.600 homemade bullets

[spi]

As a cheap and easy solution to this, have you considered electroplating and then swaging the copper jacket on?

Homemade electroplating gear can be made quite cheaply and you may already have the gear around the house.

 

[Casull]

I know nothing about electroplating. Can you give as an explanation?
Thanks.

 

[prosper]

No offence to spi intended, but I think electroplating is a bad idea.

It's been a few years since I took chem in high school, but from what I remember, it works like this.
Basically, what you're going to have to do is suspend the part you're plating (the bullet) in a solution of copper sulfate. You'll need a 12v trickle charger. Attach the negative lead to the bullet, and the positive lead to an inert rod - carbon works well. With the carbon and bullet in the solution & powered up, the copper ions in the water will get plated onto the bullet. In a few hours you'd have a VERY thin, but even copper plating on the bullet. It could take weeks and many changes of the copper sulfate solution to have a reasonably thick copper plating built up. You may be able to get away with using a copper anode instead of carbon, and salt water solution instead of copper sulfate (or any other semi-conductive solution. Baking soda would work too. Put both ends in the solution, and add soda/salt until the ammeter on the trickle charger reads 5 or so amps).... I tried that once, and it's really picky to get working.
Like I said, it will take a very long time to get any reasonably thick ( a few thou) built up, and it's a really picky process.

I'm sure google has a lot of info on the subject


edit: http://www.finishing.com/faqs/howworks.html
http://www.finishing.com/faqs/index.html

 

[spi]

I know nothing about electroplating. Can you give as an explanation?
Thanks.

Sure I can. But I have to charge you a consulting fee now.

Electroplating is the process of depositing one metal on another metal using electricity. It is both a very simple concept which there is some evidence to suggest was known thousands of years ago, and a very complex science which can obtain amazingly complicated reasults.

What you would be doing is more properly called electroforming because the coat will be much thicker than typical plating.

Here is a basic diagram for the process:

In your case, the anode would be a chunk or plate of copper. The cathode would be the bullet to be coated. The rectifier could can be bought commercially, or be a battery trickle charger, or even just simply a 6-9v battery. The electrolyte is any mildly acidic electrically conductive solution. I've heard of coca cola being used even, but best results will be obtained by using a commercial solution. You can mix your own out of distilled water, copper sulphate, and swimming pool acid. Instructions for this can be found on the 'net, but it has it's hazards, and again, best results will be obtained with commercial solutions. The tank can be any material that can hold the solution and not be plated itself. Pyrex is best because it can then be put on a hot plate to warm the solution and work faster.

How it works is simple: Electric current causes atoms of the material of the anode to pass into the solution and from there to be deposited on the cathode. The longer you do this, the thicker the coat. I have electroformed copper jackets up to 1mm thick onto wax models with a commercial model. Areas that you do not want plated can be coated with a resist. Laquer or nail polish will work fine. The finished bullet could be swaged or tumbler burnished for best hardness and dimensionality. Although it does take time (about 48-72 hours per 0.25mm - 0.5mm with the set up I used) it is an absolutely hands off operation and good for large quantities.

Here is a site for kits and resources:

http://www.caswellplating.com/kits/index.html

Here is a good technical writeup on it:

http://electrochem.cwru.edu/ed/encycl/art-e01-electroplat.htm

 

[spi]

prosper,

Speer uses electroplating for a variety of their bullets, including bullets for very heavy pistol calibers such as the .475 Linebaugh, etc... and it may be used for some of their rifle bullets as well.

I really see no reason - aside from time (if that's a concern) - that it could not be used to build up a thick enough jacket for the use we are discussing here.

 

[spi]

Just as an example of why you might want to go the electroplating route, a "core-locked" type of bullet would be easier to produce than through conventional methods:

 

[dingus]

Caswell Canada are on the net
They sent me a catalog and there copper plateing kit will plate up to 1/8 thick within a few hrs the 1.5 galon Copper plateing kit is $205 but i think there prices have gone up.
I need to order one this summer.


So Spis idea aint that crazy really just expensive

just put Caswell Canada in Google and it comes up fine.
Or use spis link i didnt see it before.

 

[prosper]

prosper,

Speer uses electroplating for a variety of their bullets, including bullets for very heavy pistol calibers such as the .475 Linebaugh, etc... and it may be used for some of their rifle bullets as well.

I really see no reason - aside from time (if that's a concern) - that it could not be used to build up a thick enough jacket for the use we are discussing here.

Commercial electroplating is a whole other ball-o-wax. They have easy access to the necessary metallic salts & proprietary additives, proper disposal processes - you can't just wash the byproducts down the drain, and the like. Then there's the buildup of hydrogen to be aware of, and more. It's really very complicated to get something setup at home that's going to work well. My father used to work in a chrome plating plant when I was a kid - it's not a simple as it seems

 

[dingus]

Commercial electroplating is a whole other ball-o-wax. They have easy access to the necessary metallic salts & proprietary additives, proper disposal processes - you can't just wash the byproducts down the drain, and the like. Then there's the buildup of hydrogen to be aware of, and more. It's really very complicated to get something setup at home that's going to work well. My father used to work in a chrome plating plant when I was a kid - it's not a simple as it seems

Well Now its easy!
im getting a nickle plateing kit from Caswell and a copper one to. They work great and i think its a great idea for copper jackets on bullets.

 

[762nato]

Be carefull about how much of your bullets is bore diameter, allot of the British nitros had a tapered bullet, bearing suaface for the full length will increase pressure. That being said bullets look neat good luck.

 

[spi]

Commercial electroplating is a whole other ball-o-wax. They have easy access to the necessary metallic salts & proprietary additives, proper disposal processes - you can't just wash the byproducts down the drain, and the like. Then there's the buildup of hydrogen to be aware of, and more. It's really very complicated to get something setup at home that's going to work well. My father used to work in a chrome plating plant when I was a kid - it's not a simple as it seems

Actually, it is as simple as it seems. This is not conjecture, I have done it. As I mentioned above, I have electroformed copper up to 1mm thickness, and that was with a jeweller's kit that cost under $200.

 

[prosper]

Hmm, well that IS really cool then.

And in an application like this the copper probably doesn't NEED to be that thcik - it's more there to prevent leading

 

[mooncoon]

I seem to recall that Casull intended to use the gun on large bears (potentially) and controlled expansion would also be an issue. I haven't measured them but smaller caliber rifle bullets have jackets more likely in the .01" thick range and probably thicker for large dangerous game

cheers mooncoon

 

[Casull]

I am not conserned about expansion, but the bullet has to hold together, though the lead core alone would be adequate for killing I am sure.
My latest theory is that I am going to turn some plugs out of brass. 5/8" bar is .625" and I am going to turn it to .620" outside then make a reduced section that will just fit inside the tubing. So, it will have a shoulder on it to bare against the bottom of the tubing with a small section inside. I think this should hold it together. As well, I am making a swaging die to swage in the top of the tubing gently to give another angled shoulder on top. What do you guys think? I also just aquired two Lee aluminum .58 moulds. I am going to try to open the driving bands to .620" with a small boring bar in the four jaw. A good cast bullet would suit my needs well. Input?

 

[dingus]

I think the brass plugs will work thats what i was trying to say with copper plugs made from shaft but your right it would have to be wider than half inch.

Brass will soder to copper as well as copper to copper.
try a couple it might work great and you wont be out $200 or more for that copper plateing kit tho i like that idea to.