A good non-restricted AR style rifle.
- Thread starter rustbucket_6
- Start date
hope you enjoy your new rifle by the way! never shot one but i would love to own one some day!If you want 223 then the AR180B-2 or an XCR, or converted to non restricted ACR. All will be well over $1000 and could go as high as $3000 with the ACR depending how you go about getting it.
I would stay away from the Kel-Tec SU-16 and Mini-14 since you mention hunting and the mini-14 I used to have and the SU-16 I had a chance to shoot a few weeks ago both grouped like shotguns. We tried 5 different types of ammo in the Kel-Tec and it was all the same.
For big game hunting you're on the right track with an M305 but they do not look like an AR, for some more money the XCR-M is the closest you're going to get to a non restricted 308 AR.
How about you give some more details as to what your actual budget is and what you plan to hunt with it.
I would stay away from the Kel-Tec SU-16 and Mini-14 since you mention hunting and the mini-14 I used to have and the SU-16 I had a chance to shoot a few weeks ago both grouped like shotguns. We tried 5 different types of ammo in the Kel-Tec and it was all the same.
For big game hunting you're on the right track with an M305 but they do not look like an AR, for some more money the XCR-M is the closest you're going to get to a non restricted 308 AR.
How about you give some more details as to what your actual budget is and what you plan to hunt with it.
That's what I was going to suggest. It's closer to a FAL but it does look similar to the M16. Maybe that buttstock is what remind me of the M16...
Anyway, I checked one out at CSC, and it felt really solid, I want it bad. I think Accurate Action has the best price on them.
Whats with all the suggestions that you can't hunt with a .223... you CAN hunt a deer with .223... I know dozens of guys who have and still do. Not out to 200 yards or anything. But under 100 its effective.
However, the OP said he wants to hunt things "a bit larger than a rabbit"... what exactly does that mean. A deer is ALOT bigger than a rabbit. Thats big game. Are you looking to hunt coyotes? Exactly what IS your hunting requirement. If its coyote size or smaller a .223 is a fantastic choice and the T97 is a great option. Mine is surprisingly accurate out to 100 yards with a decent magnified optic. If your going to look at a VZ58 id stick with the 7.62 version but now your into a calibre thats going to blow a rabbit to pieces.
You could look at a gun like a Keltec SU-16... many have good experiences with them. Ive never owned one. But i have owned 3 other Keltec products and while they have all worked as advertised they all felt cheap and plasticy. Im not looking to start a war here but for $1000-1400 depending on setup, I want a gun that feels solid. My T97 feels solid and was under $1000.
If you want an black style rifle AND you want to hunt small to medium game, maybe look at getting a lower priced black gun (like a T97) and a decent bolt gun for hunting. For the same $$ (or less in many cases) you'll spend on a gun to do both, you can get 2 guns that are, in reality, better suited to their purposes.
However, the OP said he wants to hunt things "a bit larger than a rabbit"... what exactly does that mean. A deer is ALOT bigger than a rabbit. Thats big game. Are you looking to hunt coyotes? Exactly what IS your hunting requirement. If its coyote size or smaller a .223 is a fantastic choice and the T97 is a great option. Mine is surprisingly accurate out to 100 yards with a decent magnified optic. If your going to look at a VZ58 id stick with the 7.62 version but now your into a calibre thats going to blow a rabbit to pieces.
You could look at a gun like a Keltec SU-16... many have good experiences with them. Ive never owned one. But i have owned 3 other Keltec products and while they have all worked as advertised they all felt cheap and plasticy. Im not looking to start a war here but for $1000-1400 depending on setup, I want a gun that feels solid. My T97 feels solid and was under $1000.
If you want an black style rifle AND you want to hunt small to medium game, maybe look at getting a lower priced black gun (like a T97) and a decent bolt gun for hunting. For the same $$ (or less in many cases) you'll spend on a gun to do both, you can get 2 guns that are, in reality, better suited to their purposes.
they (the Tavor) retail for $2700, so not exactly cheap. But an awesome rifle.
The Bushmaster ACR, while also very cool, also retails for $2700
If you want an AR style (gas operated, semi-auto, military-style rifle firing 5.56 NATO or .223 Remington from a quick detach box magazine) at an economical price, you're really looking at the Ruger Mini-14.
Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, AR's (and just about anything that looks like one) are all restricted.
the .223 Remington round is not recommended by most folks I know for large game (much debate on whether it's reasonable to take deer with it)
If you want military-style for an economical price, and capability to take large game, you're really only looking at the Norinco M305 (an M-14/M1A clone), which fires the 7.62 NATO (and .308 Winchester) round.
They used to go for $400, but are now going for $600 new. They are rough around the edges, but tuned up (by yourself if you're handy and have the necessary tools, or at an M14 Clinic which regularly pops up here and there), they are excellent shooters. There's a lot of accessorizing that can be done with them too, over time if you want.
Marstar is a site supporter and have them for sale right now. They also pop-up frequently on the Equipment Exchange here, some priced as new, some priced very well.
Mine is accurate out to 200m. I've read of others being accurate with them (not pinpoint accurate, but battlefield man-sized target accurate) out to 800m.
The M14.ca Blackfeather machined aluminium stock is uber-cool, IMHO.
Here's mine in an 18.5" barrel version:
And here's my 22" version in a Boyds walnut stock, hand oiled:
Last edited:
OccasionallyOnTarget
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Burnaby, BC
If you are okay hunting with 762x39, the XCR-L is a nice choice. On the expensive side though.
they (the Tavor) retail for $2700, so not exactly cheap. But an awesome rifle.
The Bushmaster ACR, while also very cool, also retails for $2700
If you want an AR style (gas operated, semi-auto, military-style rifle firing 5.56 NATO or .223 Remington from a quick detach box magazine) at an economical price, you're really looking at the Ruger Mini-14.
Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, AR's (and just about anything that looks like one) are all restricted.
the .223 Remington round is not recommended by most folks I know for large game (much debate on whether it's reasonable to take deer with it)
If you want military-style for an economical price, and capability to take large game, you're really only looking at the Norinco M305 (an M-14/M1A clone), which fires the 7.62 NATO (and .308 Winchester) round.
They used to go for $400, but are now going for $600 new. They are rough around the edges, but tuned up (by yourself if you're handy and have the necessary tools, or at an M14 Clinic which regularly pops up here and there), they are excellent shooters. There's a lot of accessorizing that can be done with them too, over time if you want.
Marstar is a site supporter and have them for sale right now. They also pop-up frequently on the Equipment Exchange here, some priced as new, some priced very well.
Mine is accurate out to 200m. I've read of others being accurate with them (not pinpoint accurate, but battlefield man-sized target accurate) out to 800m.
The M14.ca Blackfeather machined aluminium stock is uber-cool, IMHO.
Here's mine in an 18.5" barrel version:
And here's my 22" version in a Boyds walnut stock, hand oiled:
This is exactly what I decided that I am goin to do. I actually found a picture on the internet of a gun that almost looks identical to yours and saved it because I'm going to start buying the parts slowly and start to build it. What type of buttend is that on your gun and how much was it?
I was thinking about hunting coyotes and deer with this gun. So I think the M305 is my best bet
It was a Mission First Tactical Buttstock.
ht tp://www.missionfirsttactical.com/Products/Battlelink-stocks/BATTLELINK-Utility-Stock_8
The cheek piece was separate, but unnecessary as the stock height was adequate for cheek weld with the low ARMS scope mount
Look into the Magpul products too. They look pretty cool as well and appear to be very well contstructed, IMHO
Last edited:
I have no doubt the 223 can take a deer but in Alberta and probably some other provinces it's illegal to hunt big game with 223. Hunting big game with such a tiny bullet also requires perfect shot placement so suggesting a new shooter take a 223 out for deer is irresponsible as a humane kill is not very likely.
Rustbucket, keep in mind that with the M305 which I do think is a good choice if you can afford to feed a semi auto 308 your buying a $500ish Chinese rifle then planning to throw hundreds of dollars into it to make it look cool but you still have a cheap Chinese rifle under a fancy dress. If you want something more modern military looking I suggest you buy the M305 but leave it stock and just enjoy it for what it is. Continue saving your money then when you have a couple thousand saved up sell the M305 for pretty much what you paid for it and buy something like an XCR-M.
Gunnerlove
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Vancouver Island
I am waiting for the MPAR.
onetwentyish
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Central AB (AKA Northern Texas)
I got tired of waiting...
I hunt deer in New Brunswick with 223 (it's legal there). The method I use is humane. I hunt with accurate rifles with high power scopes off bipods. I always take shots at the animal's brain and I have 100% success at dropping the animal instantly. I use bonded projectiles 65gr Sierra Game Kings. Now I don't advocate that you do that. I do but as you see it ain't your normal hunting style. However my recommendation is for boiler shots, which is the normal big game practice a good 30 cal pill is the way to go. I would have to agree with others that a great rifle for your needs would be the M305. Then upgrade the stock, scope it and enjoy the transformation into the uber anti Lieberal black gun it can become.
Moe
Moe
