I've seen 5-6 receivers for sale on here and on other sites for anywhere from $300-400 w/out the barrel fore end or the stock... now my question is, why are they selling (if there even selling) for $300-400 when i can go to cabelas and buy a brand new 870 for $399.99... just curious if maybe there's a reason like is there different types of receivers or something like that?
870 receiver prices?
- Thread starter Opex
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Well, appears there are some who are consistently trying to drive the price up .... at least it seems that way.
People will point to the older Wingmasters as being better and therefore more money.
In reality it doesn't work out cost wise if you want to update the WM to modern specs.
If you were to take an old 2 3/4" only NON-flex tab WM and have those mods done to it by a good smith (which would require re-finishing) VS the cost of a 3" flex-tab Express and take that to a qualified smith for polishing and refinishing .... the Express comes out a bit cheaper and is easily the equal of a "good ol' Wingmaster".
Anyone who tries to suggest otherwise is full of it. Might want to ask why pro-builders like Tac-Ord use Express receivers for their builds.
I've bought both 870 receiver "types" for builds. If you find an old WM in good shape and 2 3/4" only is all you need, WM easily wins over a stock Express. However, if you want the modern features a updated Express receiver it wins.
So.... point of the whole rant is some are trying to capitalize on the PERCEPTION that old Wingmasters are ALWAYS better and should cost more.
People will point to the older Wingmasters as being better and therefore more money.
In reality it doesn't work out cost wise if you want to update the WM to modern specs.
If you were to take an old 2 3/4" only NON-flex tab WM and have those mods done to it by a good smith (which would require re-finishing) VS the cost of a 3" flex-tab Express and take that to a qualified smith for polishing and refinishing .... the Express comes out a bit cheaper and is easily the equal of a "good ol' Wingmaster".
Anyone who tries to suggest otherwise is full of it. Might want to ask why pro-builders like Tac-Ord use Express receivers for their builds.
I've bought both 870 receiver "types" for builds. If you find an old WM in good shape and 2 3/4" only is all you need, WM easily wins over a stock Express. However, if you want the modern features a updated Express receiver it wins.
So.... point of the whole rant is some are trying to capitalize on the PERCEPTION that old Wingmasters are ALWAYS better and should cost more.
Your more than welcome to your Express models and that misguided slanted opinion is just wrong. I'll put my money in a good used Wingmaster receiver over an Express. The $300.00 bracket is a a fair deal on a good used Wingmaster receiver that these three are all wearing
There is the unaccounted cost for a polished blue receiver and smoothed internals over the Express matte finish.
View attachment 94344
There is the unaccounted cost for a polished blue receiver and smoothed internals over the Express matte finish.
View attachment 94344
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No, it's not a slanted opinion nor wrong.
I'm down on the stock Express just like anyone else who owns the higher end 870's.
I own Wingmasters, and 870P's as well as an Express. I'll take the WM's and 870P's over the Express ANYDAY. However, after a touch up by a company like Tac-Ord the Express receiver is every bit as equal to the other two.
To say otherwise is dishonest.
now a stock Express .... that's a different matter all together.
I'm down on the stock Express just like anyone else who owns the higher end 870's.
I own Wingmasters, and 870P's as well as an Express. I'll take the WM's and 870P's over the Express ANYDAY. However, after a touch up by a company like Tac-Ord the Express receiver is every bit as equal to the other two.
To say otherwise is dishonest.
now a stock Express .... that's a different matter all together.
I like how you use the term "pro builders" then throw in the term " touch up " . So just add the cost of those associated pro builder touch ups in there to get to the quality of the older Wingmaster and let us know.
There is a reason the builders use the Express receivers- they are cheaper.
Even to buy a Express receiver for a build your knocking on $300.0000 by the time you get I shipped.
Not sure how or why your throwing the term "dishonest " in there based on your limited opinion.
There is a reason the builders use the Express receivers- they are cheaper.
Even to buy a Express receiver for a build your knocking on $300.0000 by the time you get I shipped.
Not sure how or why your throwing the term "dishonest " in there based on your limited opinion.
As for "pro-builders" & "touch up" I clearly stated polishing and finishing..... no word play.
Of course the Express receiver is a cheaper starting point. It's well known the differences are lousy finish, sub par but workable internal polishing and polymer trigger guard.
A proper internally polished Express (entire receiver, not just chamber) and quality finish end up equal to Wingmaster quality.
The word play is you omitted that I was directly comparing a MODIFIED/UPDATED older Wingmaster (update to 3" .... which requires re-finishing and flex-tab update) to an UPDATED Express (internal polish and refinish). You skipped that all together. FYI, the Express ends up about $50 cheaper for all the mods to make the two receivers comparable.
For your convenience, I also DIRECTLY compared an UNMODIFIED WM to an UNMODIFIED Express and 100% agreed with you ! Wingmaster blows it away.
As for your suggestion to add up all the costs of a touched up Express .... I've done exactly that, as well as the Wingmaster updates I described. ... so yeah, I actually know of what I speak which is why I'm stating my opinion.
Just so it's clear to you because it doesn't seem to be:
- old stock WM compared to new stock Express >>>> WINGMASTER HANDS DOWN
- old WM updated compared to new Express updated >>>> EQUAL
- old stock WM compared to a new Express UPDATED >>> WM is still great but lacking on options.
Have you invested in all these options and directly compared for yourself Sir ? If so, you are of course entitled to your opinion. If you have not done same, well I'll pass your opinions by save for the fact that old Wingmasters are great. Totally agree.
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To the OP.
Seems I'm knocking on wood here.
Yes, you can buy a Express at the price you've noted. If you want to buy a receiver and put some of your own touches on it I suggest the Wingmaster.There is no driving the price up on the receivers only the law of supply and demand and a older quality Wingmaster receiver is in demand hence the price..
Seems I'm knocking on wood here.
Yes, you can buy a Express at the price you've noted. If you want to buy a receiver and put some of your own touches on it I suggest the Wingmaster.There is no driving the price up on the receivers only the law of supply and demand and a older quality Wingmaster receiver is in demand hence the price..
The reason for those prices is because those of us that play with 870s know that the old WMs were built with quality materials and will stand the test of time. They have forged/machined parts throughout, and an aluminum trigger guard. The current 870s (all models) have the same high quality machined receiver but the internal parts are now all MIM. The current Police and Wingmaster still retain an alloy trigger guard but since 2002-2003 its production was out sourced to a different company and it's a bulkier unit of inferior material. Looks more link a zinc alloy than an aluminum one. The older Wingmaster is the cheaper way to go if you want a high quality build.
I'm sorry but from a guy that is suggesting one has to send his receivers to a gunsmith to convert an old 2 3/4" doesn't convince me when it can easily be done at home
Oh yes old wingmasters are always better from my experience with them and I have always done my own work on them and have for many years .Still own more than you have fingers and toes in every gauge including the 3 1/2"
I still have my complete 1960's set of skeet and I would like to meet the gun smith that can make an express operate like those. Almost as smooth as a model 31 and that says something
Cheers
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Well said. But what else would I expect from a fellow 3 1/2" wingmaster owner
Changing the subject Buy any new super x-1's in the past year
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Somebody is gonna correct me if I'm wrong but I would imagine the quality of the steel in a Wingmaster receiver must be better than Express because I've never seen one turn yellow from a day of hunting.
Nope they are made from the same billets of steel. The difference is only in the finish process. An old WM that has a loss of bluing will rust just as fast as a bead blasted Express. Even a WM with perfect bluing will show rust stains rather quickly if not dried off and re-oiled fast enough. It's just that the smooth surface of the WM doesn't hold the moisture like the Express does.
Can't seem to get most to understand this. Lots of sentimentality I guess.
I have old Wingmasters, older 870P's and an Express... I KNOW the differences. However, a company like Tac Ord does such a great job on the Express's no one is gonna tell me it's inferior to a Wingmaster. I own them all.
If anyone doubts this and your local shop happens to have a Tac-Ord 870 go find out for yourself. One might not like the style of this SG, but you cannot deny the quality of it.
The receiver is one thing...the internal parts are another. The pre-2003-2004 WM internals trump those of current 870s (all models) by a long shot. Some companies may polish the turds but that's what they remain!
Just a question what does Tac charge to do all of this work to an express receiver . I was told third party but I cannot get my head around how this is an economical option over a vintage wingmaster receiver even at today's asking prices
Cheers
I checked there before I asked but still cannot see it for a 870
http://tacord.com/services/gunsmithing/
