered revolvers (no issue with rifle as it is chambered for .44-40). I am interested in it because loading 15 - 20 grains of BP is more cost effective than loading 35 grains.
Looks like a great product, but is very difficult to get...
You use .45 ACP/AR dies. Adirondack Jack sells a modified carrier for 1866, and 1873 uberti rifles. The bolt has to be modified as well, and there are instructions for that.
Double Tap sells the brass in Canada, but has no stock, and does not know when they will. Adirondack Jack will not sell the brass to Canadians because it is to much of of a hassle (from the US Gov.) to do so. I had contacted both him, and Double Tap about this Brass.
I think it would be great to be able to get this brass. I am starting to shoot Black Powder for CAS, and blow back is an issue with my .45 Colt chambered revolvers (no issue with rifle as it is chambered for .44-40). I am interested in it because loading 15 - 20 grains of BP is more cost effective than loading 35 grains.
Looks like a great product, but is very difficult to get...
What do you mean by "blow back"? I'm curious. - dan
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
They're referring to powder gases coming back around the case, due to ultra low pressure loads that don't seal the chamber with the with heavier brass cases. I run into it with .455 loads, dirty chambers, powder marks up the sides of the cases. Sounds like these thin neck cases will fix that.
Right on, but the original .45 colt cartridge was loaded in a copper case that was much softer than today's brass.
The brass is made for Adirondack Jack by Starline (so I've been told).
This is from Adirondack Jack's website;
"It's hard to beat the old colt, unless......
unless that is, you try to slow it down enough to make it a competitive round
for use in action games. The big old black powder case is just too roomy,
making for poor performance as charge densities decrease to target levels.
Sure, the .45 Colt works fine for "warthog" loads, but if you try to slow it
down enough to be competitive, accuracy and consistency suffer badly.
Some attempts have been made to get around this problem by using wads
or fillers, notably even using breakfast cereal. Some shooters eventually
give up their beloved .45s in favor of .38s. A few have trimmed cylinders to
use .45 autorim cases (a decidedly one way operation), others simply suffer
with lousy performing ammo or heavier than necessary recoil, and their
scores show it.
Initially, we got around these problems by cutting down .45 Colt cases to a
more suitable length. They worked ok, but suffered another problem.
Straight walled revolver rounds like the .45 are tapered on the inside, so
trimming them significantly increases the wall thickness, which is turn
squeezes bullets in the loading process, which can contribute to leading
issues. What's more, trimming a couple thousand cases into proper brass
is a LOT of work.
What was clearly needed was a round that would load just like any other,
using no wads or fillers, and having .45 Colt case head dimensions and a
proper .45 colt case mouth so that it would load normally in any press and
function properly without leading issues in any revolver, derringer or single
shot arm chambered for .45 Colt.
We got together with America's finest brass maker, and designed a cartridge
to do just that. It's as if we took the unwanted middle out of .45 Colt brass,
and left behind a proper case .895 inches long.
Now, why .895 inches? Well, we could have chosen any length, but we
wanted a round that would load with commonly available dies, so we chose
the same length as .45 ACP. It also happens that by doing so, the case
capacity under a 250 grain bullet is cut by just about half, making it a dandy,
soft shooting round with smokeless powder, black powder, or subs in the
process.
Thus was born the Cowboy .45 Special. Designed to reduce case capacity
available under the bullet by as much as 50%, this little beauty runs very
consistently and accurately with smokeless loads as light as 600 - 650 fps
with 200 grain bullets. A current favorite recipe runs a 200 grainer at 650
fps with an extreme spread of SIX, even with progressively loaded ammo
and volumetrically dispensed charges (no hand weighing and single stage
loading to artificially tighten results). A real sweet 520 fps load with 160
grainers is possible too!
These kind of numbers translate to recoil approximating commercial 158
grain .38 cowboy ammo, and accuracy that is absolutely grin inducing.
We're talking one hole groups at CAS distances!"
Funny the cowboy shooters trying to get less power from there cases.
Im the exact opposite of the cowboy shooter
LOL
I just got a very nice WG army and was happy to see the gun can cycle and shoot 45 colt yet is not altered to do so,,, also it can shoot all the 455 ammos to.
Im the exact opposite of the cowboy shooter
LOLI just got a very nice WG army and was happy to see the gun can cycle and shoot 45 colt yet is not altered to do so,,, also it can shoot all the 455 ammos to.
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SASS (Single Action Shooting Society) rules require us to shoot reduced power loads. We are shooting at steel plates with lead bullets, and ricochets can be a problem. Black Powder loads do not have to be reduced, just smokeless loads. Not a lot of black powder shooters out there.Funny the cowboy shooters trying to get less power from there cases.
Im the exact opposite of the cowboy shooter
I just got a very nice WG army and was happy to see the gun can cycle and shoot 45 colt yet is not altered to do so,,, also it can shoot all the 455 ammos to.
.45 Special is appealing for a couple of reasons. Using less powder (economy) is just one.
I agree with you in that I prefer full loads just like they were back in the day. Black powder can be pricey, so I am looking at it as a way to get more loads out of a pound of powder. I shoot .45 colt in 2 of my pistols, and .44-40 in another pistol, and rifle.
You have quite a collection of vintage arms, have you considered trying Cowboy Action Shooting?
I think you'll find Dingus doesnt understand "reduced powder loads" I have it from a reliable source, that when he shows up at the range, other guys move over a couple spots!
I do hope there is life after death....Im coming back as him! He's sold nicer guns than I'll ever own.
I have it from a reliable source, that when he shows up at the range, other guys move over a couple spots!I do hope there is life after death....Im coming back as him! He's sold nicer guns than I'll ever own.
Shelldrake
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Right behind you,,
SASS (Single Action Shooting Society) rules require us to shoot reduced power loads. We are shooting at steel plates with lead bullets, and ricochets can be a problem. Black Powder loads do not have to be reduced, just smokeless loads. Not a lot of black powder shooters out there.
.45 Special is appealing for a couple of reasons. Using less powder (economy) is just one.
I agree with you in that I prefer full loads just like they were back in the day. Black powder can be pricey, so I am looking at it as a way to get more loads out of a pound of powder. I shoot .45 colt in 2 of my pistols, and .44-40 in another pistol, and rifle.
You have quite a collection of vintage arms, have you considered trying Cowboy Action Shooting?
I admit it looks like alot of fun.
I got some guns that can shoot to. I dont load everything up hot.
99% of my loads are light target loads, but for my bush packing loads they are on the warm side
Try cream of wheat filler in a full 45 long colt case half BP then cream of wheat to filler up so theres no air space.
I did that in my 50 70 pistol with pyrodex loads half and half.
The problem i see with the 45 special is bullet jump. the bullet has a longer way to go before it hits the rifleing so accuracy is lost.
by useing cream of wheat filler ontop of your BP loads the bullets are still up by the forceing cone and your groups should stay tighter.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Certainly, I make shortened .45LC brass for a .455 I shoot that has room for the rim. Just would need to figure out a reamer, preferably one with a primer flash hole pin to center and index.
I forgot to add, another benefit of thin wall brass with light loads is the cases grip the chambers properly and don't set back against the face of the frame, causing sticky operation.
Yes, but no stock...
I've done the cream of wheat thing, and tried grease cookies (a friend thought I was shooting tracers). The deal is a case that seals the chamber better than .45 Colt cases...
As for accuracy, We are shooting at large steel plates at short distances. One fellow on the CAS City Forum said his .45 special loads shot like lasers. This is the same fellow with the Big Lube Bullet website.
I'll likely just keep doing what I am doing now. When I contacted Double Tap, and Adirondack Jack all I wanted was a small quantity of the brass to try. It is frustrating not being to get hold of things here in Canada that some take for granted in the US...
