- Location
- Steel Town and The Peg
I think 2 world wars has proven the effectiveness of the classic 8mm Mauser!
This $3000 8x57 Sako really speaks to me...
This $3000 8x57 Sako really speaks to me...
8mm Why ? Should I have one?
- Thread starter c-fbmi
- Start date
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
This $3000 8x57 Sako really speaks to me...
Nice clean lines.
My only suggestion is that if you are building an 8x68 rifle, try and use a longer action.
I have a Mauser 2000 in 8x68S with the magnum length action and I get better use of longer bullets and powder capacity.
The ZG47 in 8x68S has a hard time using anything but the 200 gr flat base spitzers to get to 2900 ft/s or so. The 68 is about the longest one can use in a standard mauser length action without mods.
The longer action Mauser gives much greater latitude in my bullet selection.
I have a Mauser 2000 in 8x68S with the magnum length action and I get better use of longer bullets and powder capacity.
The ZG47 in 8x68S has a hard time using anything but the 200 gr flat base spitzers to get to 2900 ft/s or so. The 68 is about the longest one can use in a standard mauser length action without mods.
The longer action Mauser gives much greater latitude in my bullet selection.
I've done something similar in 8mm with similar objectives. It was done on a M98 action and the magazine length was lengthened to 3.420". The "8mm ARP" was based on a shortened and blown out 338 RUM cartridge.
With a 28" barrel, I was able to achieve the following MV's which I consider max loads. This is well above published 8mm Rem Mag numbers, as they should be, given that usable case capacity is about 105 grs (110 grs to the top) and it's a 28" barrel.
180 gr Nosler – OAL 3.420” – 90.0 gr RL22 – 3450 fps
200 gr Nosler – OAL 3.420” – 86.0 gr RL22 – 3230 fps
220 gr Sierra – OAL 3.420” – 89.0 gr RL25 – 3070 fps
220 gr Sierra – OAL 3.420” – 104.0 gr US869 – 3170 fps
You should be able to come close to those numbers (~150 fps) with what you've proposed.
Here's a chart I did up a few years ago by way of comparison of various 8mm cartridges:
With a 28" barrel, I was able to achieve the following MV's which I consider max loads. This is well above published 8mm Rem Mag numbers, as they should be, given that usable case capacity is about 105 grs (110 grs to the top) and it's a 28" barrel.
180 gr Nosler – OAL 3.420” – 90.0 gr RL22 – 3450 fps
200 gr Nosler – OAL 3.420” – 86.0 gr RL22 – 3230 fps
220 gr Sierra – OAL 3.420” – 89.0 gr RL25 – 3070 fps
220 gr Sierra – OAL 3.420” – 104.0 gr US869 – 3170 fps
You should be able to come close to those numbers (~150 fps) with what you've proposed.
Here's a chart I did up a few years ago by way of comparison of various 8mm cartridges:
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dgradinaru
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- British Columbia
The 8mm Gibbs would be a decent cal....it duplicates than the 325wsm in performance.
check out the data on it.
•3
150 grain, Hornady SP
64.0 grs; IMR 4320; 3,346 fps
64.0 grs; RL-15; 3.346 fps
63.0 grs; IMR 4064; 3,339 fps
73.0 grs; H-414; 3,285 fps (case full)
70.0 grs; H-380; 3,274 fps (case full)
•4
170 Grain Hornady RN
63.0 grs; RL-15; 3,202 fps
62.0 grs; IMR 4320; 3145 fps
70.0 grs; H-414; 3,132 fps
60.0 grs; IMR 4064; 3066 fps
68.0 grs; H-380; 3,043 fps
•5
200 grain Speer SP
68.0 grs; H-414; 2,913 fps
58.0 grs; IMR 4064; 2,895 fps
59.0 grs; RL-15; 2,888 fps
58.0 grs; IMR 4320; 2,874 fps
65.0 grs; H-380; 2,861 fps
•6
220 Hornady SP
65.0 grs; H-414; 2,797 fps
57.0 grs; IMR 4320; 2,761 fps
57.0 grs; RL-15; 2,743 fps
56.0 grs; IMR 4064; 2,720 fps
63.0 grs; H-380; 2,689 fps
check out the data on it.
•3
150 grain, Hornady SP
64.0 grs; IMR 4320; 3,346 fps
64.0 grs; RL-15; 3.346 fps
63.0 grs; IMR 4064; 3,339 fps
73.0 grs; H-414; 3,285 fps (case full)
70.0 grs; H-380; 3,274 fps (case full)
•4
170 Grain Hornady RN
63.0 grs; RL-15; 3,202 fps
62.0 grs; IMR 4320; 3145 fps
70.0 grs; H-414; 3,132 fps
60.0 grs; IMR 4064; 3066 fps
68.0 grs; H-380; 3,043 fps
•5
200 grain Speer SP
68.0 grs; H-414; 2,913 fps
58.0 grs; IMR 4064; 2,895 fps
59.0 grs; RL-15; 2,888 fps
58.0 grs; IMR 4320; 2,874 fps
65.0 grs; H-380; 2,861 fps
•6
220 Hornady SP
65.0 grs; H-414; 2,797 fps
57.0 grs; IMR 4320; 2,761 fps
57.0 grs; RL-15; 2,743 fps
56.0 grs; IMR 4064; 2,720 fps
63.0 grs; H-380; 2,689 fps
Farshot,
I didn't know that the Mauser 2000/ Heym SR20 were made in a long magnum action. I ve seen some in 375 and they were the same outside ( not magazine discussion) length as my sr 20 in 9.3x62.
in fact like the Zastava bolt action 70 from 243 win to 375 hh ... one action length.
You are correct in that the Mauser/Heym 2000 has a 3.6 inch length magwell. Not a true magnum - but 0.2 inch longer than my ZG47's 3.4 inch.
I like the Mauser length better for that round, it feeds better as well. Not too heavy of an action like the BRNO 602 size. And yes, it is no chore to lengthen a Mauser 98 to fit.
I like the Mauser length better for that round, it feeds better as well. Not too heavy of an action like the BRNO 602 size. And yes, it is no chore to lengthen a Mauser 98 to fit.
i agree with you for a 8x68s no need for a long heavy magnum action ...
I honestly can't see the point in it here in NA. The 8mm RM has it covered if you want an 8mm, and the .338 WM is better in my view. You can get/make brass much easier too. On the other hand I have owned several 6.5x54's and 8x56 M-S, and one could easily make the same argument about those chamberings too.
Its all fun.... If we only had one rifle, then it would be an argument, but since we can own several, one gets to play.
Thats why I tried the 325wsm (back to the OP).
Funny tho, I have never had a chance to pick up a 8mm RM.... may have to keep an eye out.
Thats why I tried the 325wsm (back to the OP).
Funny tho, I have never had a chance to pick up a 8mm RM.... may have to keep an eye out.
Don't bother farshot, the 8mm RM has a serious design flaw and doesn't even equal the 300 WM or 338 WM.........it's a waste of time and money.........if it was even slightly impressive I would still have one. Every single cartridge based on this case is exceeded by cases having less capacity. My personal experience is that the 7mm Wby and 7mmX300 WM exceeds the 7 STW, and the 35X300 WM exceeds the 358 STA, which barely betters the 358 NM. This cartridge does not live up to it's powder capacity expectations in any of it's incarnations...........there is a serious design flaw, that's my experience and conclusion.
Interesting observations - and I "get" that. You are correct that the ZKK602 has a big action .. it also has a 25in barrel. Overall a stout package. But the extra barrel length is nice - I enjoy having the loud end as far from my ears as possible and I like the little bit of extra velocity that I gain both in the .375 and the 8x68s .. I also like the fact that the weight of the barrel is nicely balanced by the action weight between my hands and steadies ok for unsupported shooting.
The ZKK (as I have said elsewhere before) isnt the most refined and highly polished elegant piece of work -- but it works!! VERY well designed and superior to most other actions - and its tough and ALL steel! My results (and the factory test target) suggest that these rifles dont need to be embarrassed by anything else you might choose if performance is the measure. Probably why I have 5 of them in all lengths - 600, 601, 602. I notice some who were critical of the ZKK 602 referenced other rifles they preferred to use in 8x68s - but used the "past" tense. I still have my 602's -- and like them a great deal! I spent a lot of time carrying a C1 around at one point and I guess after awhile you can become accustomed to any weight if you want to ...
