5.56/.223 M10X, Stoner Gas System M10X possible, and/or .308/Creedmore M10X possible?

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Ustauk

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I know the M10X has had quality issues, but I had a couple of thoughts regarding expanding the platform.

Give some people are working on Type 81 .223/5.56 conversions, would there be a market for the M10X in that caliber? Would the preference be to have a STANAG magazine lower become available, or instead use 5.56 Beryl magazines or the equivalent to keep the same lower receiver?

My second question is much more of an edge case. The Jard J180 uses a gas tube to impinge against Stoner pseudo piston style bolt and BCG to actuate the 180 recoil harvesting system. This allows re-use of barrels, gas tubes, gas blocks, and handguards from donor prohibited firearms. Could the same be done with an M10X, with the M10X's BCG being impinged from a gas tube instead of the forward piston/spring, but still using the single rear spring recoil harvesting system? I don't know if you could use a standard AR handguard without reconfiguring of the receiver's geometry, but this would allow re-use an existing gas block, barrel, and gas tube from a donor prohibited firearm, or the customer to choose their own high quality, custom, or more frugal barrel. Impossible or possible?

Lastly, could the M10X platform be strengthened to accommodate a up-calibering to .308/Creedmore, or would the platform not be strong enough?
 
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Bman12456 said:
Honestly, after the experience I had with my M10x, I would never buy so much as a screw from M+M. The rifle is an absolute embarrassment at its price.
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Fair enough. Would there be a market for a higher-quality rifle in the same style, perhaps piggybacking on the FRT, using a single recoil harvesting spring instead of the dual 180 springs to have a svelter profile the wide 180-based rifles? Or will the R18 MK2 be svelte enough to scratch that itch?
 
Ustauk said:
I know the M10X has had quality issues, but I had a couple of thoughts regarding expanding the platform.

Give some people are working on Type 81 .223/5.56 conversions, would there be a market for the M10X in that caliber? Would the preference be to have a STANAG magazine lower become available, or instead use 5.56 Beryl magazines or the equivalent to keep the same lower receiver?

My second question is much more of an edge case. The Jard J180 uses a gas tube to impinge against Stoner pseudo piston style bolt and BCG to actuate the 180 recoil harvesting system. This allows re-use of barrels, gas tubes, gas blocks, and handguards from donor prohibited firearms. Could the same be done with an M10X, with the M10X's BCG being impinged from a gas tube instead of the forward piston/spring, but still using the single rear spring recoil harvesting system? I don't know if you could use a standard AR handguard without reconfiguring of the receiver's geometry, but this would allow re-use an existing gas block, barrel, and gas tube from a donor prohibited firearm, or the customer to choose their own high quality, custom, or more frugal barrel. Impossible or possible?

Lastly, could the M10X platform be strengthened to accommodate a up-calibering to .308/Creedmore, or would the platform not be strong enough?
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1. There absolutely would be a market for a 5.56 M10X if the quality issues were absolutely stamped out. I really mean stamped to death and a video uploaded of the rifle being fired non-stop for 10,000 rounds. No I am not exagerating genuinely would need that after the multitude of absolute horror stories that have come out.

STANAG magazines would of course be required, Beryl magazines from where? and likely stuck to 5 round capacity, we want the 10 round goodness

2. I don't think this is a good idea. There were circa 80k AR15s banned, this sucks but after nearly 20 months the people who were going to buy something to salvage parts over to in order to save money have probably already chosen to drop the money on a WK/WS-MCR or other comparable NR platform. The J180 is a joke price wise as $1300 to then put your AR parts on something doesn't make sense. Lastly I think that while I love the fact that the AR15/180 platforms have brought a great amount of interchangeability there are limitations there, the MCR/WK rifles are not the best rifles on the planet and if they can build a better rifle then I would like them to do it regardless of interchangeability with other rifles.

3. It's not a case of strengthening the platform, we can see that long stroke firearms handle 7.62x51 quite happily as the Valmet and other platforms have show. The issue is the cost of extending a receiver and building up a separate production line.
 
Bratwurst said:
1. There absolutely would be a market for a 5.56 M10X if the quality issues were absolutely stamped out. I really mean stamped to death and a video uploaded of the rifle being fired non-stop for 10,000 rounds. No I am not exagerating genuinely would need that after the multitude of absolute horror stories that have come out.

STANAG magazines would of course be required, Beryl magazines from where? and likely stuck to 5 round capacity, we want the 10 round goodness

2. I don't think this is a good idea. There were circa 80k AR15s banned, this sucks but after nearly 20 months the people who were going to buy something to salvage parts over to in order to save money have probably already chosen to drop the money on a WK/WS-MCR or other comparable NR platform. The J180 is a joke price wise as $1300 to then put your AR parts on something doesn't make sense. Lastly I think that while I love the fact that the AR15/180 platforms have brought a great amount of interchangeability there are limitations there, the MCR/WK rifles are not the best rifles on the planet and if they can build a better rifle then I would like them to do it regardless of interchangeability with other rifles.

3. It's not a case of strengthening the platform, we can see that long stroke firearms handle 7.62x51 quite happily as the Valmet and other platforms have show. The issue is the cost of extending a receiver and building up a separate production line.
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Thanks!
 
Bratwurst said:
1. There absolutely would be a market for a 5.56 M10X if the quality issues were absolutely stamped out. I really mean stamped to death and a video uploaded of the rifle being fired non-stop for 10,000 rounds. No I am not exagerating genuinely would need that after the multitude of absolute horror stories that have come out.

STANAG magazines would of course be required, Beryl magazines from where? and likely stuck to 5 round capacity, we want the 10 round goodness
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Id take beryl mags even with the 5 rounders. Beryl mags can be had for cheap direct from Poland. They're around $24 each pinned and shipping isn't too bad.

Its a shame the m10x has so many issues I really do like the design.
 
AntiKhaos said:
Id take beryl mags even with the 5 rounders. Beryl mags can be had for cheap direct from Poland. They're around $24 each pinned and shipping isn't too bad.

Its a shame the m10x has so many issues I really do like the design.
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Why? What do beryl mags give you that STANAGS do not?

It seems like a very poor idea for a firearm to be entirely dependent on one magazine producer on a separate continent.
 
Bratwurst said:
Why? What do beryl mags give you that STANAGS do not?

It seems like a very poor idea for a firearm to be entirely dependent on one magazine producer on a separate continent.
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Didn't realize my life depending on said gun. Then my answer would not be a proprietary ak like action that I couldn't get replacement parts for let alone mags.

As a for fun gun so long as im not running it in a competition having it be in a standard magazine isn't important to me. If I based all my decisions on what magazines a gun took I'd have alot less interesting guns.
 
Bratwurst said:
Why? What do beryl mags give you that STANAGS do not?

It seems like a very poor idea for a firearm to be entirely dependent on one magazine producer on a separate continent.
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I believe some people like the look of the banana magazine, even with the reduced capacity. I say, whatever floats your canoe :)
 
AntiKhaos said:
Didn't realize my life depending on said gun. Then my answer would not be a proprietary ak like action that I couldn't get replacement parts for let alone mags.

As a for fun gun so long as im not running it in a competition having it be in a standard magazine isn't important to me. If I based all my decisions on what magazines a gun took I'd have alot less interesting guns.
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I'm not sure if or when they will get around to producing them, but Sylvestre said Jard was planning on producing some AK magazine using lowers for the J180, just FYI. Should pair nicely with a large bolt face kit for 7.62x39mm.
 
Ustauk said:
I'm not sure if or when they will get around to producing them, but Sylvestre said Jard was planning on producing some AK magazine using lowers for the J180, just FYI.
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JARD yikes ill wait until they make something that runs well i'm always willing to change my opinion on things but the JARD 180 does not seem to be a winner.
 
AntiKhaos said:
JARD yikes ill wait until they make something that runs well i'm always willing to change my opinion on things but the JARD 180 does not seem to be a winner.
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They could use some work on the aesthetics, but when probably lubricated the 5.56 kits out there seemed to have functioned well, and even one that wasn't lubed broke in nicely after some dry teething. I'll drop Sylestre a call, and ask they suggest to Jard they may want to look at some of the lowers from other 180 firearms for ergonomic inspiration while they're tinkering with the magwell.
 
EVeryone keeps saying the M10X has issues. When they first came out, that was the case.
But with Magpul magazines, the newest M10X rifles work great. And with all the new non-restricted firearms appearing on the market at a price point of $2000+ I feel it is the new normal for a quality firearm.

I would love a M10X in 223. I would want it to take AK-style mags just like the original.
 
Crusader said:
EVeryone keeps saying the M10X has issues. When they first came out, that was the case.
But with Magpul magazines, the newest M10X rifles work great. And with all the new non-restricted firearms appearing on the market at a price point of $2000+ I feel it is the new normal for a quality firearm.

I would love a M10X in 223. I would want it to take AK-style mags just like the original.
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I think there is a lot of history behind why people are not only pissed off at the quality but also by the means by which the high price against the awful quality was reached.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8qJ7UEXTUo

Even recently as per the above link they are not seen with a great light.

Don't get me wrong, I would love for this to jump out as a great rifle, but until they make a significant effort to publicise themselves and show what has gotten better I cannot just assume that things are better. The most recent change I've seen from them is a shorter handguard leaving the gas system exposed because apparently burning your hands is fun and you get to pay a couple hundred dollars more for the joy of it.
 
Ustauk said:
Fair enough. Would there be a market for a higher-quality rifle in the same style, perhaps piggybacking on the FRT, using a single recoil harvesting spring instead of the dual 180 springs to have a svelter profile the wide 180-based rifles? Or will the R18 MK2 be svelte enough to scratch that itch?
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Absolutely there would be. If it were made by another company I may even buy one. All I want is a rifle that is decently accurate, and WORKS all the time. Canadians have been putting up with high price, dog#### quality guns for WAY too long. If a rifle is $2000 and can't keep up with my $700 AR, it has no place IMO.
 
Crusader said:
EVeryone keeps saying the M10X has issues. When they first came out, that was the case.
But with Magpul magazines, the newest M10X rifles work great. And with all the new non-restricted firearms appearing on the market at a price point of $2000+ I feel it is the new normal for a quality firearm.

I would love a M10X in 223. I would want it to take AK-style mags just like the original.
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Thats just not accurate. Even the latest gen rifles are littered with issues. If yours runs, thats awesome. But id wager a majority of these rifles dont see 1000 rounds without issues.

My m10x had NOT ONE BUT TWO catastrophic failures within 100 rounds. First the piston rod snapped in half 30 rounds in, after getting a new one, fired about 50 rounds and the trigger completely sh*t the bed and the rifle was no longer operable.

A rifle in the price range of the m10x should be able to chew through 2000 rounds without so much as an extraction issue.
 
FYI every problem with the M10x is due to the chamber being extremely ruff, taking it apart bringing the barrel to an experienced gunsmith and getting him to hone and polish the chamber fixes literally every problem, after I had mine done I can extract manually when the gas setting is set to zero and I use the suppressor gas setting to cycle now.

With such an expensive rifle I shouldint have had to have this done but 120$ later and it’s super smooth and runs absolutely perfect.
 
QUATTROISKING said:
FYI every problem with the M10x is due to the chamber being extremely ruff, taking it apart bringing the barrel to an experienced gunsmith and getting him to hone and polish the chamber fixes literally every problem, after I had mine done I can extract manually when the gas setting is set to zero and I use the suppressor gas setting to cycle now.

With such an expensive rifle I shouldint have had to have this done but 120$ later and it’s super smooth and runs absolutely perfect.
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I had no idea that a sticky trigger, safety, FCG, charging handles flying off, only newer batches even being heat treated properly could all be fixed by having a gunsmith polish the chamber!
Thanks for the heads up
 
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