Ammo... Will there be a "price correction"???

Steiner said:
Johnone,

.... is there something that our members could do to persuade the gov't to be less strict about approving ammo?

- can you point us in some direction to try and lobby for even SOME changes?
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This is an excellent question.
We all #####. But to the wrong people.
Can Johnone/CanAM post contact info of who/where we can write letters too?

And maybe say what needs to be fixed....so we can complain about the right things :)

Doesn't hurt to fire off a few letters.:p
 
I can tell you first hand that ERD NRCAN is the most restrictive bureaucracy in Canada. The Finns gave up on trying to have some new Lapua products approved. LAPUA! They won't approve SK Magazine, previously imported as Standard Club. Same product!
We need a Conservative majority and serious lobbying to deal with them.

Regards,

Peter
 
johnone said:
My My here we go again on ammo prices;

Regards
John
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I "hear" your frustration John, and I know the cost of ammo & retarded rules are out of your hands.

What the the recent cost increases in ammo has done, is put a damper on many shooters... I no longer go to the range and shoot for "the fun of it", I sight in, plink a little bit with the centerfires, pull out the 22 and plink a bunch as a cost saving measure... In fact, I've been to the range 3 times in 1.5 years!!! A HUGE drop in participation for me, range trips used to be weekly or bi weekly, and/or at least monthly, even in the winter!

It has not however, stopped me from purchasing firearms, like the M14s that I just bought from your company's final ever shipment OR the Type 97 that ordered from CanadaAmmo. Both of which I am patiently but anxiously awaiting delivery on. :dancingbanana: (The first one to arrive is my xmas present, the second is my birthday present!!! I LOVE HUNTRESS!!!)

Oh ya, and Huntress, my wife, also recently bought a Pink Ruger 10/22...:eek:

So, we've adapted to the current market & ammo prices, we just aren't thrilled with it...:redface:

Cheers
Jay
 
#1bcshooter said:
If S&B is approved why would they seize the ball ammo at Lever along with the tracer ?
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S&B is not approved. Listed natures produced by them are. You will likely find that tracer loads are not. Furthermore as I indicated previously, NRCAN will not approve tracer or frangible ammo for retail sale.
 
I AGREE with Can Amm,
The entire issue of getting ammo approved has the sole purpose of restricting access rather than one of safety.... Although they will tell otherwise.

A major issue is the fact the Natural Resources treat ALL ammuntion the same;
Newly manufactured ammunition and surplus.
They want very specific and detailed information that is sometimes not available or the manufacturer is hesitant to supply because of "trade secrets"
With regards to surplus ammunition the biggest hurdle one must cross is supplying the requested information to Natural Resources .
Very often the factory or even the country in question no longer exists, so how to obtain the information....??

But they get the desired results, import and sale prohibited....

While I fully understand the reasoning behind wanting the inspect and verify ammunition coming from some obscure third world factory I fail to comprehend their policy on ammunition coming from many of the world's top producers who enjoy excellent reputations.

For those who are interested, CLICK on this link for the approval request form from Natural Resources, you will understand how easily one may get frustrated....
>>>>
http://www.nrcan-rncan.gc.ca/mms/explosif/pdf/form31_e.pdf

John
 
CanAm said:
The problem is everybody and his grandmother is switching from Soviet to NATO spec. along with the US currently setting nothing in reserve and LE, you have a perfect storm. It is easing a bit, but we won't be seeing 6 cents a round for a while.
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As the US involvement in Iraq winds down, and the world economy cools, there is a small window of opportunity. Those free market producers who are currently running 100% capacity because of long term contracts may see the writting on the wall. At some point, the contracts will end, or options will not be picked up. LE contracts will eat up some of the surplus capacity.

At some point, those plants will restructure to supply the enduring civilian and LE orders, shedding staff and scaling back on raw materials contracts.

In the transition between those two modes, there is some chance of favourable terms.
 
johnone said:
My My here we go again on ammo prices;



As for the Norinco ammo, as stated previously, the Port of Vancouver will not allow ammo to be discharged. We have to ship from China to Europe and then forward to Canada. Expensive even on a good day. One should remember that Norinco 7.62x39 has increased more than 70% compared to just few years ago....

Regards
John
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John ,
Does the Prince Rupert port have the same restrictions?
 
CanAm said:
The problem is everybody and his grandmother is switching from Soviet to NATO spec. along with the US currently setting nothing in reserve and LE, you have a perfect storm. It is easing a bit, but we won't be seeing 6 cents a round for a while.
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Those days are long gone.
 
Just out of curiousity, and this maybe has been answered before, why is no one in Canada in the factory business of making surplus style ammo? Yes it does seem odd we're relying on far away obscure countries for our surplus ammo and this only creates issues when the ammo is brought in. Is it illegal? It is prohibitively too expensive? Canada has all the materials, people, and locations to make it happen. Can we not make a 7.62x39, .223, or 7.62X51 ammo right here and sell it domestically, and even "export" it as well? Is it already being done and I don't know about it? Is it because this ammo is "so cheap" from elsewhere it's worth the hassle?
 
ki11ercane said:
Just out of curiousity, and this maybe has been answered before, why is no one in Canada in the factory business of making surplus style ammo? Yes it does seem odd we're relying on far away obscure countries for our surplus ammo and this only creates issues when the ammo is brought in. Is it illegal? It is prohibitively too expensive? Canada has all the materials, people, and locations to make it happen. Can we not make a 7.62x39, .223, or 7.62X51 ammo right here and sell it domestically, and even "export" it as well? Is it already being done and I don't know about it? Is it because this ammo is "so cheap" from elsewhere it's worth the hassle?
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Not at a price we could sell it for on the civie market. It costs millions to open a modern factory.
 
When did things change...!?

I remember several years ago buying Federal XM193 (as in real M193, not the PMC stuff that's being called M193 around here) at a local store in Edmonton... It had to have been "legal" to import at that time... when did things change...?! It's not like there isn't TONS and TONS of it around on the civilan market in the states, and even with the rate of exchange it would still be less than the $499.00 we seeing for the PMC stuff (less shipping mind you... with shipping, it would be the same price)...

http://ltdammo.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=27_28&products_id=85&zenid=fef5ddec787143dc96b5311722c9cac0

Same with Winchester 7.62x51 (as in the real deal)... with a 20% rate of exchange it's $623.00 / 1000... I paid $675 for 1260 rounds of SA 1981 surplus 7.62... it's good ammo, but I'd rather have the Winchester made in 2008...!!!

http://ltdammo.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=78&zenid=fef5ddec787143dc96b5311722c9cac0

What about Privi Partisan...?!?! Are they on Dr. Watson's list...!? (for real...! Dr. Watson is the man at ERD... oh boy :rolleyes:) Guys in the states seem to love the Privi stuff...

When did all of this change (for the worse)...?!?
 
Canuck223 said:
.... Those free market producers who are currently running 100% capacity because of long term contracts may see the writting on the wall. At some point, the contracts will end, or options will not be picked up.

At some point, those plants will restructure to supply the enduring civilian and LE orders, shedding staff and scaling back on raw materials contracts.
......
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These plants are running at 100% because of the Government contracts - most likely getting way more than any civilian would pay- they will not be able to produce such quantities for the civilian market which wants the cheapest price.
Once these companies stop getting the big money from the gov. they will cut production to control supply....and keep prices high.
 
KI11ERCANE;
Can AMM explained it fully, having been involved in a couple of factory set ups off shore I can assure you that the costs are way up there.

Typical set up time is 18-24 months.... With serious investment "up front"

Would I set up a factory in Canada aimed at the Canadian market only ? No way, simply not a sound venture. The civilian market is too small in Canada.
John
 
Prvi is permitted to be imported. I have dealt with them for years, we have supplied several of our foreign accounts (Military) with their high quality munitions.

Remember that since the break up of the former Yugoslavia the various "new countries" are joining or are about to join the EU, and their pricing certainly reflects that fact....

I can supply anyone who wants PP ammo with very little delay (they too are making Nato ammo) minimum container load of each caliber.

Regards
John
 
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