Advice/Help Request Norc M14 - FTC on some mags after changing stock...?

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Knyte

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So, I changed out the synthetic stock for a boyds classic military walnut one on my norc m14, since doing so, 3 of my 4 mags have frequent failure to chamber issues. It will eject fine, but won't chamber another round, the bolt just passes on over the next round in line and when I pull the trigger the pin goes and everything just no round in the chamber. Occasionally one will stovepipe, but I'd say 9 out of the 10 issues are the failure to chamber another round.

One of the mags I have works fine, I put about 30 rounds through it with that mag and not a single hiccup. As soon as I switch to a different mag, immediately issues arise.

1 of the 3 mags that doesn't work is a 5 rounder, 2 are 20/5's, the one mag that does work is a 20/5.

I did notice, that after the boyd stock, the 5 round mag is more difficult to withdraw, ie it seems to stick. I don't really notice it on the 20/5's because they have so much to grip I just pull them out without issue. Could the new stock be putting lateral pressure on the mags causing the problems? If so could this be solved by sanding down the mag channel and then re attaching the stock liner?

Or is this maybe some other issue altogether?

Any input would be appreciated. I just don't want to change anything on the stock or start modifying if I don't have too :) It looks so nice I'd hate to ruin it.

Also, could it maybe just be a 'break in' issue?
 
don't think it's got anything to do with the stock- i'd be more likely to suspect the follower( or the magazine spring not doing it's job- all 5 rounders stick, period.- even the "special parade magazines' that were issued made by springfield and were 60 bucks back in 92- the reason that your 5/20 is flawless is b/c that was the way the original was designed and it was a clone of a perfect unit
i've got about 30 magazines and those that give trouble are the so-called "shorty" mags- the usgi 20 and the chinese 20s give no problems whatsoever- the 10s and 5s are really waste basket numbers, but i keep them for hunting
now as to waht to do with yours- load and unload them a bunch of times, and they MAY smarten up
also, make sure you're getting a "FULL LATCH" when you put your mag in- you SHOULD hear it click-
however, in your position, i'd spring for another 4 5/20s ( norinco mags)-
 
Yep, it DOES pass the above linked test.

I too would have thought that just some of the mags are bad BUT they all worked great with the synthetic stock, and it isn't just the 5 rounder it is also 2 of the 3 5/20's that are malfunctioning.
 
if you're getting the full click lock in on all your mags, it's got to be in the mag istelf, even if it DOES sound like an unlatched rear lock- check the good mag against the 2 malfunctioning mags, and pay special attention to the TAB at the rear- that's a known trouble spot - the one on the spine of the mag-the only other thing i can think of other than a real mash it in and lock it a bunch of times would be to swap the mag's internals
 
All good advice here! Thanks for saving the typing! :D

Keep us posted... Likely just fine tuning needed. Some of the tabs on the back of the magazines are goofy. Some of the pins holding the mag catch are slightly out of spec depending upon which high school student put your trigger group together. Was it Hung Well or Long Dong? :nest:

Cheers,
Barney
 
I had a similar issue.

From observation, I have a theory as to the cause.

I found immediatly after putting the Chicom metal on the stock and inserting a mag that it was a very tight fit at first. For whatever reason, the stock was squeezing the metal liner and the sides of the mag applying pressure to it and hindering the upward movement of the follower in the mag!

I had the exact same issue with all 3 of my 5/20 mags.

Do you find that it is much harder to insert/remove a magazine now? Does it take a lot more force?

Does your bolt stop lever also not hold back the bolt after firing the last round? This was the case with mine at first and again it's because the pressure was not allowing the follower to raise up high enough or even enough to push up the bolt lock and hold it rearward.

What I did was place an empty mag in the rifle and gave it a couple good solid wiggles side to side to attempt to "open up" the space. Probably closer to smacks than wiggles :D

Over time it has stopped and I now have zero issues with it :rockOn:
Give it a try, you won't break the thing, it's iron tough.
 
Mag rear tab

t-star said:
if you're getting the full click lock in on all your mags, it's got to be in the mag istelf, even if it DOES sound like an unlatched rear lock- check the good mag against the 2 malfunctioning mags, and pay special attention to the TAB at the rear- that's a known trouble spot - the one on the spine of the mag-the only other thing i can think of other than a real mash it in and lock it a bunch of times would be to swap the mag's internals
Click to expand...

So I take it then if the tab at the rear of the mag is the fault, there is no fix other than buying a new one?
I have encountered it as well.
Thanks
 
Collieman said:
So I take it then if the tab at the rear of the mag is the fault, there is no fix other than buying a new one?
I have encountered it as well.
Thanks
Click to expand...

well, most of the ones i've seen and /or heard about can be remedied by taking a bit off meat off the bottom of the tab- just be careful to do the tab and NOT the rear of the tube- what you have to do is seat the mag in properly, turn the rifle upside down and see WHY the latch isn't 'going home"- then remove enough of the tab to allow it to go home- it's DELICATE work,and not something for joe and DREMEL- it's more like fine triangular or flat file, stroke, try, and stroke again- be prepared to spend a couple of hours ; and when she does get home, add 2 strokes for good measire and try again- now it's combat ready;
 
Hungry said:
All good advice here! Thanks for saving the typing! :D

Keep us posted... Likely just fine tuning needed. Some of the tabs on the back of the magazines are goofy. Some of the pins holding the mag catch are slightly out of spec depending upon which high school student put your trigger group together. Was it Hung Well or Long Dong? :nest:

Cheers,
Barney
Click to expand...

if it needs filing, it's long dong- as taught by mr brake nguyen
 
Are you sure your op-rod isn't rubbing on the stock? I know that it "seems" to be a mag issue, but I'm just thinking what I had to fix with my new stock. If everything worked fine with the original stock, then it should be a stock problem, not a mag problem.
 
Well, the rear tabs on the magazines all look the same, and they do definitely 'click' into place.

The only mag I notice that 'sticks' since changing the stock is the 5 rounder. The 20/5's go in and come out fine.

The op rod isn't rubbing on anything that I can see, this was something I thought might be affecting it too and I did check it.

I'm gonna try running her a bit more and see if it's something that will break in. It's basically a bolt action with those three mags so it's not so bad I suppose... :)
 
Knyte said:
Well, the rear tabs on the magazines all look the same, and they do definitely 'click' into place.

The only mag I notice that 'sticks' since changing the stock is the 5 rounder. The 20/5's go in and come out fine.

The op rod isn't rubbing on anything that I can see, this was something I thought might be affecting it too and I did check it.

I'm gonna try running her a bit more and see if it's something that will break in. It's basically a bolt action with those three mags so it's not so bad I suppose... :)
Click to expand...

So if you manually pull back on the charging handle, it will pick up a round off the top of the magazine and chamber it?

It just won't do so after firing said round?

After you fire the last round, does the bolt stay locked to the rear?

And if the magazine is not being squeezed from the sides by the brand new stock, then it must be some kind of short stroke problem it could be any of the following:

The stripping lug on the bolt might be out of whack
Loose gas plug
The op rod is being pinched or hindered somewhere (unlikely)

Is your gas piston clean and dry? Soak that ####er in solvent and take the brass brush to it.
 
I started having this same problem recently with a couple of my mags. The sides of my mag well in my Boyds stock are tight and rub on the side of the mags. Not enought that I can't get them in, but might be enough contact to pinch em. I don't see an issue with sanding back some of the wood inside the well, going slow of course.

I also think my mags might be dirty inside and keep meaning to open them up for a cleaning. Any chance yours are too?

Any chance you are shooting the CanAmmo Norinco steel cased ammo? Might be in my head :sok2 but I swear it does not feed as well as brass cased!
 
I am having the same feeding issues with the CanAm ammo as well ...It will eject fine, but won't chamber another round, the bolt just passes on over the next round , just when I use it in my Polytech with the Archangel stock ...., The same mags and Ammo when used in my Norinco shorty with USGI stock will work fine.
 
Yep I am using the Canam Norc steel cased... But odd that it does feed fine from ONE of my mags.

The bolt DOES stay locked back after last round is fired. I took out the piston and gave her a clean and it didn't seem very dirty at all.

The mags are clean too I did take em apart as well.

I think I'll try sanding back a bit of the magwell in the stock. I'm out for the weekend but hopefully we'll get to it next week and I'll test and post results.
 
Knyte said:
Yep I am using the Canam Norc steel cased... But odd that it does feed fine from ONE of my mags.

The bolt DOES stay locked back after last round is fired. I took out the piston and gave her a clean and it didn't seem very dirty at all.

The mags are clean too I did take em apart as well.

I think I'll try sanding back a bit of the magwell in the stock. I'm out for the weekend but hopefully we'll get to it next week and I'll test and post results.
Click to expand...

Aye,

Like I said, I'm no gunsmith but if all those other things have been checked then it very well could be the same issue I had with the stock being too tight at first and squeezing the sides.

You can try sanding or just give it a couple hard smacks side to side while the mag is inserted. Handle it rough a couple times and it might actually clear itself.

This is what happened in my case when I put my Boyds stock on.

Keep me posted. Could be a good sticky for future members going this route with their M14's in the future.
 
I had some problems like this with Norc ammo. I assumed that it was because I had just got my gun chopped and it therefore had less gas pressure. Quality ammo never short stroked.

Before you do any sanding - are you sure it isn't just an ammo issue, or not enough lube? Also, try it in the old stock with the mags in question.

Also, are your gas ports lined up. Remove the piston and see if you can drop a small nail or toothpick right through the gas cylinder into the barrel. Might want to dermal off the sharp tip of the nail first.
 
Alright, finally got a chance to test her a bit. Gas ports are all good and it was lubed/greased well.

I gave the magwell a sand and refitted the stock liner, and it fit much better. The mags didn't 'stick' like before so either way I'm happy I did that.

Didn't seem to make a difference, however one of the rear tabs from the malfunctioning 5/20 mags came right off, so I'm thinking it is simply a mag quality issue as the one 5/20 mag still functions great.

Next question, how do you determine the make of the mag there are no markings... The 5/20 mag that DOES work is not riveted it just has a really long spring guide 'plate' that prevents it from going down past 5 rounds, is that specific to a brand of mag?
 
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